I think my F430 is having strokes!

I'm new and have owned a 2005 F430 for less than a year with it being in the shop for seemingly a third of that time.

The first time it happened, the engine suddenly died and I couldn’t restart it was surprising since it has been running like a champ since I got it. I took it to the dealer hoping they would have a thought or two on what might be the cause of the engine just dying as I was down shifting from 2nd to 1st approaching a stop sign (I heard a beeping sound and the gear number display went to a “-“) and not being able to restart it despite multiple attempts (it turned over fine) until after letting it sit for all of 5-10 minutes whereupon she fired right back up. I got lucky—I was 100 feet from my driveway when it happened. I went to the dealer where they said something about the F1 pressure reading that they'd fixed with a seal or something like that.

It happened a time or two again, but letting it sit for a spell then restarting worked every time until the major event:

My wife and I are driving and are about a mile from the house when it stalls on me again. This time I cannot get it to start and have to call a tow truck (which is another debacle for another time). These were the symptoms

--car stalls out as now typical in the downshift from 2 to 1. The car has been to the repair shop 3 times already for this. It was thought to have been solved. However, many other symptoms were noted this time
--unlike previous times, this problem was unrecoverable. Previously, if I sat for a few minutes, it would start right back up.
--this time the car freaked out. All kinds of things were flashing on the dashboard such as a picture of two triangles below an image of the car,, the word "diff" , etc.
--during the time I was in the street with the emergency flashers on, sometimes, the strength or intensity of the rear lights was so low I started to call the police (but the tow truck driver moved behind the car instead).
--sometimes only one headlight was on while the other was out.
--it thought it was in that "suicide mode" (the farthest clockwise position of the switch on the steering wheel) at some points through the ordeal.
--turning the steering wheel while stationary appeared to cause different things on the dashboard to light up or appear. I could be wrong about this.

To me it some kind of electronic board or chip on a board that is problematic or has a loose connection or something. Or the contacts on the steering wheel that allow electric signals to pass on a wheel that turns (not sure how this is down with wires that twist or with contacts that stay connected even as the wheel turns as if one of the contacts is a large ring and the other side is like a spring loaded wire that keeps the wire touching the ring-shaped contact as the wheel rotates--I don't know).

More time at the shop, no codes, more tinkering. They say they discovered loose or corroded grounds and that the problem is solved (they think).

Then recently, my F430 screwed me again, doing almost the same thing as last time. The CST with a slash was appearing and some right triangle shaped thing that I don't know what it means. Only this time I was able to recover from it by turning the car off and then restarting it. To my surprise, it started and I immediately headed home. Another Saturday evening ruined.

I will tell you exactly how it went down. I live at about 1300 feet above sea level in and had not driven the car for 2 weeks. I do not have it on a battery tender (I do now!) because I drive it enough where it does not appear that I need one. I'm excited to drive my car and juice it a little down the hill. At the signal at the bottom, I make the left turn and juice it hard (in race mode) for about 3/4 of a mile to the next light. I downshift manually to 2nd gear from about 4th, then apply the brakes and let the automatic mode drop her down to 1st. Right then, like before, it goes haywire with the display showing a number of different things like the CST slash ( I was NOT in that mode!) and then stalls out. Various other things appear on that little postage stamp size display. I try restarting but no dice. I remember from before that I almost killed the battery trying to restart so I just turned it off while horns from other cars blare because I am blocking traffic. I turn on the hazards and wait a few seconds and try it again. This time it starts right up. However, at this point all confidence has been lost so I turned around and drove back home and quit while I was ahead. No way I was going to risk it crapping out on me mid trip so we swap out to my GT-R (which seems impossible to make it do anything wrong) and continue on to the party at a family members house.

I am at my wits end. Next I'm supposed to take it to the dealer and do the test drive with the tech sitting next to me to see if I can get it to stall (since it never happens when they have the car for a week at a time). I won't go anywhere in it until I attach a GoPro aimed at the dash so I can show the techs exactly what is happening.

Anyone here experience anything like this? If so, what WAS the problem?

Thanks a million if you read this far on my long post.

 

This isn't a permanent solution, but do you ever pull back both paddles coming to a stop to put the car in neutral instead of 1st? This may reduce the stalling issue if you absolutely need to get the car somewhere without failure.

I knew someone who had a very low battery and the car started up rough and felt like it was running on 1 cylinder bank. He came to a stop in gear and it stalled. When he restarted the car was back running on all cylinders/no limp mode and never stalled again. That's the only experience I've ever heard of an F1 car stalling.

 

That's a great idea! I have not tried it but am certainly comfortable doing so (I have gotten lots of practice from sitting at lights and have a neighboring care rev their engine so as to get me to rev mine).

Thanks also for the input on the battery. I have a Toyota truck that I can leave sitting for 2 months and it will start right up, and I thought driving this at least once every 1-2 weeks would be enough, but I am going to keep the battery tender on it from now on no matter what. I'll keep you posted as to whether that makes a difference.

 

Next time it is in the workshop, get the clutch wear checked. In 7000 miles my clutch has worn 1 % but i always put it in neutral at the lights. If the clutch has been dragging the wear will be excessive.

 

A couple of things to take note of:

- The TCU sends a kill word to the engine ECUs via CAN if it thinks there is potential for gearbox damage due to an inability to accurately modulate the clutch. There are a few reasons for that.
- These cars are incredibly sensitive to battery voltage. I had a TCU go bad because a procedure was run with sub-optimal battery voltage. Most of the modules have a minimum supply voltage and will start exhibiting strange behaviour if the supply drops below that.

My advice is to first change the battery, then if the problems persist take it to someone experienced. There's too much going on to diagnose over the net.

