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488 Has any owner weighed the Pista yet?

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Dilusha, Aug 8, 2019.

  1. tekaefixe

    tekaefixe Formula Junior

    May 10, 2012
    784
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    Full Name:
    Paulo
    True but read this:

    My 458, which lets be real, shares its chassis and underpinnings with the 488/Pista is 100 pounds lighter. I weighed it at 3280 with 11 gallons of gas. And i'm sure my Italia doesn't have near the amount of carbon bodywork as the pista does. Or the advancements in tech as its 10 years older.

    Its probably the added plumming needed forthose turbos and the heat they generate.
     
  2. LVP488

    LVP488 Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2017
    2,434
    France
    Highly depends on options I guess, I would not think the turbo increases the weight since the engine is smaller. But we've seen two opposite trends with Ferrari in the recent years:
    - options that allow to reduce the quoted weight (because Ferrari says their weight is measured in the most favourable configuration), even if most people won't go for them
    - popular options that significantly increase the weight
    All in all, I tend to believe 458 / 488 / F8 have relatively similar weights, with some marginal advantage for the Pista. And probably a Pista loaded with "heavy" options could still be heavier than a more "basic" 458.
     
  3. tekaefixe

    tekaefixe Formula Junior

    May 10, 2012
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    The lightest of all 458’s is the Speciale right?!
     
  4. LVP488

    LVP488 Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2017
    2,434
    France
    Officially yes - it was quoted at 90 kg less than the Italia, funnily that's the same difference as quoted between the 488 GTB and Pista, but while the Pista is claiming to need lots of things to achieve that (carbon front and rear bumpers, carbon wheels, titanium conrods, LiIon battery...) the Speciale was just using reduced sound-insulation to get this result :D
    Whatever, all these numbers quoted by Ferrari seem to be questionable, like the Fiorano times...
     
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  5. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 Veteran
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    Nov 25, 2012
    6,032
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    Weissach Package. 20 grand for 20 pounds. Just go on a diet for Christ sake.
     
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  6. Solid State

    Solid State F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Feb 4, 2014
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    Ndugu Umbo
    A lot more components on a turbo setup with turbo assemblies, inter-coolers, plumbing, brackets, sensors, harnesses, hardware, etc. Plus the new car has CF panels and much lighter lithium battery. I would imagine the lighter 458 given a shared platform has more to do with the turbo setup addition than the somewhat smaller displacement. Certainly drives the higher cost and lower reliability.
     
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  7. WM458

    WM458 Formula Junior

    Aug 25, 2014
    251
    Germany
    Actually here in GER the official weight quoted by the manufacturers must - according to new regulations - not include weight saving options but refer to the weight related to the standard spec.
    Thus, the difference on the data sheet btw a 488GTB and a Pista may logically be higher than btw a 458Italia and a Speciale respectively. Do not think this is Reality...
     
  8. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,323
    Bournemouth, UK
    Exactly. The weight saving due to a 600 cc reduction is negligible, but the turbo and its paraphernalia add a significant amount of weight.
     
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  9. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax Formula 3

    Jun 10, 2016
    2,208
    Australia
    #84 Shadowfax, Aug 11, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2019
    Weight is everything in these types of cars don't kid yourself. The lighter the better everything becomes. Power can only offset a heavier weight to a certain degree before the laws of physics take over and things like tires and brakes suffer. I'll take a lighter less powerful car in the corners any day.

    Agree with coincid that so called weight savings like using a sticker for a badge (Porsche gt)or the removal of a glove box shell and a couple of hinges (Pista) is gimmicky and attacking the problem at the wrong end. Desirably a weight saving is tangible.
     
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  10. LVP488

    LVP488 Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2017
    2,434
    France
    And yet Ferrari quotes the 488 GTB at 10kg less than the 458 Italia, for what it's worth. If I get a chance I'll try to get the weight of my 488, which has no weight saving options but also no weight adding ones.
     
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  11. RoyalPink

    RoyalPink Karting
    Rossa Subscribed

    Mar 18, 2019
    102
    A solution which will never happen would be this. There should be a standard weight quoted from the factory with no options - meaning a plain jane car. With all fluids in the vehicle. I think this whole dry weight nonsense is ridiculous. Boom, that’s the weight they use/quote. Each option along said price of option should have the amount of weight it adds (+ / -) or saves. Certain combinations of options I'm sure could add a couple hundred pounds to a vehicle.

    Example:
    Carbon rear diffuser: $13,700 Weight: - 4.5 pounds (savings)
    Electric/Heated Seats: $5,600 Weight: + 42 pounds (addition)

    That’s the idea, and to take it a step further the configurator would be calculating the weight as you are adding options. So at the end you could see/know the true weight of the vehicle, and it wouldn’t be that difficult to implement. I’m sure this weight posturing has to do with making more money and marketing. Who knows, perhaps all the big sports cars manufacturers follow suit with one another and have a pact to keep it this way. In other words, they keep it a mystery on purpose.
     
