HELP! 348 GEAR BOX/TRANSMISSION WHINE | FerrariChat

HELP! 348 GEAR BOX/TRANSMISSION WHINE

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by Juan-Manuel Fantango, Sep 27, 2004.

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  1. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    Jan 18, 2004
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    Just had the oil changed in my 348 Challenge gear box with Micheloto gears. One the way from Atlanta the Gear Box began to whine. When I got home after 400 miles of driving it was much louder. It makes no noise while clutch is in and coasting or not under a load. When I drive it in 4th or 5th at low speeds, it makes a swishing sound, almost like a slow moving orbital sander.

    I hope this is not a gear rebuild. Gears still change fine, and no clutch slipage. I know I should not drive it, but I wonder since they did not put the heavy race oil in it (something they were supose to do) that the Micheloto gears are just louder? I am afraid I know the truth but hope for the best. (South Carolina's state motto is "While I breath, I hope".)
     
  2. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32989

    The above post will take you to a video of the car with the open Challenge exhaust. Also, I forgot to mention that the gears are drop gears, and someone I just spoke to said this sound may be normal.
     
  3. F40

    F40 F1 Rookie

    Apr 16, 2003
    3,230
    AZ
    If they are straight cut gears the whine will be normal. I would get them to do the job right and put the correct race oil in as it will possibly provide more protection.
     
  4. jimangle

    jimangle F1 Rookie

    Nov 5, 2003
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    Hopefully, there's oil in the gear box.
    I troubleshot a harley that would make a weird squeeking noise when you let the clutch out. It turned out that there was ZERO oil in the transmission.
    Hopefully this is not your case.
     
  5. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    I checked it last night when I returned. It was very thin, but full.
     
  6. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
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    I don't know what mic gears are but if they are straight cut they make noise. If they did not with the old oil put the race oil back in. Your shop should have known what to use. I have heard of only one other Mic gearbox. How did you get one in a regular challenge car? The couple of mic 348's are fully raced out and nowhere near stock 348 challenge.
     
  7. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    It has drop gears, but not straight cut. FOW said that it has an upgraded Ergoes or something like that for SCCA racing. Cost 17K to do the unit.

    This car was Jim Kenton's 27 that won the 1996 348 Series, it can be seen under the Petite Le Mans post under general.

    I saw your rebuild post. FOA said that they would have to drop the entire engine to get the Trans out. Looks like from your previous rebuild that may not be so.
     
  8. spider348

    spider348 Formula 3

    Nov 3, 2003
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    Ferrari 348 workshop manual has detailed instructions regarding removing the transmission without engine removal in a 348. Does not appear to be an involved job. Trans oil should be a 75/90 GL5 gear lube if I recall correctly. Not very thin oil. Hope this helps.
     
  9. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
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    Well JD, you either have misunderstod FOW or they are feeding you a line of....? Sorry just being sarcastic as usual... To my knowledge there are no Mic gearboxes. Just GB that have been rewoked by mic in the process of building a very few mic 348's that ran IMSA and and some endurance races. There are like 3-5 of them maybe less. There are no drop gears per se but there is a drop ratio from the pinion to clutch shape AKA drop gears. Many 348's have these gears which provide for more acceleration but lower top speed. You know...potato or potaato.... Yes the GB can be taken without dropping the moto don't let anyone feed you a line of bull. You can do anything with the engine in except the Tbelt unless you take the gas tank out. 348's are actually really simple and easy to work on. If this is the winning 348C then it can have drop gears that are ferrari spec not mic gears or mic massaging to be 348C legal. So now that means if you have a whine you have a problem because you basically have a stock GB and neither set of gears should whine. Check to make sure the right fluid is in the GB. All Ferraris are tempromental with fluid type and weight. I have had very good luck with mobil 1 sythetic Gear oil on the most number of Ferrari GB's. Also, differenciate between a GB whine and a GB "tick" or "click". The later in 348's can be T/O bearing and or the dreaded loose clutch ring nut. Whines can often be solved with fluid type changes.
     
  10. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    FBB:

    Thanks for the reply, I could tell from your previous post that you are quite an expert in these matters; one of the reasons I find this site so appealing.

    The person I bought the car from advertized the car as having Michelotto drop gears. I spoke to FOW raceing div. yesterday and they said they thought the gear box was built by Emnco, and are reseaching that now. Apparently, after the Challenge series, someone went SCCA racing. The gear ratio is very short, in fact, I can almost pull away in 5th.

    I have only had FOA work on the car. They are the ones that told me about the engine out service, but I must have totally misunderstood the situation. I do remember that they said the total removal and instalation would be around 16-20 hours.

    I am going to change the gear oil and see if that helps, but I am afraid that more may be wrong. I really wanted to go to the Italian Car Show in Atlanta this weekend, a round trip of nearly 600 miles. But, I don't think it would be worth the several thousands if I destoyed or damaged the gear box substantially. I have reciepts for over 9K in parts alone from the seller for the gear box, and I was told a recent box like this one including labor was around 17K at FOW.
     
  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Aug 10, 2002
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    JD,

    You may have a special GB if someone did something to it for SCCA racing to be legal and competative in their class. AS to cost...yess 17k is about right from what I have heard. 16 to 20hrs is a major service time. The in/out on a GB is perhaps 4hours at may slow home mechanic pace. I do not know who enemco is.
     
  12. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    Just drained the gear box oil, and although it was just changed at FOA, the plug looked like it was caked in grey sludge with plenty of small metal shavings. Break out another one, another ten thousand ones...(sang to the 1950's or maybe it was the 60's country song about bottled beer)

    So what, it's the price of ownership. I would not throw out a beautiful woman because she ran up my credit card...I'm driving her now, I understand the price...will post later. It's a drug.. I cannot put it away.
     
  13. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    17k for a gearbox..wow...i have 91 348 and i get a high pitched soon when i accelerate..its not that loud and if i back off the throttle it goes away...anybody got any suggestions on what it might be? i only budget about 5k for parts for this car so i pray its not a gearbox...why is so expensive?
     
  14. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    My guess is 5K should jsut about cover a gear box, as I found one at GT Auto Parts without a core for 5,500. With a core it will be less.

    Aparently mine is a short ratio SCCA style box, and the figures quoted are by FOW and the previous owner. Who knows the real cost.

    Get it looked at now rather than later.
     
  15. TOM B

    TOM B Formula 3

    Jul 24, 2003
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    Thomas Buckley
    David,
    Sorry to add fuel to the fire but it sounds like you're being told another story. The only class in SCCA that allows a 348 is GT2 and that is only if it has a 2 valve / 308 engine. Sorry. :(
     
  16. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    As you can tell, I have no idea, the lightweight light covers on the car had SCCA stikers froim various years on them. Could it be that the car was legal in previous years?

    I have heard of other 348's being driven in SCCA events in the past, I just am not sure which ones. Of cource, I know you can drive in club events like SOLO 1 or 2.
     
  17. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Juan-Manuel Fantango F1 World Champ
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    I have just completed a "scapebook" from Ferrari of Washington's matterail including time sheets from the Challenge Events in 1996. I was told it is umcommon to find these since no one really kept records. I have a picture of the car infront of Ezo's Home. This was from when the car raced Mugello.

    David Seibert was also very, very helpful in getting me many photo's from it's race days in the Challenge, even a couple of the car sliding backwards (woops)!

    Although it means nothing to most, I rather enjoy the fact that it won the 1996 Challenge, and I drive it today on the street and track events. The passion and funds these men put into the sport...
     
  18. FNU_LNU

    FNU_LNU Karting

    May 22, 2004
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    How about posting a pic of her.
     

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