I'd like to put this out there...

There are a lot of car guys who are close to stepping on a rainbow. Unfortunately, their significant other doesn't have a clue what the cars are worth or how to sell them. If the spouse gets lucky, they end up getting close to what the cars are worth, if not...

What about a old guy car-guy co-op? Instead of charging outrageous fees and inside deals, the idea is a group of old car guys handle the disposition they way they would like their cars to be sold.

Am I making any sense?

 

who will keep human nature in check?

 

Beats me. Professionally, I see a lot of guys with great collections of cars, but nobody else in the family cares. There has to be a better exit plan.

 

Family may not want the cars ......................but they sure as hell want the money ..........

 

Exactly. But is a group like RM the best choice to maximize the value of a life-long collection? I'm not banging on RM and all the others, but their bottom line is not my concern.

 

Yaaawwwn.
This "idea" and many similar ones have been around as long as I can remember (few decades at least), some have worked better than others.
I can easily think of countless alternative choices/plans already existing, including if getting what you perceive your car(s) maximum worth being is that important, sell it/them before stepping on to that stairway.
Besides, regardless what I personally might think of many of them, auction houses, estate plan lawyer-executors, etc livelihoods matter too. Many of them probably have even accountants on payroll.

P.S. This topic is probably in a wrong forum section anyway.

 

How do you know when you're going to die?

Ps. I give a damn how many people the auction houses have on the payroll. Not ma problem, mon.

 

Case in point.

https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/bat-got-nuthin-on-rm-sothebys.660486/#post-148570212

 

A good idea but it would need lots of safeguards to avoid this heading the wrong way.

I can think of two widows who would have needed that help.

In the northern mid west one got pennies on the Dollar for her late husband's 250 Cal Spyder years ago. The culprit also caused trouble in the publishing world.

Another widow in Palm Beach had a Merak from new. On his deathbed her husband said don't sell it for under such amount...then years passed...and the car was parked under a simple car port facing the sea at their seaside estate...when she had a dealer pick it up for evaluation the rust had become really bad yet she said my husband told me to refuse any figure under ex amount. The car was sent back to her estate and might well still be rotting away in its spot...

 

Mt wife of 42 years knows what my cars are worth, knows who to contact if she needs to sell them, all contained in a simple document I created at 70.
If she goes before me, I'll take care of it.
If we both go together, my financial advisor knows what to do. He's a trusted friend and understands how to unload the cars and bikes for a real-world price.

 

After my father passed in March 2020, RM handled the sale of the remainder of my father's collection at their online Monterey auction. All of the cars went at or above the pre-auction estimate and our family was very pleased with the outcome. Perhaps most importantly, Rob Myers and his team took care of everything, treated us with respect, and were incredibly professional. We had also used them in 2014 for the sale of our 275 GTB and GTS and had a similar experience.

 

I think it's important to have a relationship with a reputable dealer or dealers, and communicate that to your family members as part of your estate plan. This is something which needs to be updated regularly, as circumstances change, as well.

 

if the remaining family members have no interest in the collection, can the owner have the collection appraised predeath and donate the collection post death and use that figure to offset the estate taxes?

 

This statement applies to other inherited items. To me it’s sad to see young people selling heirlooms that have been in their family for generations simply because they want the money. Years ago I watched the owner of a local auction house try to convince a 20 year old young man not to sell two old photo albums. The albums contained his family history in pictures from the mid 1800’s (tin types) to about 1950. The auctioneer said “son this is your family history, you should keep these”. The kids response was “they don’t mean anything to me, I never met any of these people, and they’re all dead. I just want the money.”

 

I would consult an estate planning professional (I'm just an anonymous guy on the internet), but I'm pretty sure you could donate them in your will and offset estate taxes, yes. However they would have to be valued as of the date of your death.

 

Still a wrong forum section for this topic, but I guess it’s like Momma Gump used to say…

 

Clearly we know no bettah, so please guide us to “correctitude”…?

