Harris review...

+1

Can't even read the bias any more.

 

What is the basis of this bias? They are just cars. If I owned a Lusso I would still know it's cheaply made compared to the FF because I took the 3-4 hours to do the physical side by side that so far no one else here has done.

Harris is in the game, he has the "bias". Duh.

The Lusso ride is always soft, it's more quiet, and it's more cheaply made overall. The steering wheel is designed for idiots no Schumacher pedigree there ... center horn, HUGE indicators that are clunky. The mannetino is cheap feeling. Ferrari is doing this new wheel on all the cars, and it's sad news.

The exterior Lusso vs. FF is only "better" for insecure men ... nothing Italian or PF about it. Local dealer still has a new one sitting on the floor ... a year on.

The Lusso has one great feature, the turning radius ... radius of the FF is not good. Ok ... another feature ... it's new. The "bias" for the new is what you ought to be looking at. I have an opinion, not a bias.

 

But isn’t it wonderful to see the passion that Ferrari creates amongst us all.

 

As if I am defined by my cars? That would be pathetic.

I don't defend the FF 100% ... it has many faults. But it's still a Ferrari experience to drive it.

I do critique the Lusso, it's more money, and cheaper made ... a corporate cupholder from the Sweater.

 

I actually agree for the most part with this. I’ve driven the lusso. I’d take an FF everyday. If I was 60 years old I’d probably take the lusso.


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I really really didn't want to comment on this thread but I have to defend the Lusso. Honestly you really have to own this car to really be objective and give it a fair review. Now I have had the Lusso (1500km) and I owned an FF for 42000km, I drove a friends FF this weekend as we swapped cars. Me, my buddy (FF), my wife, everyone I have let drive or be driven in the Lusso says its an upgrade in a few ways. To some it may not be worth the double in price I paid (versus FF trade-in) but for me it is. Nothing is cheap about it (nada), its a stunning ride, sounds and goes like heck, the cockpit is so nice to be in, and the engine intake sound is WAY more apparent inside the cabin above 4000rpm then the FF. People comment on the wheel, I think its miles better then the FF (sorry it really is), even the road feedback is better. The entire car is an upgrade (even the way it starts up after being warm, has an amazing bark); continuing the entertainment system, passenger display, the voice commands, multiple TFT info screens, the indicators are a huge upgrade, and the wipers/high-beam is so much better. I have no idea how anyone could in anyway hate on the Lusso its bloody amazing!

 

The Lusso is to the FF exactly what the 488 is to the 458.
Except that they did not change the engine.

All cars, from all brands, from one gen to another, you can see a drop in quality finish. Take a BMW from 2005 and one from now.

The Lusso assembly quality is on par with FF. I have (had) issues in both.
The Lusso leather quality is very slightly lower than FF. Not much.
The Lusso is more comfortable, less noise in cabin (not so much less noise from engine but less noise from road). If you daily drive this car, this is something you will appreciate.
Some items (like manetino, air vents ...) feel cheap.

But EVERYTHING ELSE IS BETTER: drivetrain, lights, cabin, comfort, agility, ......

And while I originally did not find the Lusso better looking than FF, exterior design language is now "well installed" and FF definitely looks like a car from a few years ago (while remaining beautiful to my eyes).

 

What?! I'm insecure? Please tell me..how and why?

Yes. Exactly. I had an FF and put 4,000 plus miles on it. Had my Lusso since July last year and have 4,500 miles. The Lusso is a better car. Period. Forget a 3 hour side by side comparison, this is the culmination of a couple years worth of ownership.

The ONLY downside to the Lusso for me is the sound. It's pathetic compared to the FF. Of course an after market exhaust would solve that but I opted to put one on my Tdf instead. There is another potential downside to the Lusso I saw during running them at Corso Pilota on Ice. The front lip spoiler acted like a mini shovel when plowing through snow. Several of the spoilers got bent and twisted.

