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How to determine the dealer my 328 was delivered to?

Discussion in '308/328' started by HOF Ferrari, Jun 10, 2019.

  1. HOF Ferrari

    HOF Ferrari Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 22, 2007
    1,564
    Canton, Ohio
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    AFG
    Is there a source that can give me info as to who the delivery dealer would have been on the original sticker of my 328?
     
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  3. offtheworkigo

    offtheworkigo Karting

    Feb 23, 2016
    229
    Dallas
    Full Name:
    Dave Hoffer
    Great question. I would like to know how my car got to the States. What country it was made for. It's a euro. I do know the name of the guy that had it. My identation plate inside the door has his name on it. Is that usual for a euro car?
     
  4. Mechanical Dad

    Mechanical Dad Formula Junior

    Aug 30, 2016
    375
    East Aurora NY
    Full Name:
    Josh
    I've been doing some research for my Mondial as well. No import tags anywhere, vin checks out as a euro spec (not country specific) and from the phone calls and Google I was able to find the original owners name and spoke to his wife and said it was purchased when he was living in southern France. That was all she remembers. it was federalized at some point with door bars, a charcoal canister, and passenger mirror. I had gotten ahold of a few people on here who have strong dealer connections in Europe that checked my VIN in their countries and no dice. I even called Ferrari NA and they had no record if my car before 08. Sent a few emails to Ferrari themselves and was able to update myself as the owner but they would not give me anymore info even though they said they have it. Maybe Marcel can help??
     
  5. ducowti

    ducowti Formula 3

    Jan 27, 2008
    1,501
    NY/SC
    Full Name:
    David
    Try EPA and NHTSA for conforming documentation. Was able to secure these docs for my Swiss market (discernible from VIN) euro 328, and I may have the respective contacts in my records, though who knows if those folks are still employed 11 years later. I do recall learning in that process that mine was imported in Dec 85 into port of Newark.
     
  6. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    No: there is no plate whatsoever inside the door, or on the door jamb, on "euro" cars in their original market. If there is any plate there, then it has been added in the US.

    All "Euro" 328s were exactly the same specs for all main continental countries (Italy, France, Germany, Belgium, Spain, Netherlands, etc...) so it is impossible to distinguish the cars and guess which country they were originally delivered to, except for some tell-tale details here and there: identification plate with red letters in the engine compartment usually means Belgium; washing water outlets in front of the headlight pods means Sweden, FOD-protection mesh in the side scoops mean Germany, yellow front foglights for french cars, etc...

    The only exception is Switzerland, which has the same cars than "continental Europe" until mid-1987, but some slight engine diffrence; then afterwards, more engine differences until the arrival of the KE-3 Jet engine (= "C" in the fourth VIN position), specific to Switzerland and Sweden only (VIN is spelled ZFFCA20S, etc...for a swiss GTS; ZFFWA20B... for a standard euro GTS)

    And U.K of course; the U.K cars are exactly a "standard continental specs" car, but with RHD ("W" engine, no catalysator); whereas Australian 328s are more a RHD US Car ("X" engine, with Cat) but with metric gauges, and RHD.

    Rgds
     
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  8. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    Data-protection laws means it is forbidden for them to give you anything about the owner; you are already lucky if you know his name. Some "new" owners may find some information about a car's past in the car's file (service receipt, etc...) or on the warranty card if the change of owners has been documented, but from a strict legal point of view, a dealer or a mechanic that has information pertaining to a car's owner(s) is forbidden to disclose it without the written consent of the said owner.
    That's the Law. Then, from time to time, you might get lucky, but these days, most professionals stick to the Law to avoid potential trouble with susceptible owners. One grumpy former owner might give them a lot of trouble.
    There are also some countries for which the archives has been destroyed: it is said to be the case of most, if not all, German-sold Ferraris of the eighties, as the archives of the importer, "Auto-Becker", have been reportedly destroyed.

    Rgds
     
  9. Rosey

    Rosey Formula 3

    Nov 5, 2015
    2,162
    Australia
    Full Name:
    Mark R
    I found the abbreviation AUST (short for Australia) written in white Texta on my suspension arm from the factory on my Australian delivered 328.
    Maybe take a look at yours and see if any clues are there.
    Sometimes the simplest things...