 

Maybe some “General Automotive” section or among countless other silly topics in the subscribed sections might be better suited for this nonsense ?

 

Let's do a hypo. Here are two situations:

1. You have an estate that has six cars with a collective value of $3 million; or

2. You have an estate that has one car worth $3 million.

A good argument can be made BaT is the better choice for door number 1. The total buyers premium will be $30,000, or 1%. Why does this matter? Buyers might be drunk, but they are not stupid. The lower the buyers premium, the higher the bid. Drivers Source out of Houston has nailed BaT. They know how to maximize this market.

Door number 2 is not as clear. Yes, the typical auction house charges a 10% buyers premium. This means a rational buyer would bid no more than $2.7 million and change for the car. The problem is the $3 million number is fuzzy. Maybe the car is worth $3 million, maybe it is worth $5 million. Who knows? Plus this is a thin market. The numbers of buyers for say a 275 GTB in number one condition is maybe a half a dozen? Maybe a dozen? Moreover, these buyers will know everything there is to know about the car, maybe even more than what the seller knows. Clearly, we're talking private treaty here. We're talking about a deal where everything is on the table. Over the years, I've brought and sold a little bit of real estate. My standard negotiating ploy is, "Fine, you name your price, and I get to name the terms."

Now, imagine a widow or executor who knows nothing about the cars. Maybe a non-profit consisting of car guys where we help a car guy who has stepped on a rainbow might be a benefit.

 

Dude, I suspect you are a little OCD. You like everything in its place. The problem is some ideas don't fit neatly into this drawer or that drawer. Sometimes you have to stretch yourself.

 

As i see it there is also another problem with big auction houses. They want to have their hand in everything and of course cars have become a big commodity thanks to their hand in it. They have to make money both from the seller AND the buyer. Whats worse the estimated values are are often exaggerated to attract the sellers ans also increase profits. Let's be realistic " art on wheels " is very alluring but in the long run i like to drive my cars and not keep them locked or hang them on the wall.

 

All major auction companies such as Gooding, RM Sotheby's and Bonhams are very professional and well organized. Only these big ones are able to provide worlwide marketing and PR for "your car" (your property). Their clientele is international and they are able to find and attract buyers on the other side of the planet (biggest audience). And that's why they deserve a proper commission. Some of these auction companies do not always charge 10% to the seller, it really depends on individual negotiations between seller (consignor) and the auction company. It is a free world. It is the seller's responsibility to negotiate with the auction company. Not the other way round.
Estimated values not only depend from the seller expectations (oftentimes they are very unrealistic, dreaming and have no idea about the real and current market). One of the general problems is that the bigger auctions take a massive lead time, at least six to nine months in advance. So, if we use Monterey in August as a sample, many negotiations and (price) agreements are made in January to March already. But how do we all know what the real situation (market) will be in August? Nobody does. It can quickly change within a couple weeks or months (think Ukraine war, gas and energy shortage, inflation crisis, economy, interest rates, and all the rest of it).

Marcel Massini

 

A couple on thoughts here...

1) I think in a lot of cases, such collections are only a fraction of the net worth of the person that has passed on, so in the grand scheme of things, maximizing that asset has to be balanced against time and effort; I can’t imagine the hassle of trying to liquidate a large collection on a car-by-car basis; a few cars could be entrusted to a family friend, but one would be asking a huge favor of that friend.

2) A lot of families don’t have a lot of love for such non-liquid assets; the collections are often burdens once they go to the heirs, and family squabbling sinks their realized value far more than any cut that a auction house takes.

Mind you I don’t love auction houses, but at least one knows that a car will be properly advertised, and you won’t have to deal one-on-one with the (sometimes crazy) phobias of buyers.

 

just call the show Chasing Classic Cars. they can handle it all. and you will be on TV.

 

“… little OCD.” ???
Dude, I suspect you're a bit late/lite with that suspicion and yes, I do prefer things in proper order/place, but I also know most people lack common sense, so life often seems more than a stretch.