History and info is sometimes a call away

Welcome and good thread!

I've actually found old owners of my 308GTBs on the chat here........still missing some early history on #20405.

You are right about one thing, once the widow throws it into the trash, it's GONE! LOL!

 

I've actually been meaning to do that. I have the names (but no contact information) of 10767's previous owners, and now I have the time! I saw all of the car's original documents at the factory a couple of months ago, but I guess I'll have to go through (i.e. PAY FOR) certification to get copies.

Jack.

 

Often true, but don't assume anything! Sometimes the widow doesn't want to go through her husbands old stuff, especially the stuff in the garage. When I bought my GTE, the toolkit had 1/2 Ferrari Wrenches and 1/2 Craftsman. I went back to her house and asked if I could see her husbands toolbox and sure enough, 1/2 Ferrari and 1/2 Craftsman. I later went back with her son-in-law and we renovated her garage. Threw out all the junk and built cabinets. Got the heat shields, original radio, package tray and a whole bunch of boxes of parts. Pretty good pay for one day's work!

 

Don,

consider that some owners may be reluctant to dig too deep, in case the "special" owners/events in their car's life may turn out to be an accumulation of brokers/salesmen exaggerations over successive sales? If a lie is told enough times, it becomes the truth and enhances the value of the car.

Even today we routinely see complete nonsense in advertisements, usually prefaced with "believed to be" or similar.

I do agree with your broader point. It took me 2 years of enquiries to locate the 70's owner of my [not significant] car, but when I eventually reached him I encountered not only a wonderful gentleman, who shared with me many fascinating photos and racing anecdotes from the period, but I also left with a raft of material that verified the car's history and will be preserved for future owners.

Ian

 

Great thread! I can't understand why people don't research the past life of their significant cars as amatter of course...a total lack of curiositiy perhaps...

I knew my car (not a Ferrari; a Maserati Khamsin) had been in Costa Rica for a year and was always frustrated that the broker who had sold it there would not, despite my asking repeatedly, provide me with name or contact information...and then, as so often happens, a chance encounter solved it: at the Sunday night dinner of Ferrari's 60th Anniversary 2 years ago I heard a couple of chaps in their fifties at a nearby table mention that they were from Costa Rica. I asked if they remembered seeing a gold bronze Khamsin in about 1993 there...and they said of course it was the car of so and so the Toyota dealer, I googled him and sure enough found him!

best regards,

Marc

 

What I hate are the brokers whom charge for their history on ones cars.

 

Everyone has to make a living, especially nowaydays: I have on a few occasions been paid a retainer to research the history of a particular car but as Doug Nye says in his huge experience you sometimes will find absolutely nothing because there is nothing to be found.

Also put yourself in the position of anyone be they a journalist, broker, historian, garage owner, dealer, anyone who gravitates around these cars: when there is a demand a fee can be considered. It should be ethical and just. Sometimes there should not be a fee: this weekend I will translate a short Italian document for someone, so short that I won't consider a charge: he can buy me a drink whnever we meet. However when selling a car the seller should provide all the history he has absolutely.

best regards,

Marc

 

Even though I only have a historically insignificant 308, I did try to found out more about its history. The books and some receipts were with the car and I know the names of both previous owners and the workshop that did all the work for the last twenty years.
But alas the previous owners never replied to my letters and the workshop owner said he wasn't allowed to disclose any information without the previous owner's consent. So that was a quick dead end street. Not every owner is interested in the history.

 

It is particularly frustrating when the previous owner has a LOT of the history and says in his ads that he will provide all the history he has, but then flatly refuses to copy a lot of it for you. I got only some partial history and the rest was refused. I even offered to fly again from MI to CA to copy every scrap of paper that he had on the car, all at my own expense, but he just refused. One example: The car had been fully repainted, but the previous owner not only refused to provide any work orders for the repaint, he refused to even provide the contact information for the painter. I saw the size of his history binder when I bought the car, and I got only a pitifully small fraction of the amount of material that was in his binder.

Some of the undisclosed issues by the owner that I later had to deal with were probably the real reasons for the refusal to provide all the known history. Many of them were obvious things that should have been found on the PPI, but were not found or disclosed by a very well known west coast inspector.

