I almost bought a Ferrari today, but........ | FerrariChat

I almost bought a Ferrari today, but........

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by RAMMER, Jul 25, 2004.

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, Skimlinks, and others.

  1. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    the car was a lot more expensive than I thought. The car had an opening bid on Ebay that was much less than the owners asking price. The car itself was stunning, a red/tan 328 GTB with only 16k on the clock. It was like a new car with very, very little wear. This was also my first time driving a Ferrari. The owner of the car was very kind and kept on asking me up the RPMs. I must admit that I was very nervous. This is not the easiest car in the world to drive if you are tall and have big feet. Fortunately, the owner insisted that I drive the car on the highway so I felt more comfortable as the miles went by. Here are my impressions of the 328- As you all know the engine's sound is special and it revs like hell. Clutch was light and the tranny was smooth. The driving position was touph.....limited headroom, pedals were too close together and my right leg touches the stick shift while the car is in first and reverse.The AC was also lacking and this Florida heat is no joke. My biggest impression was the cars beauty.....what a beautiful car! The GTBs lines are perfect. Sooo perfect that I would be willing to live with the cars short comings. I wonder what would be a fair price for this car....the owner wants around 54k. I wanted to buy a 328 for around 40k. I think this car was probably worth more than 40k even if it is a GTB (wich I like). In the end, I told the owner that his car might be a little too nice for my budget and he understood. As far as I know It is possible to buy a 328 for $40k. A car with 30-40k miles and a good service history. What are your thoughts on my adventure????
     
  2. Jerrari

    Jerrari F1 Veteran

    Jul 24, 2001
    5,469
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Jerry Wiersma
    Did he have service records? If so, what was done to it? 15K/30K? If records exist and it has had the 30K, offer him $48,000. $54,000 is pretty steep.
     
  3. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

    Apr 26, 2003
    13,477
    Never home
    Full Name:
    Dr. Dumb Ass
    What year? Did it have ABS?
     
  4. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    The owner said the cars belts were done by the previous owner. Being that we were so apart on the price I did not bother to look at records. If I had decided to purchase the car I would have done a full PPI.
     
  5. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    It is an 87, no ABS.
     
  6. Mike328

    Mike328 F1 Rookie

    Oct 19, 2002
    2,655
    Boulder, CO
    Full Name:
    Mike
    $40 is too low for that car. 45k is more like it, and if it's as nice as you say it is, somebody will probably buy it for $48k to $50k.

    --Mike
     
  7. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    I am still confident that $40k should buy a descent 328. Am I wrong?
     
  8. Crawford

    Crawford Formula 3

    Mar 5, 2003
    1,294
    Nashville, TN
    Full Name:
    Crawford White
    Not at all - ~$40k is good money for most early GTS's, and a GTB is more rare and ... less valuable. I think the 87 GTB owner is really going to struggle to get his price.
     
  9. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,408
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Or wait long enough to get it!

    The 3x8 market is strange right now with the late cars still quietly falling from the $50K - $60K market, while the carb early non cat cars firming up a little in asking price, for a good one.

    Keep looking, if you have $40K to spend. This just sounds like a low miles car that the owner is proud of. I saw a 328 the other day with less than 500 miles on it. You talk about BRAND NEW in appearance! Man!

    *leaving now to avoid Garage Queen comments*

    It still looked brand new, ya know? "Time Warp" type feeling.......
     
  10. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 6, 2002
    79,408
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    GTBs are MORE valuable, to a certain group of Fcar owners....;)

    Hint: They wear helments.....
     
  11. Tomf-1

    Tomf-1 F1 Rookie

    Jan 17, 2004
    4,528
    Leawood KS/ South FL
    Full Name:
    Thomas
    last november, i sold my 89 328gts w/ less than 12k, all serviced, interior redone, immaculous condition for $52000 last year..... not sure if it'd command that today.
     
  12. Mike328

    Mike328 F1 Rookie

    Oct 19, 2002
    2,655
    Boulder, CO
    Full Name:
    Mike
    The key factor in this particular example is the mileage. $40k can get you a very nice 328 with 30,000 miles WITHOUT its 30k major service; add more for a car with its major service done reputably.

