Hi Tifosi I've been lurking for a while but haven't posted... Got lots of useful information here I've been a fan of Italian metal for a long time, I've an Alfa spider and GT Junior I was thinking of getting a prancing horse and this one reared it's head http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=471737 http://www.dino-gt4-registry.com/08654.htm Last cam-belt change 2005 - has a documented history Any opinions or advice?? This would be a highly illogical acquisition - not enough space for cars as it is... (capall ag léim means prancing horse btw - or jumping horse in Irish)
It seems reasonable and well priced. The colour combo is not doing it any favours, but that could be an opportunity to bag a bargain? So much will depend on it's mechanical condition, so get someone who knows what they're doing to inspect it first.
I guess the sterling exchange rate makes it look even better priced at the moment... $24500 or £12200 and negotiable There's a limited market for classics in Ireland, and obviously even smaller for Ferrari's. If you have something to sell you could be waiting a long time for the right buyer to come along. If he was selling in Britain he'd do better? Nearly seems like a sensible investment??? (you can notice I'm trying to convice myself that my savings are better in Ferrari's than stocks or bonds...) But not with a £1200 service and cam-belt change in the near future
To give you some perspective, I paid £8650 for my 308 GT4 back in December. It's bodywork was pretty good, and there were no major mechanical problems. Prices are very seasonal in the UK and I guess they would also be in Ireland? Your £1200 service can easily turn into a £3000 one, so mechanical condition is all important. Mostly, the engines and gearboxes are very strong. It's things like brakes, engine ancilliaries and other random bits that can catch you out. Personally, I would beat the seller down on price based on the lack of recent service and the colour combo. I think 20,000 euros should be achievable, but even then you might not be getting a bargain if there are problems.
If you've got old Alfas around you're doing your own service, right? If that's the case, then a major service as a DIY isn't that expensive. I've spent less than $500 doing a major on my car - belts, tensioners, gaskets, seals, hoses, water pump rebuild, plugs, paint, fluids, etc, etc. There is nothing on the GT4 even close to being as complicated as Alfa's SPICA system. (Did only USA get this disaster of a FI system?) If you do your own Alfa work, you can do the GT4. But what he says is true - parts prices can be absurd. Be sure it is in good condition and all the parts are there. It should look like it is in good condition. Never assume little stuff will be cheap, because everything costs AT LEAST 5x more than the Alfa parts when you buy it from Ferrari. Do check for rust. In California these cars get rust, I can only imagine what the wet Irish weather does for them. And white is growing on me. I like white.
Parts prices might not seem too bad to someone living there though. And shipping is much less than to the colonies. I would ask your questions in the UK section. Tom (tomoshea) lives in that general area, he possibly knows the car. Tom also has a very fine GT4 for sale. I speak from experience that the back seat of his car is very comfortable at speed I owned and maintained a 1969 Alfa 1750 GTV from new for 10 years. Not much different to the Ferrari from a 'work on it yourself' point of view. Gerrit http://dino308gt4.com
Thanks for all the replies guys - most helpful Good advice there Dan - and good to get an idea of prices... Sounds like you got a real bargain with your 308 I think 20k should be achievable alright - he's asking 18k!! Even with my negotiation and haggling skills I can probably do better than that (I just converted to £12.2k and $24k for the benefit of the non euroland among us...) I kind of like the white and oh so seventies red velour - although I think as It's not as desirable as the leather or half leather it should be a bargaining point - I thought all GT4s had leather or half leather?? Brian: No SPICA for me - twin Webers on the GT and twin Solex on the Spider I do service the Alfas myself, although I'd be less inclined to have a go at a Ferrari V8 - tuning two Carbs is hard enough, and the Alfas and the other Cars I've worked on (Nissan Primeras) all have timing chains - I've never changed a belt - I can imagine the "whoops did I just rotate that cam" moment followed by $$$$ (or ) Do you buy your parts in the U.S or from the U.K? The strong Sterling/Weak dollar probably makes the U.K. less attractive Gerrit: I saw Tom's car here on Fchat and advertised http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=410969 It looks like a fabulous machine - although slightly out of my price range. It's also 1979 which means not yet officially a classic in Ireland for legal purposes - so 1100 road tax instead of 42 for a car over 30.
