Great example of why I do my own service !!!!! | FerrariChat

Great example of why I do my own service !!!!!

Discussion in '348/355' started by Skippr1999, Oct 19, 2015.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    I've been doing fluid changes for years.

    Today I started the annual service on my 355 I purchased at the beginning of the year from a reputable dealer who had used a reputable independent shop for a major service last November,

    When I pulled the gear box plug, extremely black gear oil flowed out. I almost didn't do it because I've only driven 500 miles since this, supposed, quality major service was performed. Thank God I'm anal and pulled it anyway !!!! This gear oil hadn't been changed in many years! I have a receipt saying it was changed !! Someone paid for a gear oil change !!!!

    I have six "toy cars" that I service each year. When I pull gear box oil each year after driving less than 1,000 miles, it looks NEW and the light shines through it!!

    This is piss poor service and some folks should be truly embarrassed. Total Bull S#%}t !
     
  2. taz355

    taz355 F1 Veteran
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Feb 18, 2008
    6,040
    Indio Ca/ Alberta
    Full Name:
    Grant
    You tellem skipp. Same reason i do mine. I dont always blame the owners of the shops either they sometimes do not know. You should let them know at least.

    Be nice. Rubb your ears and say woooosaaaa. Like in bad boys movie.
     
  3. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Three years ago I also pulled the gear box screen filter off my Challenge Stradale after purchasing the car.

    The car had seen nothing but dealer service. Guess what.....didn't look like it had ever been pulled and cleaned. These are high performance cars that need this stuff done !!
     
  4. sburke

    sburke Formula 3

    Dec 21, 2010
    1,273
    Lake Norman, NC
    I hate having to bring my cars in when I don't have time to do it myself.
     
  5. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner Professional Ferrari Technician

    Dec 29, 2006
    18,221
    Twin Cities
    Full Name:
    Tim Keseluk
    The underpanel and bumper has to come off to do a proper service and get to the gearbox screen. I've seen "dealer serviced" cars where that time-consuming step had apparently been skipped. Don't be fooled into thinking that a million $ building with a big sign guarantees that someone knows what they're doing.

    Ferrari also neglected to include a change interval for coolant so it's possible that it's ancient (and corrosive) as well. I recommend annual coolant and gearbox oil changes, especially after seeing what happens when the heat exchanger (common to 355 & 360 models) fails.
     
  6. phrogs

    phrogs F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 13, 2004
    7,353
    Kzoo Michigan

    Was it filled with silicone. Mine was when I pulled it.
     
  7. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

    Apr 29, 2004
    37,274
    Cowboy Capitol of the World
    Full Name:
    Brian Crall
    You said it was contracted out by a dealer to another business for the service?

    That is very common and reflects far more on the seller than the service facility. They want the cheapest possible job so as not to cut into the profit and typically misrepresent the actual service done. Micromanagement of every step is the norm and cheap, cheap, cheap are the guiding principals. That is why I do not and will not have a business relationship with a car dealer. It is also why I suggest strongly not to get servicing built into a purchase deal.
     
  8. Todd308TR

    Todd308TR F1 World Champ

    Nov 25, 2010
    11,074
    LA
    Full Name:
    Todd
    You should tell us who the dealer is. You change gear oil every year no matter the miles?
     
  9. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jun 11, 2004
    11,272
    CT
    Full Name:
    John Kreskovsky
    Seems strange to me that the gear oil was black. I've never encountered that in a trans or rear end. I've been told that black gear oil indicates engine oil (or other contaminate?) getting into the gear box. Can that happen on a 348/355? I know it can on a 3x8 when the shift shaft seal between engine sump and gear box fails.
     
  10. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    It was just dirty. I've seen it before in other cars.
     
  11. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    I do. I'm not looking to give anybody a bad name, just letting folks know why it's important to be very vigilant.
     
  12. Markphd

    Markphd Formula Junior

    Mar 10, 2012
    713
    Not really.... I suppose anything is possible, but I wouldn't believe it.
     
