By the looks and sounds in the aftermath of the Indy debacle, one might think we had suffered another 9/11. To put things in perspective... Yes, the race sucked. It was a "perfect storm" whipped up by egos and dumb rules. But...I bet that most of those that went to Indy had an otherwise fabulous time. The sights, the sounds, the food. It reminds me of a time when I went to watch Nebraska at the Rose Bowl for the BCS national championship in 2002 (or 03?). The trip was a blast, but Nebraska barely even showed up for the game. I was ticked off. But, like racing, FOOTBALL IS FUN AND GAMES. The outcomes have no bearing on my life, either way. Formula 1 will live to fight another day, at another place. Life goes on. Like John Houseman used to say: "Will the world end tomorrow? Probably not."
The people that travelled a huge distance to see the race i'm sure do not share your view. Some people went to actually see the race, not to party. the only grip they'll wanna get is around Bernie's neck
If you were such a die hard race fan and went just to watch the race...stay home next time and watch it on TV. Going to the event is all about the total experience. Are you going to be pissed next time you pay $1500 a seat to watch a fight and your guy knocks the opposition out in the 2nd round? Yeah you're pissed, but you still have the experience to talk about for a lifetime. Just my .02
While the atmosphere is a big part of it the fans still got screwed in the end. A diehard race fan would go to the race and watch the replay later, so you can see what really happened. If you had spent as much money as some people did to get there and see the race and get jerked in the end, you'd be upset too. It maybe just a car race but many people plan vacations around it, were first timers, etc. In the end there is nothing like being there and people got cheated of that.
I do recognize that these fans got their great hopes dashed. If it happened to me I would probably be turned off as well because not only is the great spectacle of racing taken away, their monetary investment (like F1 is not over priced,) returned only a half hearted effort. To be honest, I would never really care for F1 and even going to Indi would bring back bad memories. But come on, does Bernie really care? If I were in his shoes I wouldn't. He climbs on his private jet, talks to his banker about his billions, and then as he decides which multi million dollar classic car he wanted to drive his pretty and famous wife around in is there any thought on what American fans think in him? Would it be, umm, err,' AHMURiKan mad?' I thought the last USGP and its dwindling attendance had Bernie second guessing long term. The whole situation is not fair and its just annoying and ugly. But any serious thing to Bernie is like having fear of Bush serving jail time for Pat Tillman's friendly fire death. RocketBoy
So if someone travels thousands of miles to see the Rolling Stones, and then Charlie Watts comes out and does a drum solo while the rest of the boys sit backstage, that's OK too? It's just a concert.....
Code: /"\ |\./| | | | | |>~<| | | /'\| |/'\.. /~\| | | | \ | =[@]= | | \ | | | | | \ | ~ ~ ~ ~ |` ) | / \ / \ / \ _____ / |--//''`\--| | (( +==)) | |--\_|_//--| With all due respect, Michelin, the FIA, and the teams screwed me out of time, money, and a weekend that I had genuinely looked forward to. I have an absolute right to be pissed at them, and will continue to express that feeling.
Michelin and the teams screwed you. The FIA only did what they are supposed to do and upheld documented rules.
While that may be so, it was up to the FIA and ultimately Bernie to find a solution, not to just threaten people and try to force them to race. A compromise could have been reached but the FIA would have none of it from what i heard. For whatever reason Michelin thought thier tires were unsafe and they didn't let their teams race with them. If the race would have went on and someone would have gotten killed would that have been better? I'm not condoning what they did but it was up to the FIA to get it workable. this has been a dictatorship for far too long..................
