How does the Land Rover SVR beat the Ferrari 458 in the hill climb?

Discussion in '458 Italia/488' started by F430 Driver, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. F430 Driver

    F430 Driver Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2008
    415
    Central New Jersey
    Link: https://carbuzz.com/news/watch-the-range-rover-sport-svr-outperform-a-ferrari-458-italia

    According to the video, the new Range Rover Sport SVR beats the Ferrari 458 in the Tianmen Road hill climb. It doesn't barely win. It crushes it. 9 minutes 51 seconds for the SVR versus 10 minutes and 31 seconds for the 458.

    The Ferrari is MUCH lighter. Similar HP although lacking in torque compared to SVR. The 458 can brake, corner and has aero (although aero not as relevant at these hill climb speeds).

    The only thing I can think of is that Tianmen Road elevation is 5000 feet. The SVR is supercharged and thus power loss at altitude is not anything like the 80hp or so the 458 loses. So in this cherry-picked head to head the SVR seems well suited with its higher torque and supercharged engine or so I am thinking.

    I don't have any other explanation than that. Anyone else think it is just the supercharger making up for the altitude vs the NA 458 engine or am I missing something?

    Either way, this is a great PR piece for Land Rover. Hand pick a course perfectly suited for the SVR and beat up a Ferrari. Might have to get one to put next to my 458!
     
  2. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
    11,056
    It's basically torque and the supercharger does help combat the thinner air as you said.
     
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  3. F430 Driver

    F430 Driver Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2008
    415
    Central New Jersey
    Yes but dramatic weight difference. 3100 lbs for 458 and 5100 lbs for the SVR. That is a lot more weight to accelerate, corner and brake!
     
  4. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
    11,056
    Gearing and torque are more important than weight. Imagine both the Ferrari and RR were on a flat road a towing a boat under acceleration (not constant speed). The RR would be a lot better as its engine and transmission are better at making low end torque as well as delivering it. The hill is basically the same as towing something that is constantly fighting you under acceleration (gravity).
     
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  5. hamad488

    hamad488 Karting

    Nov 11, 2015
    119
    Abu Dhabi
    Full Name:
    Hamad
    am really happy to have the RR SVR for my DD.
     
  6. boobernackle

    boobernackle Formula Junior

    May 28, 2016
    438
    Give me a horse and I will beat the La Ferrari by 6 minutes and 13 seconds. Assuming the La Ferrari driver babies it the whole way up and takes thirteen smoke breaks.

    Simple marketing ploy that's old.
     
  7. cloverleaf

    cloverleaf Karting

    Jun 16, 2013
    67
    It's a Land Rover-sponsored publicity stunt...
     
  8. willcrook

    willcrook Formula Junior

    Feb 3, 2009
    861
    UK
    I don't see how it's possible
     
  9. twist-a-grip

    twist-a-grip Karting

    Oct 25, 2013
    198
    The only way this legit happens is with Seb Loeb driving the SVR and Rick Ross driving the 458.
     
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  10. wrs

    wrs Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Jul 11, 2015
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    Austin, Texas
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    Would anyone be complaining if it was a 360 or 430? I have a RR SC and they are quite impressive off road and in rough terrain, the 458 couldn't go 10 feet down most of the roads out in West Texas so why is everyone so upset? I am on my third supercharged Range Rover, two were sports. They are all great off road and on steep terrain, why shouldn't it beat the 458? Does anyone want to race my Range Rover down any of the roads in these pictures? I will race for the pink slips and I will let you have the road and I will take the side (with the exception of the logging road).

    Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  11. Camlet1

    Camlet1 Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    May 3, 2014
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    Drove a 17 MY SVR for 48 hours (dealer pushed). Must say it’s a mighty impressive car.
     
  12. LVP488

    LVP488 Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2017
    1,330
    Not at the same time, not with the same driver (as far as I can read the 458 driver is not mentioned); so it's not telling anything IMHO.
    The talent of the drivers and the condition of the road may have been totally different with about 2 years between the two timings.
     
  13. F430 Driver

    F430 Driver Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2008
    415
    Central New Jersey
    I posted on youtube in the comments regarding the driver and they did respond directly (you can see it on the youtube comment section. Here was their reply:

    "Feel free to check in with the previous route record holder, Fabio Barone, who covered the route in 10 minute 31 seconds behind the wheel of a Ferrari 458 Italia, but we believe he'll confirm he was trying his absolute best - and nonetheless the Range Rover Sport completed the route faster at 9 minutes 51 seconds, at an average speed of 68.8km/h (42.8mph)"

    Link to Youtube

     
  14. LVP488

    LVP488 Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2017
    1,330
    Thanks, that still leaves the condition of the road.
    For instance the famous Pikes Peak road has been significantly improved over the years, partly explaining the reduction of times year over year.
     
