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How long will a F430 clutch last?

Discussion in '360/430' started by DrivnXcitment, Nov 21, 2020.

  1. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    I'm currently looking at an 05 F430 and after the PPI, the clutch shows 75.6% wear (24.4% life left). Do these clutches last to 0% life, or when do they start slipping and skipping gears?
    Is it a linear degradation or is it more exponential as the clutch wears?

    Obviously driving style makes a huge impact, but let’s assume average driving, no racing, with a little spirited rolling accelerations added in for smiles. Thanks in advance!
     
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  3. PKIM

    PKIM Karting

    Jan 1, 2004
    144
    Redlands
    Full Name:
    Paul
    I don't think anyone is going to be able to tell you how long that clutch is going to last. So many variable, how you drive it, using reverse alot, etc...
    24% left is pretty low although I bought my car with 44% left and still good going on 2 years. You might need to change it sooner than later. I'd say this would be an opportunity to negotiate the price. Best of luck.
     
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  4. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2016
    729
    Full Name:
    Dale
    I don't get the "24.4% life left". I didn't think they needed changed until it fell below 40%.
     
  5. Husker

    Husker F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 31, 2003
    8,224
    western hemisphere
    if they have to change it at 40%, wouldn’t 40% be the quasi 0%?
     
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  6. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2016
    729
    Full Name:
    Dale
    Yes, and I actually read the OP's post wrong. I read it as though it was showing 75.6% material left, so in reality, he's surpassed the useful life at just 24.4% left. So to the OP, yes... that car is due for a clutch. They don't wear down to 0%.
     
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  8. Husker

    Husker F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 31, 2003
    8,224
    western hemisphere
    That’s like a car being out of gas when the gauge says 3/8ths full.
     
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  9. TheCook

    TheCook Formula Junior

    Oct 16, 2015
    299
    Buckinghamshire
    Full Name:
    Ian
    I often see people referring to track use when discussing clutch wear. Driving your car fast has no effect on clutch wear, what’s important is how much time it spends in a slip state under load that counts. Inching forward in traffic, reversing, hesitant take offs, driving in anything less than Sport mode, and poor PIS adjustment all cause clutch slip under load and will increase wear. Get the PIS set by some one who understands the F1 system and drive it as you would a manual to maximise clutch life.

    To the OP, 75% wear is beyond the useful life and needs replacement. As a reference my car is tracked regularly and driven hard. 36,000 miles and clutch wear is 38%


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  10. 24000rpm

    24000rpm F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    drive it until it give you an "N" occasionally, that's when you need to park the car and pull the gearbox
     
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  11. the_dan

    the_dan Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 6, 2016
    35
    Hong Kong
    Full Name:
    Dan M
    The clutch is done or near to it, budget for a clutch job in the price if you’re gonna buy it.
     
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  13. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    While I agree with the approach, it can be a bit (wee bit) risky on the wallet if you're far from home. My impression of "N" occasionally might be different from your impression of occasionally and entirely different from what the TCU is going to consider occasionally !
     
    24000rpm likes this.
  14. cole328

    cole328 Formula Junior

    May 9, 2014
    549
    Yes those are all good points… Mine is an 07 with 23,000 miles on it. I do not track it, but I pay attention to reversing and inching in traffic. Other than that I drive it fun and I drive it hard. 32% wear


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
  15. BlacktopRacing

    BlacktopRacing Formula Junior

    Sep 18, 2016
    729
    Full Name:
    Dale
    Lol, so par for the course in Ferrari land.
     
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  16. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    Basically this is an 05, 26,000 miles, needs a clutch, has a cracked header, misfire in cylinder 3 (I suspect coil pack), and needs a repaint on the front clip. For some reason the owner never put a clear bra on it ‍♂️ but it’s priced and negotiated at 92k.
    waffling on whether I should pull the trigger knowing I need to put about 12k into (18k quoted from a big Ferrari shop non dealer).

    figure I can do the coil pack, headers, but clutch someone will need to do for me
     
  17. armedferret

    armedferret Karting

    Mar 24, 2018
    137
    Full Name:
    Mark
    what if it's more serious than the coil pack?

