Go ahead and flame me: (Porsche Content)

For those of you that got all bothered and up in arms when I made a point earlier this year that Porsche is diluting the brand.. well they have taken it one step further and introduced a new Porsche V6 diesel Cayenne. Same engine as in the VW toureg... No performance mods.. What a joke.

Found the story on TopGear.com

 

i dont see anything wrong with that. alternative is to try and stay in business as a niche sports car maker and be taken over by big corporations. that would really dilute the brand. im hoping my next porsche is a panamera hybrid with awd.

 

I used to think like you but recently I've had second thoughts. Porsche is potentially diluting the brand but what's the purpose of a car company anyway, maintaining a brand, maximizing profits or a combination of both? The counter argument could be that by diluting the brand they can potentially erode future sales but that does not appears to be the case. I'm not fond of Porsche's alternative line up (Cayenne, Panamera) however they seem to be making good money and that's is the ultimate purpose of a company or enterprise.

A Cayenne sharing Toureg components is perfectly consistent with Porsche's strategy of increasing its stake in VW and exploitng synergies.

 

Hey, what's wrong with a 6000# Porsche with a Diesel? Or not enough rear seat room for rear facing infant seat (tried, wife wanted Turbo)? Or shared platform with VW?
Despite Q7 being far better, roomier truck.
The Cayenne is a fetid lump, used to make profits for Porsche until gas prices will hit it like Range Rovers, another "Junior League" staff car.
997 great car, glad they had money to make it. Can't wait to see the Panamerica or whatever. Just what we need, another 120-130k sedan.Hope it weighs 5k# too.

 

I see your point but I think this is especially stupid comming from a company that makes sports cars that are basically the same layout for decades, and refuses to change based on tradition and the belief that their cars are special because of that. How do diesel SUV's and bizarre sedans fit into a company ideal like that?

 

Diesels and bizarre sedans in large volumes provide the profits for silly sports cars. Without the Cayenne, Porsche wouldn't have had the money to do what they've done with the 997, we might not have small-volume masterpieces like the GT2 and GT3RS, racing program probably wouldn't include the RS Spyder. Keep in mind that diesel is now the "wave of the future" in sports car racing (a Porsche diesel-powered P1 coupe at LeMans? Not impossible), and it isn't totally ridiculous. In a perfect world, the Cayenne wouldn't exist, but this ain't a perfect world and I think Porsche made a great business decision going in that direction.

 

Porsche built tanks before they built sportscars, sportscars are really just diluting the brand...

 

Talk about sports cars diluting the brand:
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

These discussions always get pulled into justifying things for business sake. Honestly, if Porsche had come out with a high performance diesel with some new tech, I would not have brought this up. However, they took a bland V6 from VW and stuffed in the whole in their lineup. Disgusting.

 

The V6 Diesel will most likely only be sold in Europe just like the new CLS250, so what does it matter to us in the states? We won't see it, why should we care?

 

I've got no problem with it...........and I've been selling the diluted brand for 20 years now.

 

You have a point, Porsche did pick the low hanging fruit with the Cayenne, but still I say the one with an appropriate risk/reward scenario in the situation. As for justifying things for business sake, well, Porsche is a business. A pretty darn good one at that.

 

BMW has hydrogen cars. Why don't you start a thread about them?

 

I've always loved seeing the Lamborghini tractor or the LM002. Always makes me giggle. But I remember when people said the Gallardo was watered down Lamborghini or that Ferrari was making a hybrid and that was bunk. Why? I love the Gallardo and I don't feel its watered down. It's just a different path.

In any business market there are two paths. The right path and the wrong path and you never know which path you're on until after you've taken it and can't turn back.

People can hate on a product as much as they like, but if it works then it works and all the naysayers be damned because critics don't get paid on how successful something sells or how it makes the brand look universally. They only know it from their limited mindset.

It's like saying your cable television shouldn't have country channels because it makes people turn off the television. Of course it doesn't. Do I like country channels? No, I just don't use that channel.

Same goes for Porsche. I love their performance cars and thats all I buy. I could say I don't like some of their choices, but I don't have to live with those choices. I only have to live with their choices that I like and I'm very happy with those.

Now if Porsche makes a GT that is absolute junk, then you're going to hear me change my song.

