Imperial: Sato off the hook - overheating!!

Ditto.

 

BTW, Honda already did this: They chose an American driver (Richie Ginther) allegedly for marketing purposes, and he got them their first win in '65.

Another neat USA/Honda trivia is that Honda's first win in '65 was Goodyear tire's first win in F-1 as well (IIRC).

(anyone remember the Goodyear/Pirelli years of F-1? Ferrari should be on Pirellis.)

 

Vaguely.

In my heart I always thought of Ferrari as a Michelin company: That's what they used when Gilles drove when the rest of the field was on Goodyear's. Only the factory teams (Renault und Ferrari) were on Michelins and Michelins are what my Ferrari came with dating from the same era.

This whole Bridgestone deal is utterly foreign to me. But times change I realize. A Bridgestone is something I'd put on a Toyota. No offense, but that's just how I feel.

 

Well, maybe the wrong assumption is that both cars are made to the same spec. This month's Sport Auto is reporting paddock rumours that Sato's blown engines result from the fact that his Honda units are a bit more 'edgy' in terms of performance and carry special parts, thus more prone to failure. The theory is that there'd be a conspiracy to get Sato ahead of Button.

 

And it is working just swimmingly well. Ahem.

 

Sure, and Dave Richards was on the grassy knoll

 

C'mon Jim, Jacques was a slouch. He didn't want to test. His salery ate into the development budget. He thought he was a #1 driver, but when his unwillingness to test bit him in the ass with DNFs on race day, he'd mouth off and blame everyone else; i.e., Indy 2002 "The car is slow in the straights, slow in the corners and slow everywhere." Well, no **** Sherlock. Jacques expected everyone else to do the work, then to simply furnish him with a perfect car; when he didn't get that, he'd stuff it into a wall, blow the engine or just not give a **** about the race. He mouthed off about Button all season , even though Button put to wood to him every weekend. Jacques got spoiled by his experience at Williams, where, like everyone said, he got his ass into a great car; problem was, he thought he did all the work.
He followed the money when he went to BAR, and he wasn't willing to put in his dues - period. JV was a multi-millionaire when he was asked to take a pay cut, to facilitate development of the car - he refused out of greed.
The good times that BAR are reaping now, are more about having the cash, and the bodies willing to work ( and part of that is not having the Jacques' anchor around the neck of the teams moral.) If he had any love of the sport, he would have taken the pay cut, done the testing, done the work and could now be enjoying the limelight; instead, he took the easy way out, whined about everyone else, and in the end, accomplished nothing.

 

Hey I did not start this thread!
But you are dead right, I am laughing and I know Sato does not deserve his F1 seat.

But I have changed my mind a little bit on Sato. There is something to be said for being the right person, at the right place and at the right time. Honda needed a poster boy for marketing purposes. Sato was there, the right age and at the perfect time for his career. He landed an F1 spot. Just sad to see a good seat beng wasted on an under par driver. Anthony Davidson, Timo Glock, Jacques Villeneuve... EVEN EDDIE IRVINE have a better stake to that seat if the seat was contested purely on talent and ability to perform.

But yes, the more posts on this thread, the more I feel my point is made over and over again. Sato does not belong in F1!

 

Wow, imperial, I am getting worried about you! (did some kid named Sato beat you up when you were young or something? No? Must be a secret crush on Timo Glock..)

What if, by some dumb luck Sato manages to win a race, will you be OK?

Maybe you should get a big jug of Jack Daniels from costco and put it in a glass receptacle with the sign "break glass in case Sato wins."

I recommend you have "practice drills" before every race on Sat. with those in the house.

Better yet, put in some fine young wine. It should sit in the case for a bit and age nicely!

(hehe, just kiddin' you know...)

 

No way. He came to Williams when the car was so good that just about any 'driver' could have won ... easy to work well with a team in that situation. BAR was going no where with JV ... JB made the improvements ... JV was to busy playing millionaire on his yacht, to be testing.

But BAR would not be where they are now with JV ... he had to go, he was wasting their resources and holding them back.