    This car has 16,000 miles, and, assuming that it's had its 15,000 minor service (say, somewhere around $1,500 to $2,000) and cam belts, then it WILL get more than $40,000. This is my strong opinion after being in the market (and buying one) three months ago.) 16,000 miles on a this 17 year old car is 328 is a formal, delineated "class" better. The way I think of it is Class 0 = < 1000mi, Class 1 = < 6000mi, Class 2 = < 16,000 miles, Class 3 = < 31,000 miles, Class 4 = < 46,000 miles, Class 5 = < 61,000 miles, Class 6 is anything greater. I know this sounds silly, but mileage is a very important factor on these cars, to the point where I would only consider Class 2, 3, and 4 cars, because of the variance in cost betweent them.

    The other factor here is the private party, which is working in your favor. By all means, see if you can't get the guy to come down, but if you get this particular car for $40,000, you will have bought right and the seller have sold wrong... Assuming it doesn't have any internal engine damage that you can't see :).

    If 40,000 is your budget, you should: 1. Be looking private party exclusively. 2. Be looking at cars with over 30,000 miles (but less than 60,000 miles!) 3. be prepared to spend a little in service, if necessary. 4. Be targeting cars that have been on the market for a while. Why 4? No seller will take $40k for his car if it's only been out there for a few weeks. A few months and they might do it. Then again, a few months, and someone will have paid $50k already!

    It's a tricky but rewarding process. It's just like shopping for diamonds. If your budget is truly fixed, then you have to be willing to compromise on miles, condition, recent service vs. not, private party vs. dealer, COLOR (!!!), number of prior owners, etc.

    Good luck!

    --Mike
     
  13. PCH

    PCH F1 Rookie

    Apr 7, 2004
    3,007
    Not sure that the 'B' is worth less. They are rare and if the owner has the 'right' one, (excellant condition, low mile, and services complete) it will command top dollar.
     
  14. Testacojones

    Testacojones F1 Veteran

    Nov 3, 2003
    5,198
    Florida
    Full Name:
    Luix Lecusay
    I traded in a 86 328GTS for another F car in a Ferrari dealer not long ago, the car had 67,000 miles and the major last was done at 60,000 miles about a year before the sale, the dealer gave me $35,000 for it as trade and sold it for not less than $40,000, a source from the dealer told me they sold it for $42,000.
     
  15. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    There are different types of sellers. This particular gentleman is a real car guy who races Porsches and is probably just looking to make room in his collection. There was zero sales pitch and he seemed indifferent about selling the car. ( could be his sales pitch) I also wonder how he gets around to driving an old GTB when he also has a 993 twin turbo. Especially when you consider the 328's cramped interior, lack of AC, and and limited power in comparison to a twin turbo P-car. Unfortunately for me, just one look at that GTB will take the rationale out of buying a non turbo 993, a competent and more comfortable car I like. I will say it again,328's and GTBs in particular are stunning cars.
     
  16. DadsFerrari

    DadsFerrari Formula 3

    May 31, 2004
    1,559
    New England
    Full Name:
    Mister M
    Just a thought; these prices are at 348 levels. I know that is the anomoly(sp.) of the 328's amazing value. I only wonder how low the 355 might go!

    I have recently seen an ad for a "pristine" 18k mile 1990 348tb for $46,000. If that means its so pristine it still has the 1990 belts... Lets hope that's not the case. The car is in NH, btw. I love the 328s, but unless you have a stable of many, why give up the performance/technological upgrades of the 348 for the way better looking old school 328?
     
  17. Boxer 512

    Boxer 512 Formula Junior
    BANNED

    May 5, 2004
    468
    London, UK
    Full Name:
    Seb King
    Top 328 GTS car's in the UK are fetching up to £40,000 ($72,000), some concours examples are exceeding this ! (Several currently for sale). Mid range cars are still commanding £35,000 - Personally I think the model is on the up ?

    Seb
     
  18. F328 BobD

    F328 BobD Formula 3

    Mar 17, 2001
    2,327
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    BobD
    1) Because $40-50,000 348's are the problem-plagued early cars
    2) There are many people who feel 328's have the enduring classic lines.
    3) 328's are much more reliable, do not have the expensive electronics and are cheaper to repair.
    4) 328's don't have the funky seatbelt mechanisms
    5) 328's sound better
    6) No cheese graters

    As always, money is the great tiebreaker. There must be some pretty good reasons why late 328's are worth 10% more than early 348's. One other thing to keep in mind... you get what you pay for with these things.
     