 

My 2 cents:
I think the GTC4 is an upgrade in every way over the FF, which I had. I don't think the material quality has taken a step backwards, I think its either the same or better.

I was really impressed with the extensive test drive I had. I've got to say, I don't think the quality is a step down at all. I think its just as good, if not overall better. And I also think given its mission of a more useable Ferrari, it really does fulfill that better than the FF.

On the other hand, I can understand how some would prefer the balance struck between sporting and refinement in the FF. But I am not among you. The FF, for me, was not sporting enough to be a rewarding drive and it was too compromised in its daily abilities to be a great daily driver. Specifically, I found the car to never settle down and the AWD system made itself known in distracting ways. And I also hated the styling. I found it to be bulky and the front end I felt was a little silly looking. I have some friends who think the GTC4 doesn't look much different- I know we all see things differently- but to my eyes, even if they are doing some of the changes with styling trickery, the overall look of the car is a big improvement. And more importantly so is the drive. This is a car that is both fun to drive and surprisingly comfortable. When I'm driving a GT car like the GTC4, I don't want a super loud exhaust. I'm glad the GTC4 is more quiet in this regard. The infotainment also makes a big leap forward with the GTC4 and I think this is important in 2018 in a car you will drive frequently.

I see it as the FF was more like a 0.9 version of the car, almost, but not quite, there. And the GTC4 is like the 1.0 version: vision fully realized. I understand we will all draw the line between GT comfort and sports car responses in slightly different places. All I can say: I was so impressed with my test drive of the GTC4, that I put the order in right away. It's really quite a package.

 

I am invested? Not at all. I have a real life. I actually get paid for my taste in the arts daily and am not defined by a car. Again, that would be pathetic.

The people who own a Lusso AND a FF in the past are equally if not more invested. They bought two cars for $325-400k, I bought one for $250 and have 16k miles on it, and 3-4 hours in the Lusso which was not at all appealing to me as a car to own at any price.

The Lusso is a corporate car with features galore ... ride is for sure always softer, slightly cheaper materials, def more quiet. The steering wheel indicators are clunky. It has one upgrade, the rear wheel makes U turns FAR better. Yet I don't like rear wheel in the car. Prefer the FFs solidity, even as it breaks away earlier ... not a track car.

The Lusso does not look like a Ferrari, as it's a boring/macho upgrade on the PF FFs looks which many cannot appreciate. So be it. Don't care at all. Enjoy your cars

 

I am passionate about the idea of Ferrari as a car company that is not corporate driven

And the company is going that way for sure, not just with the Lusso

 

Maybe when the lusso gets to $250 you will like it more.

 

Jeez, you even get your hair up when someone is paying you a compliment! Welcome back, Brian ... been quiet here without you.


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What is a ‘corporate car’? The definition I imagine brings up an Audi in my head - at the risk of offending many here, I think they are soooo boring these days. I’m almost disappointed in myself that I owned one about 15 years ago. I can’t tell the difference between them, the whole purchase and ownership experience is homogenous and they just lack personality and soul. Anyone could be driving one, doing any job, from any walk of life. They lack colour metaphorically and (usually) physically too. They remind me of the message behind the Son of Man by Magritte (suited man with an apple in front of his face), they hide everything. BMW is nearly the same.

No Ferrari has ever been anything like that. Do you have a different definition?

 

I love the 4 tail lights of the Lusso. I love my FF. I had the choice of getting a Lusso or a FF, I ordered and bought a brand new 2016 late production FF....

I have since long time given up on resale value - I use my car everyday if I like, or I just bicycle to work - does not matter to me. I enjoy my car, that simple.

Please remember that we are all individuals and we all like different things and have different taste. One likes Champagne, and another one prefers water. We can never, and should never, be the same - that kind of society would be awful when everyone is a copy of each and everyone. I like the fact that people seems to like different things and have different tast...

 

Meanwhile, back on the subject of the Lusso review from Chris Harris.