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  10. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    #8 nerofer, Jun 11, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
    "Close, but no cigar", Mark...
    On both my 328s (GTS #80515, GTB # 81085) the suspension arms are marked..."eur" for "euro", in white paint...

    Rgds
     

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  11. Rosey

    Rosey Formula 3

    Nov 5, 2015
    2,162
    Australia
    Full Name:
    Mark R
    Oh well it was worth a try. :)
     
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  13. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    As for "328 markets", (read here: variants in the technical configuration of the cars) I would say there were seven:
    - Europe (F105 engine, no catalytic converter, "W" letter in fourth VIN position)
    - United Kingdom (= a RHD "continental euro", so no catalytic converter; gauges in imperial measures)
    - Middle East (a difficult one to spot: despite the "letterbox" hot air extraction slot in the rear bumper, the engine is the standard "euro" without catalytic converter..."W" letter)
    - Switzerland /Sweden (No catalytic converter until mid 1987, catalytic converter and KE-3 Jet afterwards, F105-046 engine with "C" letter in fourth position of the VIN)
    - Japan (a LHD model: catalysed engine, same as the US cars: F105-040, "X" letter; but many LHD cars imported from other markets as well...)
    - North America (Catalysed engine: F105-040; longer front bumper, flag mirrors, etc...)
    - Australia (= a RHD "North American", F105-040 engine; with gauges in metric; no GTB produced for Australia, no car fitted with ABS)

    Rgds
     
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  14. bertrand328

    bertrand328 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2015
    1,042
    France
    Full Name:
    Bertrand
    That could be interesting to list which importer's achives are available.

    -UK : with Maranello archive ( only for current owner )
    -France : with Charles Pozzi ( also only for current owner )
    -Germany : Auto Becker destroyed
    -Belgium .…...
    -Others country ???
     
  15. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    Belgium archives (The Swaters files) have been - reportedly (?) - sold or dispersed, Bertrand.
    That is for the official importers, or "head offices"; some "local", or "regional" dealers still might have "something"?
    Rgds
     
  16. bertrand328

    bertrand328 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2015
    1,042
    France
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    Bertrand
    The official importer achives have been sold to a well know Ferrari historian ( as I know ). I tried to know if it's possible to consult them, but I didn't understand the answer. Probably due to my bad English language ….
     
  17. HOF Ferrari

    HOF Ferrari Formula 3
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    Nov 22, 2007
    1,564
    Canton, Ohio
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    #14 HOF Ferrari, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
    Ok...so mine is a US car, but I'm looking for what dealer would be on the original sticker? It was first registered in Potomac, MD, so I emailed Ferrari of Washington as they are the closest to see if it was sold from there.
     
  18. bertrand328

    bertrand328 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2015
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    France
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    Bertrand
    #15 bertrand328, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
    Could be American Service Center Associates in Arlington, Virginia official Ferrari dealer at that time
     
  19. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    11,133
    South East
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    Jimmie
    The probability is that the supplying dealer thirty years ago is no longer a dealer today - your service dealer booklet will show you the list at the time
     
  20. Rosey

    Rosey Formula 3

    Nov 5, 2015
    2,162
    Australia
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    Mark R
    Correct, the service book would have the selling dealers stamp in it.
     
  21. HOF Ferrari

    HOF Ferrari Formula 3
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    Nov 22, 2007
    1,564
    Canton, Ohio
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    AFG
    My car didn't come with the original books.
     
  22. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,775
    FRANCE
    It certainly doesn't help...perhaps "someone might find something" with its VIN? It is a bit like a bottle in the ocean, but you never know...

    Rgds
     
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  23. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 4, 2001
    31,622
    Birmingham, AL
    Full Name:
    Tommy
    FNA can tell you.

    I asked them and got a letter back stating the build date, date shipped to the US and original dealer.
     
  24. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
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    May 4, 2001
    31,622
    Birmingham, AL
    Full Name:
    Tommy
    I keep it framed in my mancave and I have a laminated copy I throw on the dash when I show the car.
     
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  26. HOF Ferrari

    HOF Ferrari Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 22, 2007
    1,564
    Canton, Ohio
    Full Name:
    AFG
    That's exactly what I'm trying to do, found a great company in Dayton, Ohio that makes identical laminated duplicate stickers, but he needs the selling dealer and he doesn't have access to that.

    In case anyone's interested, its http://www.stuttgartstudios.com/ Chris just did one for my 911 and the quality is amazing !
     

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