  19. Mike328

    Mike328 F1 Rookie

    Oct 19, 2002
    2,655
    Boulder, CO
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Another thought that I haven't posted before. Coming from my 1978 carbed 308 GTS, I feel that the 328's level of technology and performance is right where I'd like it to be.

    I'm sure the 348 has more kick, acceleration, top end, etc. That's fine. The next model year of whatever car you're driving now will, too.

    But the argument I have trouble with is the technology / creature comforts. I find the 328's cabin size to be perfect (but am not the biggest guy on the block), and it's A/C controls to be very nerdy, capable, and designed for an engineer. It's like full manual, dual-zone A/C, and it does exactly what you tell it to. Don't know if the 348 has automatic climate control, but many new cars even today--even the top-end models--don't have ACC!

    With the 328 you get your standard fuel injection (CIS)--maybe the 348 stepped up from this? Also electronic ignition. This is a step up from carbs, the early revisions of the electrinc ignition systems found in later 308s, and of course the mechanical ignition found in the earliest 308s.

    The 328 leaves me wanting nothing, with the exception of power door locks that I can actually interface into!

    At the same time, it's simple enough where I can look at the wiring diagram, find the wire that leads into the fasten seatbelt buzzer, and disconnect it (easily reversible!), voila, no more seatbelt buzzer to rattle my nerves when I start the car.

    I see a big jump in technology in the early 308s to the 328s. Not so much in the 348s. I also see an extraordinarily well-designed, highly evolved car, chassis, and engine philosophy (mounting and actual block).

    It's just my bag, baby, is all--I've found that what I can comfortably afford happens to be my "perfect" and I don't need to lust after higher models. I suspect that's why the prices are what they are.

    Now, I bought right, and I didn't buy as an investment, so I don't need to say "these cars are going up" to justify my purchase. But my feeling is these cars will appreciate slightly, only because their evolved design and build quality have given us cars that have stood the test of time.

    I'll always be the first to say that 1) Practical people do own Ferraris--people who are concerned about risk, cost, and maintenance; and 2) People buy Ferraris for exclusivity. The 328 satisfies these like no other Ferrari and does it while providing adequate levels of technology and comfort.

    My sentiment is that I'll never need another. Of course, one day when I own a 355, I'll look back at this post and laugh! :)


    --Mike
     
  20. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
     
  21. RAMMER

    RAMMER Formula 3

    Feb 20, 2004
    1,190
    Miami
    Full Name:
    Rammer
    I was thinking that a 348 tb might be the way to go mainly because of the larger interior and better AC. I dont like the fact that they are harder and more expensive to maintain. Thats why I value the 328's simplicity and reliability. I am far from being wealthy. Lately it seems that 348's have gone up in value. I think its possible to find a descent 328 for 40k but a 348 will be closer to 50k.
     
  22. jimpo1

    jimpo1 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Jul 30, 2001
    25,032
    Dallas, TX
    Full Name:
    Jim E
    328's have a seatbelt buzzer?
     
  23. ashsimmonds

    ashsimmonds F1 World Champ

    Feb 14, 2004
    14,385
    adelaide, australia
    Full Name:
    Humble Narrator
    yeah, obviously class stuff is an owner perspective thing too. a class 0 vs class 6 car... a car that's been driven and maintained, and has just had a major 60k service with various minor - if any - repairs to be done, perhaps a good detail. or, something that's been sitting in the back of someone's shed for 2 decades, needing a semi-restoration...

    the biggest thing i see is the idea of owning a car that no-one else has driven... much. otherwise, unless i'm in it for the nostalgia, i just see a car that may be considered almost new by insurance/concourse standards, but by my standards represents 100,000 unused miles when those miles mattered, when those miles were in something that was new and awesome, rather than just old and cool. :D
     
  24. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner


    Bob -

    Do you have even the slightest bit of personal experience with a 348 on which you base that statement? The 348 owners on this board would likely disagree (violently) with your assessment.

    -Daniel
     
  25. DadsFerrari

    DadsFerrari Formula 3

    May 31, 2004
    1,559
    New England
    Full Name:
    Mister M
    For your reference, I saw one of the final 328 GTBs this summer. It was a rare verde green on tan/brown. Had less than a thousand miles, new owner paid dearly for it.

    bostonsportscar.com

    It was out of a dealer estate. 348s probably are pains (early 90 models), it's just interesting to see them advertised as 'pristine'. With proper upgrades, the 1990 models can be made more reliable.( not sure if recalls were paid my factory..)
     

Share This Page