I'm fed up with my 308's lack of AC!!

has anyone tried to find an existing condensor that will fit the bill. seems there should be something out there that can be retro fitted. you're doing great work rob. i'm anticipating every new post. thanx. perserverance furthers.

 

try the id-200 from nostalgic air parts. i bought one and believe it will do the trick. steve

 

nice prices.

 

+1

works great for me too. I'm still running R-12, and running cool on my '79. I have noticed though that after driving for a few hours that the speed of the fan DECREASES. Has anyone else had this happen? Of course this is during the 100F + days in Arizona... Maybe it's from increased resistance in the electrical wires to the blower motor... At least it's finally in the double digits back in Arizona now! I could actually drive with the top off the other day without baking my head!

 

I feel your pain down here in FL. Although I have a 328, here is a list of mods I made......I have 46 deg at the vent on a typical mid 90's day.
-new york 10 cfm compresssor
-conversion to 134-all new seals at every connection
-new hose from evaporator to drier (had small leak)
-cleaned and straightend condensor fins with commercial strength coil cleaner and a fin straightener (20 years of crud built up)
-added a vent on drivers side at the spectical compartment (ran duct hose and spliced into main air plenum)
-sealed two mystery holes in main plenum (not sure why they are there anyway)
-removed bottom fiberglass panel underneath condensor for better heat transfer (the small slits in the vertical panel are restrictive but
do keep rocks from striking condensor)

Finally, I am in the process of installing a 9" fan in "front" of condensor to create a push/pull cooling effect along with the existing rear mounted fan. Also plan to replace existing condensor fan with one that has a higher rpm. I think the key to good ac is cooling the REFRIGERANT.....the proof of this is when the car is cold, the ac now blows a stunning 38deg at the vent and then slowly creeps up to 46. Also, do yourself a favor and buy a dial or digital thermometer to quantitativley measure your vent temps. Wil post results of new fan in a few days.

 

Post script to previous post. There is a product called V-KOOL www.v-kool.com that is crystal clear and yet blocks 99% uv and heat compared to only 15% to 30% with traditional tint. Maybe tinting the entire front windshield is the key to cooling the 3x8 cabin?

 

Well, I spent the weekend fabricating a mount and installing a 9" fan in front of the condenser on a 328, creating a push-pull cooling effect on the condenser...........The result.......nothing. Well, actually the only gain is that it takes slightly longer for the vent temp to climb from 38 to 46 after a cold start-up. I'm totally demoralized and eagerly waiting for Rob's results.

 

Once again, blowing or trying to blow more air through an evaporator or condensor is not going to give you an A/C system that cools better or noticeably better. The main factor is the amount of refrigerant in a system. "x" amount of refrigerant can only carry away "x" amount of heat, not more (and no, you can't just add more refrigerant to a system than for which it's designed).

It's similar to an electric space heater with a fan. You can't heat a bigger room simply by putting a bigger or faster fan on it. You need to increase the wattage of the heating element.

You can't defeat the laws of physics.

 

This is spot on although you can still try and get the best out of a poorly designed system.I'm referring purely to my personal experiences in my GT4.I re routed the vents and modified the way the outlets blow to get maximum airflow to my body instead of blowing the air to the headliner.I also made the fan 1 speed(I only ever use high speed anyway) and used the existing switch to switch a relay and fed direct 12v to the fan through the relay so that there was no voltage drop.I got about a 10% increase in fan speed which may not be much but is still more than I had.Here are a few pics on my vent mod
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=282962&d=1139478595
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=282960&d=1139478595
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=282959&d=1139478344
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=282958&d=1139478344
http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=282957&d=1139478344

 

The fan speed may have been okay when the car was new but now, because of age, it is helped by your electrical modification. Blowing air at your body is your preference. I prefer the cool air going towards my face, as perhaps others do and...... cold air sinks....

You say you got about a 10% increase in fan speed but you do not mention a drop in temperature. That would be a more significant indicator.