Once you have paid for the car and had it shipped, the previous owner can get away with such a raw refusal, even though it violates every principle of an honorable way to do business in the collector car market. This really can be a caveat emptor experience, if you have the misfortune to deal with a seller like mine.

The car is great now, after dealing with a lot of expensive and time consuming surprises, and I have put about 10,000 miles on it in 4.5 years -- including getting a Gold in the classic 2+2 class at the 2007 FCA Meet in Corning.

My suggestion to buyers is to get the FULL history copied for you, either in advance of purchase, or provided on the same day you hand over the check. Don't assume you will get what you want after the sale - it might not happen if you get a seller like mine.

Whenever I eventually decide to sell the car, the buyer will get everything I accumulate, it is the only honorable way to do business.

Regards,

Jim Walker
365 GT 2+2 #12451

 

Absolutely. I've got a whole stack of analogue pictures with my 330GTC of the previous owner, which I am sure have some sentimental meaning to him (since he owned it for 22 years). Nonetheless, they were all given with the car. If I ever sell, I will do the same (but maybe on a DVD-ROM? - hehe).


Onno

 

Would you believe the person who sold us our car in 1966, recently called back to hear if we still have it and if might sell it back to him...

Best wishes, Kare

 

There's the flip side also... Those of us genuinly interested that have exhausted all avenues and still have gaps. Let's face it, significant cars don't always go to festidious owner's.

 

Here at the Ferrari Market Letter we have a database that stretches waaaay back.

We will gladly send any history we have on any Ferrari. All we ask in return is reciprocity, i.e. you send us your information and we will send ours.

Please inquire via email to [email protected] and not via private message to Ferrari Chat and give us your full name and location.

Gerald Roush
Ferrari Market Letter

 

Kare - what a great story! But he must've been disappointed...

Gerald - I think that is a great offer. I hope you get more owners to add to your database and hopefully you can help them out too.


Onno

 

Gerald's service is fantastic, and can really fill in the gaps! Thanks, Gerald.

 

Gerald, your Earthlink asked me for a Delivery Request, and they have it firewalled at work, so I cannot do that....

A very detailed VIN recap and a request, is trapped in that email que, if you can retrieve it.

 

Gerald recently helped with with relative minutiae on my 512 BBi 49473. His experiences, history, and enthusiasm for the marque are first rate. Thank you, Gerald.

Forza,
David

 

I love those people at FML.

I pass everything I can on to a new owner. Even a twisted half shaft in a recent instance. Only asking for a courtesy call if they contemplate moving it on.

 

I just rec'd a call from Lucy Petrone at FNA in response to an e-mail i had sent in an attempt to locate the selling dealer of my 82 308 (39367) and she told me it was Bob Sharp Ferrari-Maserati in Danbury,Connecticut. However they are no longer in business and she had no furthur information to offer.So now i know it was originaly sold there,i bought it 6/1/2009 in Charlotte and the PO told me he bought it in Del Ray,Fla but when i called them they had no records as it was a consignment. I ran a Carfax report and only goes to the Fla used car dealer,before that nothing! Any ideas,anyone?
Thanks in advance.
Bill

 

Gerald helped me with the serial number for an early 70's Ferrari from first hand knowledge. He has decades of Ferrari experience with an impressive data base. Thanks Gerald!
CH

 

Other than Gerald's generous offer, how would someone suggest I find info on my '69 365 GT (12751)? I had a name of one previous owner but could not contact him when I bought the car 23 years ago. It's always seemed to me that most cars that are sold through a dealer lose their history.

 

Start with Hil Raab's book on Ferrari serial numbers, which should at least let you know if your car was a US car. Then contact Gerald.

There was a guy on here a while back who had access to the old Harrah files, if your car was a west coast car.

The selling dealers from 1969 are pretty much gone (except for Ron Tonkin, my local dealer), so that won't help much.

 

donv said:

"There was a guy on here a while back who had access to the old Harrah files, if your car was a west coast car."

My 330GT, 8855, came from Harrah in 1967. Is there any way I could get more info?

 

Thanks for the thread, it reminded me to do some more searching. I had found out my car had be sold at Christies in Monaco in May 1988 by Lord Chitchester, but i did not have the catalogue, so that's what i have been doing for the last 3 hours, and i found two would you believe, one for me and one for the history file.

Mind you i have square eyes now from looking at all the wrong Google leads!
Grant
[ Holey Daytona ]