 

If not done please do this! I change my battery every 3 years regardless. A low battery will have the car doing very flaky things. I drive mine at least every 7 days so I don't need a battery maintainer attached. This car ain't a toyota..

Also check the alternator output with a multimeter. When the battery runs down to low voltages the alternator has to work harder to charge it.. that can tax the wiring harness and voltage regulator in the alternator.

 

Original poster: would you care to fill out your profile and share with the community your name and location?

 

I agree with the above comments. Check and replace your battery since it's known to cause chaos when low.

 

Will do, but it has only like 13k miles on it and last check showed (I don't recall exactly) what seemed like plenty to me. Nonetheless I will get a fresh reading. And I will indeed put in neutral at the lights.

Bear in mind, it is doing more than stalling. That little postage stamp size indicator starts flashing all kinds of things like different positions on the steering wheel switch that I am not even in.

Thanks

 

Heh, I let my 360 sit for a few weeks with no maintainer (no big deal, it's just a car, right?) and I was thrown every color of the rainbow when I drove it. I cleaned a few connections, installed a maintainer connection and the thing is NEVER off the charger unless it's being driven. I don't know what it is about these cars, but they love to eat batteries and have all kinds of temper tantrums when they do. Yours having the F1 system is probably even worse. I would bet the battery is the culprit for damn near everything. Make sure the battery is new and the alternator connections are tight and there is no corrosion.

 

I'm an old car guy but a newbie here so forgive me if I struggle with your acronyms. Reading in to context, it appears you're saying the tranny basically tells the engine via CAN (couldn't figure that one out). Please confirm as I want to understand every word if possible.

I have not driven it since I started tendering the battery (I went and got sick on the day I was supposed to drive with the tech), but I will be soon.

Totally understand the difficulty in diagnosing online. I am just hoping to find some one who screams, "YES!! THAT EXACT THING HAPPENED TO ME!!"

Thanks for the input and suggestions.

 

OK, this is starting sound like what I was getting. "Every color of the rainbow" is equal to what I was calling a stroke. Things sure are starting to point to the battery tending so I will have a report for you all this weekend!

Mighty appreciative of all your help so far. And yes, to that other fella, I will get around to filling out the profile too.

 

I am going to echo what others have said....change your battery. These cars are very susceptible to low voltage. As Curt mentioned, it doesn't hurt to change the battery every three years (cheap insurance I might add).

For what it is worth, I worked in the automotive industry for 20+ years. The biggest warranty item was batteries.

BTW - I keep my 08 430 car on a tender constantly.

 

It would seem to me that if your car can't sit for 2 weeks in moderate temperature (i.e., not freezing) without needing to be on a tender, then either the battery is approaching end-of-life, or your car is drawing more than it should when "off".

Don't get me wrong, a tender is essential equipment. But that's mostly because these cars usually sit for a while during winter.

 

If i get 4 days out of mine before i get a call from the tracker co saying flat battery i am doing well, can you imagine this on a honda or a toyota.

Modern electronics take so little power but yet to be used by Ferrari. My old Toyota used to sit for 4 months while i worked away and would start up after a few goes, no charger when it was sitting all that time either

 

You got it! I should have elaborated; CAN is the communication protocol used between the TCU (Transmission Control Unit) and the engine ECU.

 

My 2005 430 can easily make 2 weeks in the garage (usually longer) in warm weather without needing the tender. There really isn't a heck of a lot that should be drawing power when the car's not on.

 

Thanks much. It sure seems like low voltage from NOT tending or periodically replacing the battery apparently can cause all kinds of trouble and this is evidenced by all of your experiences here in this post. This is where you guys are uniquely invaluable compared to the dealer, at least the one I'm using (I'm in SoCal).

I hope to have great new to report when I drive my topless Italian this weekend!

 

That was my thinking being that I live in SoCal and I usually drive it every 1-2 weeks so I didn't think it was a big deal, but no more. It's on the tender now (I have the nifty plug right behind the driver seat--previous owner trying to tell me something?!). I will definitely have that battery checked and replaced.

That certainly would explain why the dealer, test driving it every day or so, did not find a single frigging problem (of course).

 

OP, what part of SoCal are you in? There are quite a few mechanics with a great reputation that can help you with this.

Do F430s not have a battery kill switch in the trunk? My 355 had this and I would just turn it if I knew I wasn't going to drive the car for over 2 weeks.

 

Yes there is a kill switch in the trunk, mine anyway. Either the kill switch or keeping it on a maintainer outta keep things rite.

 

I'm in South Orange County. Let me know if there is someone in particular that you know to be expert on such matters (that is, should the battery tending not prove to be the solution).

I did not know about the battery kill switch but I will look for it now. Doesn't that screw up engine settings like for emissions as well as the radio code though?

 

Some 430's have a kill switch and some dont (mine doesn't) If one is fitted it will be in the top left corner of the trunk when looking in from from the front of the car...

 

Got it, Thanks! I'll go check tomorrow and see.

 

If you use the battery disconnect in the trunk, you do need to go through a procedure when restarting the car. After turning the battery disconnect back "on", you should -

- Let the car sit for a few minutes (don't open the doors or get into the car). Have the keys on you, not in the car.
- The alarm system will be activated. So after a few minutes, press the key fob button to deactivate the alarm.
- Get in car and turn key on - DO NOT start the car. Let it sit for a minute or two. This is needed so the throttle bodies will learn their starting position.
- Turn HVAC to "AUX" or auto
- Start car and let it idle for 10 mins

After that you should be good although if you do a diagnostic check, there will be a code showing that the battery was disconnected. No OBD2 codes should show up on the IP. You should be able to drive the car normally after this.

This procedure was relayed to me by my certified Ferrari Master Tech. It has worked on my car without issues. BTW I have an 08 F430.