If you don't like it, become a Jeff Gordon fan. If you're flight is delayed due to repairs, are you going to call up American Airline's CEO and tell him to personally put you on a working plane in under 3 hours? Come on Racer, don't let your anger take over the big picture. I do not remember in such sports (apart from roid days with the MLB) SOP changing overnight let alone in a few hours. Bernie got his money for giving them the race anyway, why should he flip on what is written in stone? I'm in Chicago, home of the always 'this is our year' Cubs and Sox. Am I writing the Chicago Tribune ( Cubs owner and one of the most wealthy media corporations in the nation, ) letters that I am threatening to not go to Wrigley? No, I just don't watch. We should have had a winner years ago. There are set lines, Minardi is the best example of not tossing in the towwel and saying oh well, can't compete. Ferrari in the 90s? Husker is right, this is just a race. But I do think Tillman and all the others who spent a lot of money on this soap opera deserve sympathy. If there is any good change in this it will be that F1 moves out of Indi. There was talk of a race in the streets of NYC. That would be stellar, a true US rival to Monaco. Possible? I guess we'll have to wait. But if you think the beer can chucks at Indi were nuts, wait till you see the pit changes in the Big Apple. Those quick guys in red were not from Maranello but were reject Guardian Angels stealing Rubino's dubs! RocketBoy
I'm actually not even angry. I didn't go or spend any money to do so. I really feel for the people that did though. The rules are not written in stone as we can see from them changing from year to year. My whole point is regardless of what the issue was, the FIA did nothing really to help the situation. They just said screw you, get in your car and race. I feel that Bernie didn't think they'd ever not race and he got caught with his pants down. As the Supreme Ruler of the FIA the buck stops with him. Bernie got paid for something that he did not make happen.That was his failure. A street race in NYC would be awesome but i don't think it would ever happen. Also i don't know if there is a road smooth enough to have a decent race. I drive into the city every night for work and some of those bumps rattle my teeth, lol.
F1 IS FAR FROM JUST A CAR RACE. As mentioned, to some people, this was a whole packaged experience. The travel to get there, the lodging, the enthusiatic crowd, and of course the entertainment (the race). F1 is an entertainment business whose core is motorsports. The way they handled the problem was far from business like. F1 is not just to race cars. F1 makes its money from its fans, sponsors, and the media that broadcasts their event. If F1 is just about racing, then how come so many people were cheated of their money???? If some teams want to forfeit, then do so at the expense of the team and not at the expense of the fans, sponsors and the media that broadcasts worldwide. The uncompromising position of F1 is unforgivable. They will be penalized through were it counts, the money they earn from their revenue machine. They will be sued by major companies that sponsor them by demanding reparations for unfulfilled duties of marketing. Class action lawsuit is inevitable. Bernie E and F1 will survive this financially, but they will learn their lesson from the burden of lawsuits that they will be facing.
tell you what butt nut, send me +-$2,000.00 (the total cost of my 3 day weekend) to me and I will let this statement slide. Otherwise...kiss my ass.
Rocketboy & Husker, yeah it's "just a race", but at least the Cubs go ouot and give it their all regardless, that's why you go back. the "2nd round " KO is ok because at least they both actually went out and fought. With you cavalier attitudes thats why we keep getting screwed. Minardi, Jordan go out every race even though it's highly unlikely they're going to win. The teams should have gone out and tried. I didn't go all the way to Indy just to have a nice time , I went to watch a race. If I want to have a good time I'll go 20 minutes from my house to South Beach. And as far as NASCAR , you have to give them one thing, they usually think of the fans , thats why its so popular.Do you even know what your favorite F1 driver enjoys in his leisure time, or get an autograph? Please, its come to a head and its time to demand changes for us the fans.
No, the 9/11 of racing took place at Le Mans almost exactly 50 years ago. It convinced the AAA to stop sanctioning races, cancelled much of the remaining European racing season, and persuaded the Swiss to ban motor racing entirely, a ban still in effect today!
I'll do that. And you send me $2,000 for a wasted trip to the Rose Bowl in 02, when the game was essentially over 5 minutes after the kick-off.