I'll let you make this comment because I now you are blind to Irvine ... but look at Jaguar NOW, Webber and Jaguar have moved way forward from where they were ... that is because Webber is there to win and this involves improving the car and team ... Irvine, er sorry, Tifosi but out of all F1 drivers from the dawn of time you could not find a WORSE test driver and team player. The comments he made about Jaguar while he was there were just like JV's and held the team back ... the too busy fncking the pit girls attitude instead of testing and giving good feedback was also holding the team back. Jaguar have (much to my amazement) actually moved forward and are doing a reasonable job now ... especially when you understand their very small budget.

Never. Once MS was not there to develop the car, Irvine's true lack of ability stood out like dogs balls. The fact that they went to Suzuka, a track that Irvine knows better than everybody else, and he drove a shocker race and never looked like he was giving it is all ... shows that he was never a serious contentor. You have to want the WC bad and raise your game ... it does not just come to you (again read 'Green races Red' a biography of Irvine when he went to the Ferrari team. His attitude to racing is just a joke. He believes that if you are going to win, you are going to win and the race will come to you ... just keep out of trouble and go around and around!!! Somebody called Schumacher has never even thought like that and that is why he wins races and WC's. How Irvine even made a career out of motorsport with that attitude absolutely amazes me and once I read that [I'll get the page numbers if you are interested] my support [yep I was almost a fan of Irvine] was destroyed). The only type of racing that suits his attitude is long distance races like Le Mans ... and he has a good record there.

I'm sorry Tifosi I know you love the guy and he is a family friend. I was not saying they are not okay people, etc. but that they lack something in the world of sport. It takes real hard work to succeed in just about everything. You cannot just leave the testing and car, etc. to the team and bugger off to the nearest night club. You cannot motivate the team to make you successful by damning them every chance you get ... it does not work like that. You are asking your mechanics and engineers to sometimes work 24 hours a day, not to make them successful but YOU the driver. You need to show the team that your in the game 150%, that it is your life, your everything. We know for a fact that it was not for either drivers ... just something to do ... and make a bit of money out of and help with the leg opening process.

Yep they do have gobs of personality but not for a team sport or any sport that I can think of. They would be far more suited as a chat show host or something ...

Who gives a fnck about that, the team don't want a commedian, they want a persona 150% dedicated to working with them and living the racing. Again Irvine was in the wrong game for the wrong reasons. I congradulate him for the wins he got and his casual attitude to life (gee sometimes I wish I could not give a damn like him ...).

Pete

 

I think I just brought you closer to Imperial and his love for best driver in the world and the best team in the world and the best car in the world...

As far as Irvine goes: Let's agree to disagree. I'm not unbiased on that one, so arguing with me over Eddie leads nowhere...

 

EVER!

The best F1 car ever made, the best team ever formed and the best driver ever to drive an F1 car!

 

Sato has never (as yet) allowed JB to beat him. Being a team player means working with the team and developing the car, not being a whimp and allowing the team to tell you to let the other driver win.

Rubens is driving the dominating car, ofcourse he should score points. It is tough being at the top as maintaining that level is hard ... thus we all expect RB to always get points, anything else is a failure.
Sato is driving an improving BAR, if he scores points he is doing well as is the team. Thus Sato and BAR have to try harder hence the accidents and failures are expected ... but we absolutely do expect a 100% effort.

Sure is ... but thinking about their respective situations should help clear the confusion a little.

Pete

 

I have always been a huge fan of MS for his work ethics and undying commitment ... why I am being questioned in that area confuses me ???

What I do not like about MS and Ferrari at the moment is that they will not hire 2 good drivers in the team, OR allow RB to 100% race MS.

Now a few years ago this was a good idea, but now that they have broken the drought lets get some racing going on and give the crowd a thrill, and lets even more prove and demonstrate how good MS is.

Pete

 

You should send in your resume and attach the above message to BAR Team principal David Richards. He needs some more excuses for Sato and to defend Sato having an F1 racing seat. Who knows you might land an F1 job in the marketing spin and public relations department at BAR. We would then need to get you a digital camera to post F1 insider pictures on the net.

 

I think Sato is doing good enough without me ... but time will tell.