Chris mentions the size of the car (pacing from drivers seat to front wheel) , Clarkson ends his review with how the size of the car make it impractical for cities or ski resorts. Do owners find it "too big ?".
In my limited experience test driving one I didn't, I found it easier to place than my 575 and the full camera package helped too in tight spots such as car parks.

Anyway, mine will be seen on the narrow streets of London in June so if you spot a green car with paint scuffs on the corners you will know that they were right and I was wrong

 

In the US not too large or too big at all.

In Europe (FR, IT...), the long front of FF/Lusso and fact that they are Ferraris attracting lot of attention make them impractical daily drivers if you need to use public parking or street parking, as there are far fewer valets than in US.
If not, all good and not too long or large for eur roads at all.

 

Have not seen / read Clarkson’s review. If you have link to it, would be most grateful for a share of that. Many thanks.

 

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/the-clarkson-review-ferrari-gtc4lusso-s03l6qffr

Luckily I have my FIAT panda 4x4 for 90% of urban day to day use, for example driving from one end of the Lusso to the other.

 

RJ , to complete the set here is May on the T

https://www.driving.co.uk/car-reviews/james-may-review-ferrari-gtc4lusso-t/

Hammond presumably crashed his test car

 

Awesome. Many thanks.

 

I have enjoyed this debate and am buckling in for my first drive of my Ferrari FF, which I have now owned for 6 months and never driven! Being that I've never driven my FF and have never seen a Lusso in person, I can only comment on what I know so far...

I know the FF appearance appeals to me. The Lusso, yes, but not as much. The interior leather designs seem a little too modern on the Lusso. My FF has the black diamond stitched interior. I think I will hate the infotainment on the FF but probably won't care. I don't love the double lights on the Lusso or the shark vents, seems a little busy. But that is all via pictures so hard to confirm...

I like purchase salvage Ferraris and repair them and then drive them. I did a thorough posting of my Ferrari 612 rebuild a few years ago and enjoy that car regularly. I now repair Ferraris (as well as other makes) as my day job and my "second career". I am 47 and was able to retire from Corporate work (well, I chose to and was able to make it happen), and now am living the dream of working on these cars as I'd been doing since age 12. Anyway, I digressed...

My 612 saw water into the engine. Hydrolocked. I completely rebuilt the engine (and much of the rest of the interior due to its age) and have enjoyed it flawlessly for 3 years and 10K miles. My FF also saw water (fresh water). The engine was sparred (due to a little known device that only Canada and the USA require now) that sits directly below the air filter panels and fights/blocks water ingress in the case of water coming up through the intake chutes (insurance companies in USA must have demanded it and Canada followed suit). It you are interested, I can post a picture and 15 minutes on Eurospares part site will illustrate the extra part and the fact that is USA/Canada only.

SO, my FF drivetrain is fine but my car saw water into the cabin. All the leather is perfect but I've had to rebuild the seat mechanics, replace many modules in the boot and under the carpet, clean it very thoroughly, replace the starter, clean all wiring and connectors, etc.

So, now it starts and runs. Sounds beautiful. Loud, powerful. I have the sport exhaust. 7K miles on the car. I need to replace a faulty oil pressure sender (large job) and finish putting the interior back together. ONLY THEN will I FINALLY get my first drive in my FF! Bianco. Heavily optioned, perfect body, perfect. Just saw water and just needed someone to take it on and resurrect it.

So, based on what I hear about both the FF and the Lusso, they both sound incredible. The FF will be a huge step ahead of my 612 I am sure. And the Lusso is likely a "mechanical and body facelift-level" step ahead of the FF. That being said, the bond between me and my 612 and the likely bond between me and my FF (and the short list of FF pro's over the Lusso) will likely be enough for my to prefer the FF. Plus, I always prefer cars more as they age versus just buying the newest (regardless of budget).

So, a unique $.02 to throw in.

Cheers!