  13. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Just drained block and radiators as well as engine oil. At least coolant and oil looked clean.
    I guess you HAVE to do those when the engine comes out !
     
  14. LmnsBlu355

    LmnsBlu355 Formula Junior

    Dec 28, 2009
    284
    NY
    Full Name:
    Jordan S.
    Engine oil can certainly get into the gearbox. I had a rear main seal failure and no oil leak. Engine oil went low, trans overfilled and leaking from vent. My indy put dye in engine oil after changing both and dye showed up in trans. Rear seal was bad.
     
  15. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Good to know. Thanks for the comment. The engine oil still looked relatively clean. I'm going to flush the gear box and then do it again after a couple hundred miles to see if it comes out clean as I suspect it will.
     
  16. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jun 11, 2004
    11,272
    CT
    Full Name:
    John Kreskovsky
    That was what I was thinking for a 355, but wasn't sure. From my experience if the trans oil was black when drained I would suspect such a leak.
     
  17. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Engine oil level has been fine, so in my case I think the gear oil was simply dark from neglect. I witnessed the same when changing the gear oil in my 930T upon purchase. Some owners and dealers simply don't do what's required. End of this story.
     
  18. phrogs

    phrogs F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Apr 13, 2004
    7,353
    Kzoo Michigan
    Id love to see a photo of the oil just to see how bad it was.

    Could it be contaminated? Sure but as said earlier someone with a rear main leak can leak into the gear box, the gear box only has a big oring to seal that huge hole in the trans, It will catch oil with no problem in that situation.

    There is no secret that plenty of business with cars are more than happy to charge you for a service IE service records yet nothing was ever done!

    One reason I don't put to much trust in service records they can be pencil whipped as I like to call it.
     
  19. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Didn't take a picture, but if the engine oil had leaked into the gear box, it should have been all the same color. It was not.
     
  20. GRM

    GRM Rookie

    Jul 28, 2010
    24
    Greenville, SC
    Full Name:
    Gary
    I just drained the diff fluid on my wife's 130k mile X5 and it looked like golden honey still. Almost same results from the ZF 5 speed transmission in my M3 with 150k miles. I've never encountered a gearbox or diff with truly "dirty" looking fluids before and I've had many vehicles and most of them between 100k-300k where there is more wear present.

    Combustion in an ICE causes the dirty oil look, otherwise engine oil would visually look the same after a full cycle. Not discrediting or anything, but that just sounds off.
     
  21. johnk...

    johnk... F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jun 11, 2004
    11,272
    CT
    Full Name:
    John Kreskovsky
    +1, exactly my experiences with 50 years of motoring.
     
  22. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    Finished the annual fluid changes, went for a drive and she performed flawlessly.
     
  23. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    It's not about how many miles your car has, it's about the frequency of the changes. All mine get changed annually and they look golden too. I've certainly seen personal vehicles that had very dark gear oil when I bought them because others had not changed the fluid. After that the car had clean looking fluid every year thereafter because I changed it annually. I expect this will be the same.

    You'd be surprised how little care cars get from non car guys. I've had Porsches, Alfas, and now this Ferrari that have had dirty gear oil because nobody changed it for years !!!

    In fact, 80s Porsche 911s had a 60,000 mile gear oil change interval. Maybe would get changed every 6 years !

    It's really only Ferrari owners that over service there cars.
     
  24. Skippr1999

    Skippr1999 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 22, 2009
    4,524
    I was able to re-flush the gear box today after driving the car about 300 miles in the last couple months. The fluid came out totally clean.

    My initial thoughts were correct. The black gear oil that came out two months ago was simply very old and the shop that did the major last year failed to change the gear oil. I'm very glad that I decided to flush the box even though it should not have really needed it this year. You never know what you're going to find after someone else "services" your car.

    Very glad there was not a rear main seal failure, just poor work ethic.
     
  25. cf355

    cf355 F1 Rookie

    Feb 28, 2005
    4,208
    Full Name:
    chris
    its a shame but the moral of this story is to do the service yourself if your able.
     

Share This Page