 

That puppy is a LOT prettier (ain't no 8N thought) and weighs 4000# less than the Cayenne. Remind me, which is the "sport" part, and which is the "ute" part?
Here's a brand that disappeared, but had great looking product
Image Unavailable, Please Login

 

In Europe you will see lots of <2 litre BMWs and MBs etc. Ultimate driving machines with 1.8 litre motors ?
They are just responding to the market and I here theres a big fuss over oil
Same with Porsche.
I would never buy a Cayenne anyhow but they seem to be selling OK without my critical business.

 

You obviously have not travelled to Europe if you dont understand the sheer purpose of this vehicle...

What did you want, Porsche to stick with the S and Turbo only? Those sales have diminished in big ways since they were launched, and due to fuel prices this is a smart move by Porsche, since the Cayenne is already out and established as Porsche's SAV.

The X5 has a 3 litre diesel as well, sharing that motor with the 3 series.... any problem with that? No, because people will still buy it, and even more will begin to consider it just because of the improved fuel efficiency.

Porsche are money makers, producing the best sports car on the planet (911 due to its versatility and affordablilty.)
Them making the Cayenne was just to increase profit margins, which it respectively did, didnt it...... Like BMW, they can put their badge on anything and sell it... I personally think Bmw have deluted their brand by designing such ugly cars, compared to the handsome perfected designs they had just a few yrs ago... (E39, E46, E38) ... The only perfected design bmw currently have is the M3's coupe and the X5 SAV... everything else looks terribly Japanese.

 

I noticed that as well. Also, while Americans tend to see Mercedes/BMW/Porsche as prestige marques, the Europeans don't seem to have that kind of adulation for them. In fact I spent some time in Amsterdam and nearly every cab I was in was a Merc E-Class. Also lots of little Audi A3 hatches. A Cayenne diesel in that context isn't shocking. Unless it was cheap, however, it probably wouldn't be a good match with Porsche's product strategy here in the States.

I would never buy a Cayenne either, FWIW. I hope that the surge in fuel prices will aid Boxster/Cayman sales and put the Cayenne out to pasture.

 

So . . . what's news about a Porsche with a VW engine? I thought they'd been doing that for decades . . .


I guess the kids who grew up with 911 Turbo posters on their bedroom walls have a harsh awakening as they begin to learn that Porsche doesn't (and never did) make just 911 Turbos . . .

 

I guess everybody knows that I am still hanging on to a near-100K mile 993 Targa. Not yet planning at all to go the 997 route.

For someone like myself, who has driven a 911 for almost 40 years now (first one was 1969 911T Targa), a lot of the special part of having a Porsche died with the first range of front-engine cars.

Especially when they announced to the world that the old-fashioned 911 cars were obsolete, that their customers really really wanted 928s or 944s, and that they were confident that they knew best.

 

The 944's where cool cars, but they got overpriced fast. I'm very glad when top level management changed he erased the date to ever phase out the 911.

 

True, but they did it anyway in 1998, IMHO.

 

I sitll have my 993 Turbo since '96 . . . My first 911 was a '73 targa and I agree with you about the special bit of driving/owning a Pcar. The German magic has somewhat dissappeared, but one thing I will say is that this is not the case with the 997 GT2 (which very few people would pay the price for.) I personally think, this gt2 is the best 911 Porsche has built for the road. Before taking delivery of mine, I test drove a few 997 S cars and a GT3 . . . The S did not feel much different from my previous 996 C4.... Only real differences are the interior and the comfort both being improved. The 997 is a good looking car, but grows to be very plain-looking, and despite it trying to mock the 993 finesse, it just doesnt seem to do it. My 993 T still looks like an amazing sports car, standing next to any 996/997 . . . The aircooled feature is quite attractive as well, but not as efficient as the water-cooled new cars. The GT3 was fun but I wouldnt even bother buying one brand new . . . They just dont intrige as they used to . (a 993 RS would be worth buy brand new back in '96/'97, and a GT3 of today, is hardly worth it if you are coming from a 993.)

I didnt even bother test driving the 997T just because I was not introduced to a "new" experience with the S and GT3 (although the GT3 was much more entertaining.) In any case, I was offered a ride in a GT2 (had to fly out of state to visit the car) and that one is the only new Pcar to remind me of Porsche motorsport whilst at the same time being slightly more refined than the useless 996 GT2.

If you do plan to switch from your targa, I'd look into a 993 Turbo ('98 model, if possible). The 997s have a good power increase from the 993,(and also handle with more confidence) but those cars imo, were built to be as practical as possible, thus the little magic you get for the first 2-3 weeks of ownership dies rapidly shortly thereafter.

 

Image Unavailable, Please Login