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488 GPF exhaust solutions for Pista

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Soup Nazi, Sep 17, 2019.

  1. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    May 21, 2006
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    :)

    Here's a video to check out. I've personally driven behind this car, while it was in Monterey during car week. It's by far the best sounding 488 GTB that I've ever heard.

     
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  3. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Nov 25, 2012
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    I wan to bring up the original post. What is it that you don’t like about the Pista sound? I was at a coffee and cars today and had a chance to see a fellow fchatters car- a Pista Spider. He turned it on and frankly it sounded amazing! I’ve been hearing so much about the poor sound of the Pista that I asked him if he had an exhaust.

    Nope- purely stock. And again- it sounded great.
     
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  4. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie

    Jun 10, 2016
    3,685
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    Maybe you're just misinterpreting some of the concerns. Pista sounds (reasonably) convincing but not all the time. I guess that's why some owners are now questioning the sound because fact is there are times during off throttle and when not sitting on idle that it just sounds far too tame for what it is. That is why some of us are now questioning and are now looking to explore options in a bid to restore what (some of us think) really should be there all the time.
     
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  5. ttforcefed

    ttforcefed F1 World Champ
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    i heard my buddies pista last week - i thought it sounded good enough - a novitec cld certainly liven it up....
     
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  6. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Fair enough. I heard it during start up and it sounded just fine to me. In fact sounded very good.
     
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  8. bisel

    bisel Formula 3

    Sep 12, 2012
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    Steve Bisel
    I have been working with Shadowfax on the Forza controller prototype for the Pista. The installation in his Pista is complete and he has indicated that he will be driving his a car on some extended runs to verify all is well with the Forza prototype. By the way ... a big shout out to Shadowfax for testing this prototype!

    Shadowfax relayed to me some comments from the technicians that performed the installation and I plan on talking to them on Monday morning. Here are some points that are worth considering:
    • The silencers on the Pista have less sound attenuation than the silencers on the 488 GTB. The maximum sound level for both cars is probably about the same, but due to less attenuation on the Pista, there is less difference on the Pista between valves closed and valves open.

    • With valves open, Shadowfax reports he hears pops and gurgles on throttle lift off. For most of us, that is something we enjoy hearing. Leaving the Pista stock, the ECU closes the valves on throttle lift off so one does not hear those pops and gurgles.

    • You can inexpensively and easily disconnect and plug the vacuum lines at the exhaust bypass valve actuators. This is will leave the bypass valves always open. It is possible, that you may lose a very small bit of performance doing this as the Pista's ECU tune is optimized for opening or closing the valves according to various threshold points. But, there is no indication that disconnecting the vacuum lines will cause any harm or result in any error codes.

    • The use of an exhaust controller will allow you to force the valves open at all times yet easily toggle back to ECU control.
    I will be finalizing things on my end and likely making some minor changes to the controller kit for the Pista based on what I learn from my conversation with the technicians that performed the install on Shadowfax's Pista. I hope to be able to announce my findings in a week or so.

    Regards,

    Steve
     
  9. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie

    Jun 10, 2016
    3,685
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    Thanks Steve for chiming in and a big thanks to you as well for going to the trouble and effort to find a solution for the current problem!

    I'm sure once the few wrinkles are ironed out (with regard to the suggested changes to the kit), the kit will most certainly represent a very worthwhile addition to the Pista with and/or without an aftermarket system IMO.

    Knowing there is a synergy between the valves and waste-gates - which has been designed by the engineers to create optimum performance for the engine - I would personally be reluctant to permanently remove that by taking the easy route and just disconnecting the valves for the sake of adding a bit more sound. It's nice knowing the system can be returned to stock at the push of a button for those times when the hammer drops.
     
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  10. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie

    Jun 10, 2016
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    #83 Shadowfax, Sep 21, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
    I was of the same mind after first hearing Pista running outside on idle but after owning and driving you soon come to realize that during certain times and situations things aren't quite good enough in the sound dept which by rights could be and should be better. You will get to know what I mean once you drive yours - i'd be surprised if you don't.

    Now it sounds even better/complete, having control over the valves, as during normal driving it's just nice to know there is actually an engine behind you. On throttle lift off to slow down/stop you also now have some level of gurgling going on whereas previously there was nothing, so these small things all adds to the aural experience we have come to expect.

    Often it's just the little things that can make the real differences rather than pursuing all out changes by trying to address the issue on a grander scale, which then sometimes leads to other compromises.
     
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  11. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Nov 25, 2012
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    #84 SoCal to az, Sep 22, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2019
    I’m looking forward to getting my car but I’m not that judge mental on sound. I think the 458 sounds great, the 488 sounded great, the Pista sounded great. I have zero intentions of doing anything aftermarket on the car. None.

    Regardless- I think (hope) I’m about 45 days out. Maybe a bit longer before I get the car. Will look coward to the ride.
     
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  13. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
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    I went for ~60 mile round trip drive today, windows down and getting on it a bit. The sound is good not great nor will it ever be unless some serious mods.
     