 

Erich I will answer a few questions.The original fan speed switch goes through a resistor that various the negative side of the 12v,so I believe that it would still have been the same as when it was new.Now as for the air flow on the GT4 if you notice in the pictures the vents have flaps on them that act as dampers and you can direct the air to anywhere on your body.I also like the air to blow on my face as you get a cooling sense of evaporation and I have my vents positioned to blow on my face.If I close the passenger vent off then all the air directs to the drivers side and I have alot of airflow.If it gets too cold, which on cooler days it does I then redirect it away from my face.When I first got the car it had been retrofitted with R134a and I was only getting a minimum of 8-9 degrees Celcius out of the vents.I have since converted back to R-12 and am now getting minimum temps of around 3-4 degrees Celcius.The fan speed mod and the air direction mod haven't made the vent temp cooler only better directed the airflow.The only negative to the vent mod is that I dont have cool air coming out of the vents on the dash for demisting.I did this 2 years ago and have yet needed to demist my windscreen so it hasn't affected me as much.This has made driving the car bearable compared to unbareable before but has not made the A/C perfect.At various Ferrari shows where other owners of GT4's have seen my mod They have asked me to do it to there car as well.I had planned on replacing the compressor with a Sanden which is more efficient but I might do that if and when the existing compressor fails.I looked at replacing the evaporator with a larger one but there isn't much room.There is enough room to replace the condenser and to upgrade to larger condenser fans which would drop my condensing temps down as well but for the amount of time that I get to drive my car the work doesn't really justify the gain.I'll also add that my mods are totally reversible and can be put back to stock within an hour but I can't see the reason why as the vents actually look stock.

 

Lads

R 12 served us well but the tree hurgers have more pull (or should I say tug). R134 is a good solution if the system is designed for its use. Our Older read better motorcars don't have the extra 25% more cooling volume needed by R134 to proper operation.
Next you have to deal with replacing oil and seals due to incompatibility. Yuk!

ICOR industries has a drop in product at lower cost than freon and has more drop from ambient temp with no change over hassles.

Wait for it!

Hotshot 414b automotive

Check it out !

Cheers
Robert
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This is a great thread!

 

Rob,

Any updates?

Did the new cores come in?

Hal

 

Rob,
Need your advice. The leading edge of my evaporator housing (77 GTB) is cracked and leaking water onto the passenger footwell, where my radio amp is located. This shorted out my speakers Sunday while on a date!! Pretty embarrasing! (not to mention keeping the entire area wet all the time..)

I need to repair the crack. My question is, is there any slack in the fitting connections, so I can maybe repair it in situ? Or, do I need to evacuate the R12, and then actually remove the entire blower/evap assmbly?

Here's my other option, and one I'm seriously considering: replace the unit with the more powerful blower you're currently researching. I do have a modern Sanden rotary compressor, running R12, so the system blows pretty cold, but I'd sure appreciate more volume during summertime here in Houston.

Can you give some advice on possible repair of the cracked housing? Seems like it's gotta come out.. Bummer.
Still, I'd be willing to pull it out and wait for the improved blower/evaporator, if indeed it is not too far from becoming reality.
Question--are you going to use the existing OE plastic case to house the new blower/evaporator?
Thanks for any advice you can give!
Greg
1977 308 GTB USA

 

Upon further introspection, all I really need is the plastic outer case for the evaporator...

Does anybody have one they're willing to part out? Otherwise I'm faced with having to purchase the full unit--even the used ones are expensive..

Greg

 

Greg,

It sounds like your red-headed girlfriend there got a little jealous of your date...



H

 

Ha Ha, funny, funny, Hal!

Never thought of it that way....

:=)

I'm about to pull the old one out today. Surprising how cracked the outer plastic case is...

Greg

 

OK, got it out..

The whole leading edge/side panel, below the fittings and mount bracket is gone. The forward mount bracket just fell off once I loosened those bolts.

No wonder I had a little water on the floorboard....


Geez...

Used unit on the way.


Greg

 

Rob,

Any updates?

Hal