Heel & Toe Is it worth it?

In the context of driving really quickl;y it can help corner and exit speed. On the street it's just fun, though, cornering that urgently on the street usually looks and is stupid.

Brakes are less expensive to replace then clutches and related bits.

 

On the road, it's just fun, on the track, it's a necessity.

1. Brake
2. Clutch In
3. Select Lower Gear
4. Blip Throttle
5. Clutch Out
6. Off Brake

Find a good racing instructor and perhaps use another car when you're learning.

 

And if done properly on the track, its fun too.

 

Learning to master it is just fun. Something to do while on a routine drive to the grocery store. A heal and toe shift is only something you do when you are downshifting while braking. Under normal street driving, except perhaps right before you hit a highway offramp, you rarely need to brake so hard that you have to downshift at the same time. So it's easier to just brake, then shift once you have slowed a bit. But it's more fun to heel and toe and it really takes practice to do it well (especially in a 308 with the hard brake pedal effort).

Birdman

 

Heel and toe in the Ferrari is great fun. I'm no mechanic, but I'd imagine matching reves makes it easier on the clutch and transmission too.

 

You don't have to heel/toe to do it, but double clutching with a blip between shifting/clutching helps the layshaft to speed up and match engine speed, in turn helping the gear to mesh, extending the life of your gearbox. You'll get minutely more wear on the clutch throwout bearing and pressure plate, but I'll take that over early gearbox rebuilding.

If you really want to heel/toe brake and shift (so to speak), set up your pedals so the brake pedal when under heavy pressure aligns with the throttle pedal, and the throttle pedal is close enough to the brake pedal so you can just roll the right side of your foot over to blip the throttle, maintianing pressure, feel, and braking control. Using you heel to brake is not ideal.

 

I learned to toe/heel when I got my Lotus. (My pedals are hung opposite to a Ferrari: gas from the top; brake & clutch from the floor). I couldn't help but think I was doing some damage in the learning process but my clutch is SO strong that it can take a little abuse. I'd be afraid to learn on a car with a notoriously weak clutch. I would practice in the garage before I was brave enough to try it while driving.

I hardly ever do it anymore. It's for shaving tenths off in a race; on the street it's just for showing off to a race bred passenger.

Ken

 

Depends I guess. I don't think it's showing off if done on the street. It's a nice tool in one's collection of driving skills. I do it on the street to keep in practice, particularly when going from 2nd to 1st. I'm of the belief of keeping the car in gear up to the stop because I trust nobody (Oregon driver's are idiots) so if anything happens I can easily accelerate out of the way or brake instead of the standard "ohmygawshsomethingshappeningsoIwilljustbrake!" mentality. My dad taught me how to do it on my '72 VW so when going up hill and having to downshift from 4th to 3rd it could be done quickly and smoothly, thus keeping the car's momentum continuing forward smoothly and not jerking the car and abruptly accelerating the engine like a non-double-clutched downshift would create.

 

I actually did this on a motorcycle a few weeks ago. It was pretty fun, and amazing how much quicker it made the bike seem.

 

I do it on the street because it's fun and rewarding

...and the practice doesn't hurt, either.

 

They are for me! I want to keep both of my heels and all twenty toes thankyou!

 

True. There's one place I always do it: I'm doing about 50 MPH on a State Highway and I turn right into a small street that leads me home. I always toe/heel from 3rd to 2nd as I'm making this turn. Here in the flat midwest, there aren't a lot of places one would really need to do it!

Ken

 

I do it because it is definately smoother once you have the hang of it. No hurky, jurky from the engine/gearbox not matching speed. I would think it would significantly increase the life of your gearbox. For example, If I'm doing 30 in 3rd in my subdivision and I'm going to make a turn, I will heel and toe so when I'm downshifting to 2nd there is no bucking of the car at all. Not only will it help the wear and tear, but you will feel better doing it not only because of helping the longevity but also because it is cool. Your in a sportscar and isn't it more special to do things differently than an ordinary car. Besides, sportscars are to some extent depending on make/model supposed to be modeled after race cars - and they all do it. Make it part of your daily driving techniques, you'll be glad you did.

 

I do it in my '82 Alfa Sud when the engine is still cold.
Otherwise it stalls

 

Always, in all cars. I don't care if it looks stupid to some people. It's fun and fun is why I have these cars in the first place. If things wear out a little faster then so be it.

 

Its also very useful on the track, because that sudden jerk of deceleration caused by not matching engine speeds, especially in corners, can put the racer behind you a little too close if they aren't ready for it.

 

If you do it right, I'd think it would reduce wear and tear on the drive train. (changing kinetic energy comes from force on the clutch/drivetrain)

It can also put the gravel trap and/or wall a little too close, if you're already pushing the friction circle.

On the street, that surge of deceleration is uncomfortable, can spill your cappachino , and can jerk your rears loose in the rain (especially on roads with lots of accumulated oil drippings floating to the surface in the wet). And if you drive in snow, you especially don't want oversteer you weren't expecting. Of course, all that relates to simply matching revs during downshifts.

Braking at the same time is just a matter of practice and foot position on the pedals.

The 328 practically begs to be h/t'd. Maybe it's me, but I just can't get a smooth shift out of that munged up bungee-cord clutch on the EVO, so h/t becomes moot, there. I'd have to readjust the pedals on the Alfa Spider to make it practical without dislocating an ankle.
(Hmm: cable clutch: h/t, hydraulic clutches, nope. Coincidence, or lack of precision on fluid operated clutches?)

 

is double clutching better than heel toeing?

 

Double clutching is for truck drivers.

 

Yeah, double clutching is for tranmissions that don't have syncros.

 

Double declutching is a similar but different technique. As mentioned, it is used for non-synchro transmissions to match the engine speed. H&T is used for hard driving going into corners faster and more smoothly.

Both techniques will be easier on clutch and transmission.

A car can easily off balance itself during HARD braking so not matching the engine to correct speed when downshifting could cause jerkiness at best if not a spin. If done correctly, H&T would allow you to brake and select the right gear at right engine speed at the same time.

I H&T in my 360 all the time, both track and public roads, as I find it smoother to drive this way even at lower speed. The engine will also sound so good.

It takes a little practice but it is well worth learning if you want to drive fast on any manual cars. Use a cheaper car to practice though.

 

Seems as though people still do it even in cars with synchros to extended the life, and also sounds good when done properly

 

If you're not driving a semi truck, it sounds like you missed a shift. If you don't need to double clutch, then there is no point in doing it. If you are driving fast, to where there will be increased wear on the synchros, then double clutching slows you down. If you're driving slow enough to where you don't care about the time it takes to double clutch, then the wear on your synchros isn't going to be enough to justify double clutching. Basically it is an ancient practice that made up for a lack of technology at the time.

 

For road cars, I agree. There are rare occasions which this technique could be useful, e.g. the shifting starts to fail while driving and you need to drive it back to garage/home. Knowing the technique may allow the driver to get the most out of the failing transmission.

However there are race cars out there which still use non-syncro transmissions such as the Ferrari 550GT car entered by a British team for Le Man. If a professional driver uses the technique, they do it very quickly, usually combined with H&T.

For fast track and even road driving I think H&T and trail braking are techniques well worth learning.

There is nothing to lose but a lot to gain!