  12. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,323
    Bournemouth, UK
    Weight is important, but the final judge is the V-Box and the driver's feel. Do you really think that a 246 Dino is a better drivers' car than a Pista, just because it weighs half a tonne less? ;)
     
  13. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,323
    Bournemouth, UK
    Which means that they have managed to shed weight in other areas. Would love to see your readings. :)
     
  14. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax Formula 3

    Jun 10, 2016
    2,208
    Australia
    Not at all, but Pista already has so much power now - most which is unusable 90% of the time - so why add more just to offset a heavier weight? Or is it just to trick the buyers into believing the car is still a sports car in some way?

    The best years where when sports cars had power with a light weight and each model on had a bit more power with less weight and a more improved chassis.

    A sports car over 1600kg not only has to fight too hard against the laws of physics but can't keep the tires and brakes from overheating. Actually a sports car over 1600kg is a really just a barge in a sports car body. It's like a tart with make up. Take the make off and it's still a tart. And you can put whatever badge you like on it but it won't change the facts.
     
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  15. C50

    C50 Formula Junior
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    Aug 19, 2016
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    OT but whatever
    What’s your historical sweet spot of power:weight ratio?
    I’d vote for 997.1 911... actually, you know what? I love my 488.
    I’m speaking as a purely road driver, no track, but **** me it’s a great car regardless of the scale’s number
     
  16. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,323
    Bournemouth, UK
    We 'll have to agree to disagree. My "lightweight" 1969 E Type Series 2 doesn't hold a candle to the 599 I regularly fling around a circuit, even though the latter is about 1800 kilos wet.

    The best cars are always the newest ones. A few years ago I gave a 355 owner a ride in a 430. He was in awe!!!

    The LaFerrari is 1580-ish wet. I am more than certain that we would all soil our pants if a proper driver took us round Monza, or Spa...
     
  17. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax Formula 3

    Jun 10, 2016
    2,208
    Australia
    #92 Shadowfax, Aug 12, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2019
    Ive owned 2 997's 997s.1 and 997.1tt and I would take 488 any day over either of those as good as they were on their day.

    Today my vote goes to my 2 and 3 rs - holy f these 2 have seriously left very big shoes for any Ferrari to fill. I'm holding the candle out for Pista to deliver but the competition has gotten so tough now so I'm getting ready to manage my expectations. Will report soon there but my ultimate fun car so far would have to be driving the 3 through 150kms of mountain pass. The sound of that engine coming to head between bends and the balance and precision of that light weight chassis! Damn sure it doesn't get much better than that but will await Pista to have its say on that particular road. Its the ultimate judge for anything that has wheels on it. Stay tuned.

    To a degree what you say is right as the advancements in chassis can really set new apart from old quite significantly in the fun factor dept. But ultimately weight is the key element and the direction Ferrari is now going is the wrong way. Heavy vs light.....say no more. Heavy means more nannies, less connection, less durability etc etc etc than the lighter car of same era/tech.



    .
     
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  18. willcrook

    willcrook Formula 3

    Feb 3, 2009
    1,038
    UK
    so a 458 without any heavy options is lighter than a speciale if it has lifter/hifi etc?
     
  19. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota Formula Junior

    May 29, 2019
    745
    Copenhagen
    Full Name:
    A.B
    No. Neither of those options are very heavy. The lifter adds less than 10 kg and the hifi less than 5.
     
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  20. Shadowfax

    Shadowfax Formula 3

    Jun 10, 2016
    2,208
    Australia
    Today's sports cars need those things. Gone are the days of the horse and buggy...

    Oh did i mention we also need a glove box..(Pista).
     
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  21. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota Formula Junior

    May 29, 2019
    745
    Copenhagen
    Full Name:
    A.B
    Indeed:)

    One thing. I actually like the missing glove box in the Pista. Yes, it's a gimmick and a bit silly, but I think it adds to the focus and personality of the car, and also helps set it apart from the 488/F8 as a more track oriented car. Do I think it matters for performance? No. They could have made the lid in CF:D
     
  22. BJK

    BJK Formula Junior

    Jul 18, 2014
    557
    CT
    sure, one more $10,000 option :(
     
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  23. BarryK

    BarryK Formula Junior

    Dec 17, 2016
    953
    Europe
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    Barry K
    Rather than a meaningless and irrelevant comparison of a modern car with a museum piece with vastly inferior power to weight ratio, look at two that are similar in power-to-weight ratio but different weight. BAC Mono 2.5 and the Pista have similar power-to-weight (c 450hp/tonne), but the BAC is half the weight. and see that the lighter BAC literally runs rings around the PIsta on a typical track. Through corners the lighter car will leave the heavier one for dead. Just simple physics.
     
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  24. REALZEUS

    REALZEUS F1 Veteran

    Feb 16, 2011
    5,323
    Bournemouth, UK
    The Mono is barely a road car though. It is essentially a single seater racer with number plates.
     
  25. lamborarri

    lamborarri Formula Junior
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    Nov 15, 2015
    367
    Quick question, NA specs VS Euro specs, are they the same?
     

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