Pete

 

I'm so happy we have threads like these to keep us above water. This three week holiday is killing me. C'mon F1 bring back some races. At this point I even take a boring one...

Andreas showing first withdrawal symptoms. This should be a F1 week dammit.

 

I know how you feel. I seriously do not understand the 3 week testing ban / summer holiday period. No one is on holiday. Most of the mechanics and engineers are in the factory developing their respective cars. They cannot test on the track, so big deal, there is always the wind tunnel.

Even the drivers are really not on a holiday. Most of them are going through physical conditioning and training. At least the serious ones are. Michael, Jenson Button, Rubens, and even Kimi said they would set a week aside for training.

SPEAKING OF KIMI! Kimi got married to his longtime girlfriend. Congratulations Kimi! Hope to see you wearing a red uniform in a couple of years.

 

I think it was mostly Eddie Jordan who started this summer vaca trend. And look where his cars are on the grid...

Kimi in red? Now there is a refreshing thought. I can already see myself wanting MS back for the press conference...

 

Ok Pete, for the most part we see eye to eye - but not on this one! I think RB is a pretty darn good driver and is getting better with age. A good car is certainly an asset, but when he has a car that is working exceptional, he challenges MS. We saw that several times this year. I do think the 2002 car was better than this years and here is why: RB is very quick with a good car. That is why we saw a lot more F 1-2's in 2002. This year the car is good, but I think we are seeing MS at his best. He has that unnatural finese to get the extra tenths out of a maginal car - not that this years car is marginal!. But that is where he stands out from the crowd, always has. Put Montoya or Alonso in the other Ferarri and they would be on the radio cussing at Ross about the handling and finishing where RB is now or below. Someone like Weber is in the same mold as MS. He must have been Flintstoneing with his feet to bring the Jag home that high in Germany! He has the finese. I think Kimi is getting there - but not quite yet. Jenson is the same. Say what you want about MS pairings, but you have to catch him to pass him.
Jim

 

Putting Webber ahead of Montoya or Alonso?

You gotta be kidding.

 

Sorry Hubert, but Richards is a snake playing the money game to save his butt with Honda. JV's mis-management did not help. I'm sure JV was watching his career dwindle away at hapless BAR and that affected his attitude. THat should not be an excuse, but there nontheless. Even the guys on the team who worked with him said he was very dedicated and a hard worker. (Richards spin again "not a team player") JV only commented on JB because he was lauded as the second coming and was as yet, unproven. I'm sure the press spiced this one up too. When JB proved to be quick, JV was one of the first to comment positively about him. Even JB said they worked well together and got along "OK", considering the team (driver)competition.

As far as JV's years at Williams? When have we had two drivers at Williams get along?!?! So don't even go there! They all want to drive there because he will always have a competitive car. And then after a few years, they can't wait to get away! Sir Frankies motivational techniques! They all become a product of their environment - the distrust that Frank eminates.

I would still like to see JV in a good car.

Jim

 

I don't understand how a driving style can cause engine failures.
It's not like you can over-rev while downshifting(or upshifting) in F1.

Can someone explain how it is possile to blow up an F1 engine with a driving style?

And, why is Kimi Raikonnen not blamed for his driving style when it seems that his engines have been blowing up consistently.(It appears to me that DC has had much more reliable car this year).

It seems unfair to blame Takuma Sato for his car being unreliable.

 

I will eat those words gladly if Webber is not on the top step next year! Yeah buddy, let the fun begin!

To be more direct, Whinny P. is the furthest thing away from finese as you can get. He spends more time pushing the radio button than his car. I also think that Alonso will prove to be just an above average driver. He is good, but Weber is light years ahead.

One thing we do agree on....We need a race!
Jim

 

Game on.

My belief is that MS, Kimi and Alonso are on the same talent level but with yet different experience behind it (MS obviously the most experienced). But hey, I've been wrong before when I thought Jenson to be the next title contender, although this year he does look vastly improved.

Webber is interesting: There are some folks (like you) who think he is the best and then there are some who think he is a complete idiot and then there are some (like me) who think he is in the middle.

We shall see next year when he sits in the Williams.