Thanks for making my point about teams. Jordan and Minardi do go out and do not whine they're going to protest at each race about what is the F1 SOP. Eddie couldn't handle it, where is he now? I give the Michellin teams props for making a stand, but it was their decision to fight the house. I don't understand you driver leisure statement. Really matters who you are when it comes to F1 and exposure to meeting drivers. A very well known midwest FOC personality drives his 360CS with MS himself. Do I care? Well its neat but it doesn't have any impact on my decision to watch or attend a race. Average Joe comes no where near the pitlane anymore in F1. Fox's biggest PR ploy when it comes to drivers is Nascar's Sexiest, cast your vote. Have you? Should I have complained to Williams about Senna in 94 that they owe me money for the blue hat I bought being out of date due to their involvement in the plot to murder the great driver? I agree with you that Nascar is beyond good when it comes to thinking of the fans, but it is an American sport. There is just a slight difference between the factory working Dad out in the farms cheering for Rusty compared to the shipping mogul from Nice. I don't think Max stays up at night thinking about how Bobby Joe from KC views the tobacco ads on McLaren. They could care less. FIA, they can afford not to care so complaining on Fchat is not going to help. As for the Cubs going out? My God man, where have you been? The most beloved broadcaster next to Harry himself was axed due to the whiney attitude of the GM and team falling apart. Sosa and the radio, or his sneezes? Wood and the DL? As of you being in the sanctuary and protector of Steve Bartman I thought you would know better. If Shaq was hurting, do you think the Heat owners owe the playoff ticket buyers some money back? RocketBoy
I'm sure the people who invested in Enron and lost everything would feel the same way if I told them: "...its only money, get over it" People all have differing levels of passion and react differently to things adversely affecting those passions. Serial Killers have no passion for their victims lives, Enron execs have no passion for other peoples money, and apparently you have no passion for F1. I personally know of people who could care less if a parent or close relative died tomorrow, but to take their lack of love and passion and extend it as an assumption to everyone I know would be heartless, extreme and ignorant. To tell people who have spent vacation time and great sums of hard earned money to watch a non-event shows a lack of understanding over the levels of passion associated with F1 racing. The blame for the debacle lies solely on the shoulders of Michelin. For the FIA to make changes to events and rules based on the lack of preparation by a manufacture, big or small, would show incredible weakness in the face of the manufacturers (i.e. blood in the water). A simple example to gain perspective lies in the thought of what if of the same thing would have happened to Bridgestone? No one would have given it a second thought, with the exception of a few poor Ferrari statements.
yes, it's a cliche, but "if you dont have anything nice to say, dont say anything at all." but then again, we have been ripping on michelin and FIA, but that's justified.
If you think for one minute that such suits would be unanswered by FIA vs Michelin and associated teams, you are truly myopic! The hardest grounds for litigation in this matter will be found in "specific performance" of the teams and Michelin. I am fairly certain, the teams have contractual obligations that require them to show up and race, to "put on the show." Michelin's failure to provide "safe" tires and then organizing the protest puts them in a vulrenable position. They did not provide "safe" tires and there must also be a clause somewhere, that would preclude them from participating in activities that could be perceived as intentionally injurious to FIA and Formula 1. Bill
Seems like many of the posters on this thread are making my point for me: There is more to life than a car race. I would hardly liken the Indy debacle to the Enron collapse. Find your nearest serviceman just home from Iraq, and ask him/her how important the screw-up at Indy really was. Sheeeeeeeez.
Two wrongs don't make a right. F1 and Michelin are both at fault. I'm not being myopic, I was focusing on the top, where the damage should be sorted out from. By centralizing blame on Michelin, F1 is being relieved from its faults. My point is F1 is the Main organizer to "put on a show." They have to react to mishaps in their show. They chose to sacrifice the people and corporations that give them money. Everyone who suffered a loss should direct all their frustrations to F1 and let F1 sort out the mess. They are the ringmaster of the show and they have to take responsibility for the mess if one of their lions go astray. Michelin will suffer dearly for being unprepared and will be sued by F1 and/or by the teams. It really doesn't matter who sues who.