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  14. 458-Italia

    458-Italia Formula 3

    Jan 10, 2014
    1,726
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    After 3000 km, I can say that the Pista is an excellent sports car but the sound is the weak point. Thanks to Shadowfax and Bisel for their contribution to finding a lasting solution
     
  15. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax F1 Rookie

    Jun 10, 2016
    3,685
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    Thanks 458 Italia....and agree Pitsa's sound is not what I was expecting particularly off throttle. Steve (Forza) has provided a great solution to control the valves so the off throttle sound is improved as best as possible with the current system.

    Both the techs - who also said they were surprised with Pista's sound being how it is - and the exhaust vendor who I made enquiry with said the biggest gain in volume would be realized only once the cats are changed for high flow as the stock muffler has very little attenuation - much less than GTB.

    I'm going to put a few more Km's on the car now and then make a decision whether to change the system.
     
  16. Tubi Sales

    Tubi Sales Karting

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  17. bisel

    bisel Formula 3

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    As straight pipe exhaust, is that with stock cats or with high-flow cats? And, I assume this is not a valved exhaust. Is Tubi going to offer a valved exhaust?

    Steve
     
  18. Solid State

    Solid State F1 Veteran
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    IMO the modern tubos have an awful delayed spinning whine that sounds annoying and unnatural. Freeing up the exhaust usually makes it sound more prevalent.
     
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  19. Tubi Sales

    Tubi Sales Karting

    Jul 5, 2019
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    They are still going over details on what exactly they plan to launch and offer. I'll have more information as it becomes readily available.
     
  20. sellerwin

    sellerwin Rookie

    Dec 1, 2015
    1
    Hello, how to plug in the vacuum lines properly without any potential issues? Thank you!
    I'm considering replace the cat with Novitec sport cat and rear pipe
     
  21. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    My dealer did the plugging for me. Not sure what they took apart in the back to do it but once they have access its pretty simple. Your dealer will know how to do it or any competent mechanic with tools should be able to do it easily. You just have to plug them. No need to reset any sensors etc.

    As far as the cats I think thats the primary route to take if you want increased volume. The stock exhaust is already pretty straight through with valves open so not sure changing the back box alone will change things too dramatically.
     
  22. Condor Man

    Condor Man F1 Rookie

    Sep 8, 2006
    2,838
    Los Angeles
    I just went through this older post.

    It was actually quite funny at the start and then we got into the noise.

    It seems as though most agree the sound of the Pista was surprisingly quieter than the 488GTB.

    I think I am going to explore some high flow cats as the next step, no exhaust change just the cats.

    Has anyone in here done this??


    May the Horse be with you
     
  23. Tubi Sales

    Tubi Sales Karting

    Jul 5, 2019
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    Hey Condor Man:

    If we can be of any assistance, please feel free to reach out.

    Tom
     
  24. Condor Man

    Condor Man F1 Rookie

    Sep 8, 2006
    2,838
    Los Angeles
    Thanks Tom

    I went for a drive today and she is starting to get louder.

    I will let you know if I want something louder.


    May the Horse be with you
     
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  25. Tubi Sales

    Tubi Sales Karting

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    Viva Ferrari!
     
  26. SECRET

    SECRET Formula Junior
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    May 19, 2007
    699
    California
    Yes. I have only Kline 200 Cell Inconel Cats with OEM exhaust after an expensive journey.

    My journey taught me a few things:

    • Novitec’s rear exhaust with flap regulation is a safety/burn hazard — at least the Inconel one I bought from a sponsor here. Let’s say neither them or Novitec helped me resolve the issue, and it cost me a lot. Serious lack of engineering, no support, and overpriced. ($13k USD for these useless tubes that ended up sounding quieter than OEM btw)

    • Akrapovic’s 200 Cell cats require special fittings to go with the OEM muffler -- this was not something they made clear, nor did the reseller in the US know this. They were designed for OEM Fit on the inlet side but the outlet side is designed primarily to fit their Akrapovic rear section — I am selling this for a steal if anyone wants it

    • Kline 200 Cell Inconel cats are very very well built, they have an incredible support team, and fits like a glove. Highly recommended! I bought from Kline directly rather than through the same forum sponsor that did not help me.

    • Brooke Race is super high quality as well. I got their system for my Lusso and it’s a dream. Considering doing a custom rear section with them for the Pista. The owner, Eddy Brooke, is highly engaged and really cares about the outcomes of his product. Highly recommended
     
  27. Gh21631

    Gh21631 F1 Veteran
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    Feb 24, 2011
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    My new in the box Kline system for the Pista is still for sale in the classifieds. 200 cell cats and exhaust. Big discount offered as I sold my Pista.
     
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  28. junc

    junc Formula Junior
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    Thank you for the information. Novitec's rear box in inconel is a fire hazard? That doesnt sound good. I have a buddy who is not on Fchat who is looking at putting it on his Pista. Would you mind giving me some details? PM me please if you would rather do that vs on here.
     
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