    (just trying to play devil's advocate, please no hate mail ;))
     
  18. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    It could be, but in my learning it’s either a bad plug or coil pack most likely. I’m sure they are original and we all know how good they actually are.

    it’s so funny. We all love and want Ferrari’s but let’s be honest, their build quality is crap overall.
     
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  19. NMNMNMN

    NMNMNMN Karting

    Aug 23, 2020
    65
    wiley355 likes this.
  20. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    What are the other options outside of plugs or ignition coil? They seem to be the most common occurrence for misfire. The codes thrown are
    PO300 Misfire Detected PO303 Cylinder 3 Misfire. No hate mail coming your way lol, just like learning the options.
     
  21. SpencerMarks

    SpencerMarks Karting

    Jan 15, 2017
    86
    Woodstock, Georgia
    Full Name:
    Spencer
    With all those issues I wouldn’t even consider their asking price. Like you said that’s a lot of money to pay after the fact.

    FWIW, I was told my cars clutch was needing to be replaced soon. Since it was on consignment it was relayed to the seller that it needed to be replaced if I was to buy the car. He gave me the option of 6k off the asking price or he would have it replaced then shipped. I took the discount, got it home and found out it actually had 75% clutch life left. #winning
     
  22. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Whoa, $92 for that? I’d probably sell you mine for $92k and it has none of those issues. Same as his too, 05 with 26,xxx.
     
  23. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    Well talk to me ;) Rosso Corsa spider? PM me
     
  24. whatheheck

    whatheheck F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Mar 27, 2006
    3,835
    Seattle, Wa
    Full Name:
    Dan L.
    Lot's of threads here on clutch life.

    I will summarize what I have read, what I have learned based on my own personal experience with my 360 & F430.

    Clutch reading is an estimate / approximate. It is not an accurate reading, especially if work has been done to the transmission.

    Clutch usually needs replacing at around 75% wear. Early indication is when the transmission starts popping out of gear.

    Learn how to drive an F1 transmission properly ASAP to prolong clutch life.

    If you are good with mechanical stuff you can save a lot of money by replacing the clutch yourself.

    F1 clutch replacement varies from about $5,100.00 from an independent mechanic to about $11.5K from a Ferrari dealer depending on what else need or should be replaced while the transmission is down. Those are the two quotes I received my 360 needed a new clutch.

    $92K is a lot of money for that car. Given its issues & age be prepared to spend big bucks on upcoming repairs needed like ignition coils, fuel pump, etc.
     
  25. VAF84

    VAF84 Formula Junior
    Rossa Subscribed

    Ah... there it is, I had a feeling it was Rosso. Argento Nurburgring (Silver) on Bordeaux (interior) here. It's a beautiful combo, but not Rossa, if it appeals to you let me know and I'll PM.

    @TheCook - Good call on setting the PIS at the right setting. Josh did that for me during one of the shop visits, and I noticed an immediate improvement in shifts. I can see why that would extend the life of the clutch.
     
  26. DrivnXcitment

    DrivnXcitment Karting

    Apr 29, 2006
    53
    St. Augustine, FL
    Y’all are all amazing. Thank you so much for all the info. Based on my learning from you and online, I decided to pass on this particular 430, although I have my eye on two more now.

    my experience is a HUGE example of how important a PPI is. I could’ve made a huge mistake and the PPI, and this forum’s expertise saved my bacon.
     
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  27. Danedingerson

    Danedingerson Karting
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 26, 2011
    99
    Maui
    Full Name:
    Dane
    I skipped the PPI on my 2007 430 because it had a CPO and warranty. Zero issues car still looks new.
     
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  28. scuderia09

    scuderia09 Formula Junior

    Sep 6, 2007
    993
    At 75% clutch its done it will start down going into to "N" and then going to be hard on the F1 pump, before buying the car let them replace or the clutch or take $7k off the invoice and do it yourself , photos are on a Clutch 60% worn and only use factory parts.
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