  15. Jordan68

    Jordan68 Formula Junior

    May 12, 2015
    433
    Dubai
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    I have an SVR which I use as a family DD next to my FF and 488..... the SVR is just an amazing SUV


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
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  16. F430 Driver

    F430 Driver Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2008
    415
    Central New Jersey
    I agree the SVR is awesome. I may buy one actually.

    My main point is that if you look at all the advantages the 458 has over the SVR (a whopping 2000 lbs lighter, lower center of gravity, better cornering, braking, handling, aero, etc). Then if you look at the disadvantages of the 458 which are is the lack of a turbo/supercharger which helps maintain power at altitude and also the lower torque on the 458, it still seems difficult to see an SVR beat the 458. Even though it has less power loss and the extra torque it has 2000 pounds more it has to lug around, brake with, corner with, etc.

    I don't know much about the 458 driver who set the record referred to on the LR video. Somewhere I read online on another site it said the driver, Fabio Barone, is a Ferrari driver? I have no idea if that is true (can't believe everything you read on the internet!). Not sure if Fabio is a real professional driver or just a weekend amateur racer type.

    Still, I would think even in my hands (and I'm not a great driver..only about a dozen track days of experience) I should be able to beat a 5000 lb SVR on any ROAD course without much effort.

    I'm already speccing out my SVR. Coming in at about 140k loaded up nicely. Do these LR dealers ever discount?
     
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  17. Jordan68

    Jordan68 Formula Junior

    May 12, 2015
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    I am sure you will enjoy the SVR, amazing sporty SUV with huge power and excellent sound ... real sporty and at the same time very comfy and excellent DD


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  18. Juan-Manuel Fantango

    Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 18, 2004
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    We have just the regular sport, and it's nice to have that blower, instant torque when you put the foot down. And I'm very surprised how well it handles when passing, and on twisty roads. No really, and it's just the sport. SVR is another game altogether.
     
  19. wrs

    wrs Formula 3
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    Jul 11, 2015
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    Not much but if you hit them at the right time then you can get up to 10%. I was able to get a total of $11k off of my 2017 which I bought on the last day of the year. The MSRP on that car was $116k.
     
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  20. Caeruleus11

    Caeruleus11 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 11, 2013
    7,539
    People love the SVR. Its really fast and Im not entirely surprised. I would need to see the route, but unless it was really technical, once you are up to speed the difference in weight isn't as critical as you might think if the turns are more sweeping in nature- the front weight bias might even help the LR - and then there is the forced induction at altitude..

    I'd like to see this comparison over the Nurburgring. But there is no denying these SVRs are impressive.

    I'll still take my 458. :)
     
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  21. dustman

    dustman F1 Rookie

    Jun 12, 2007
    3,079
    SoCal
    Cayenne turbo s?
     
  22. wrs

    wrs Formula 3
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    Had one and it's a great SUV but it can't do the off road like the Rover. It has an increased height setting but none of the power settings the Rover does so I wouldn't say it's "trail rated".;)
     
  23. dustman

    dustman F1 Rookie

    Jun 12, 2007
    3,079
    SoCal
    Good points.

    Guess it depends where you live also. In so cal there is no need for the range but they used to be hip and everwhere. Owners said they were poor to drive but bling ruled. The Porsche made more sense since it is a brilliant driver and substantially better quality.
    What about the Bentley Bentayga?
     
  24. Maximus1973

    Maximus1973 Formula Junior

    Oct 29, 2016
    433
    Great cars Range Rover's. They are very comfortable and will drive anywhere. You'll enjoy it very much.... until they break down.... and again... and again....and again... No more from me.
     
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  25. F430 Driver

    F430 Driver Formula Junior

    Apr 23, 2008
    415
    Central New Jersey
    I hear they only break down AFTER warranty period is over these days. So if you buy or lease and get rid of it after 3 years that is less of an issue. But if you plan on keeping it for 5+ years then yes the break down stories I hear seem to be out there.

    Here is the 2017 JD Power dependability study. LR in the bottom half but still ahead of Ford, Ram, Dodge, Infiniti, Jeep, Fiat, Mitsubishi!

    http://www.jdpower.com/ratings/study/Vehicle-Dependability-Study-(VDS)-by-Make/1881ENG

    Filtering that out to just premium brands though and LR comes in dead last :(

    http://www.jdpower.com/ratings/study/Vehicle-Dependability-Study-(VDS)-by-Make/3670ENG/Premium/3119
     

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