If you can do all that you can service the GT4. Sounds like my skills fall far below yours. After much researching here I did the valve adjustment, cam seals, belts and tensioners on my 308. And, 500 miles later it's still running grand! Seamus
Easy thing to do!! Just to clarify on my mechanical expertize, I'm very much on the low end of the amateur home mechanic scale (I just mentioned the chains to show I didn't have to change belts... As far as I'm concerned chains are maintaince free until an engine re-build is required anyway....) Grease, Points, plugs, filters and timing is my lot I looked at your thread on belt changing and it looks like you've got it all under control now Seamus... Well done. Might attempt the servicing myself too - what's the worst that can happen? (ahem) (Although I'm getting ahead of myself - haven't even looked at the car yet) Might post on the U.K. section too to see if anybody knows the car.
Well, yeah, it does takes a bit of a gut check. I'd be on my back turning the crank while the missus would have the torch looking for the PM1-4 mark on the flywheel. Only when we got done did I tell her how much it might cost if we made a mistake . Seamus
Well I went to have a look at the car last week (was in Dublin on business) and here's the low down: Rusty around the edges... Lower front valance behind the front right wheel, some poor patchy paint touch ups around the car in various areas has had sills previously done by previous owner some paint flaking Doors/bonnet/boots(trunks) and vents were sound Passenger Electric window doesn't work, driver's slow, a/c not connected (no big deal in Ireland) The car arrived warmed up Oil pressure ok, gear box shifts nicely, engine sounds good - bit of a leak which I couldn't isolate (I was very stuck for time) by the right rear tyre - he said it was coolant overflow? handbrake v. weak I'd have to get a mechanic with more knowledge than me to check it out more thoroughly for me - although I don't know one in Dublin... Needs a belt change and he has the belts... First time I have driven a GT4 and it was quite nice!! 14000 or £9000??? ($19k) Any thoughts? Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
some more updated pictures here: http://www.carzone.ie/usedcars/index.cfm?fuseaction=car&carID=471737 Apparantly the lower valance at the front is fibreglass - so the split should be easy enough to fix. Don't know about the rest of the rust Should have brought a magnet!!
Depending on your willingness to tolerate cosmetic blemishes, the rust issue would be a big cause for further discount if you decide to go ahead with the purchase. That, and the fact that it needs belts, which you will most likely have to pay to have done. It *is* a Series 1 car, after all, but it has enough other stuff not going for it to warrant a price drop of a couple thousand more, in my opinion. Then again, I have no idea what the market is like in Ireland, so his price could be a bargain. I'm just thinking in terms of U.S. dollars that this is a $17,000 car at best.
Greetings Cormac, Have you seen the gorgeous '77 GT4 that Mr Iceman (AKA Scott), in the SE of England, has listed in the FerrariAds.com section? http://www.ferrarichat.com/ferrariads/showproduct.php?product=995&sort=1&cat=11&page=19 I don't know if it's still available, but it looks to be a fine machine. As has been said of Ferraris many times before, buy the best you can('t) afford! Good luck &... Cheers, Coop
Looked at the ad from Mr. Iceman, then checked his website - looks like he sold that car - looked like a good one I agree it's probably a $17k car at most in the US, although the weak dollar probably makes euro prices look dear to you at the moment. I'm going to try to get a local mechanic to check it out, and see how structural the rust is. I'm not looking for concours, just a good driver Thanks for the responses!
Keep in mind folks, that these cars have zero-rust protection from brand new and no matter what, they will rust. They're 33 year old Italian cars! Fortunately, most of them were just toys, so were not subjected to daily-driving rigors and have survived all of these years, with only minor rusting to the lower edges, bottoms of the doors and with the worst areas being the trunks. Not that bad really. If you want perfection, buy the garage queens with the Concours trophies and the 9,000mi odometers. Otherwise, this is how most of them are. One could go as far as to repair these sections and yes, it'll be expensive (nothing is cheap with a Ferrari!), but worth it if done right. Not bad considering other cars from this same era don't exist anymore (does anyone see any '70's Fiats, Toyotas, Nissans, still on the road with superficial rust? Okay, maybe in Arizona, or Nevada, but in the UK?...).
Looks like I won't be joining the ranks of Ferrari owners just yet... I've been scared off this machine - think I'll stick with the Alfa's for the time being - that's enough of a drain on the wallet!! Although I definitely like the GT4 - I'll get one at some stage... Thanks for all the helpful responses!! much appreciated
