In for its first annual... not the good news I was expecting. | FerrariChat

In for its first annual... not the good news I was expecting.

Discussion in '360/430' started by s52, Jun 6, 2016.

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  1. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    So I dropped off my 430 today for its first annual service under my ownership.

    Just got a not too positive email about the car.

    The only good things reported are the brakes are at 9mm and the clutch is only 9.5%worn...

    On to the bad news:
    The water pump is leaking coolant,
    the gear box F1 actuator is leaking fluid, the muffler mounts are cracked and the front suspension ball joints have moderate play.

    The shop is tallying up the parts cost and I'm waiting for a response on the estimated cost!

    I take it these issues will not be friendly to my wallet! :(

    Anyone have any guesses at what the damage will be?

    -Christian
     
  2. blackbolt22

    blackbolt22 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 25, 2007
    5,808
    Boca Raton, FL
    Full Name:
    Mr. Anderson
    The exhaust brackets will continue to break. I've had 5 broken , 3 on one side 2 on the other, I replaced with Capristo units.

    The water pump seems to be a common problem. I think the F1 pump can be rebuilt.

    I would do an advanced search on all these items before agreeing to work done.
     
  3. ICULUKN

    ICULUKN Formula Junior

    Apr 11, 2007
    548
    Ahwatukee AZ
    Full Name:
    G.P.
    Does your car have aftermarket headers? If you are running factory exhaust manifolds get the Capristo brackets..
     
  4. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    No aftermarkets... just the factory Mk2's that were replaced a couple years ago. Thanks for the info I'll look into the Capristo brackets...

    I'll probably hold off on all repairs and do some research before committing to anything. Just wasn't expecting it. Only put about 1500 miles on it since I bought it a year ago and it had a clean bill of health then! Perhaps my lack of driving the car enough is conducive to the leaks. Ugh
     
  5. ICULUKN

    ICULUKN Formula Junior

    Apr 11, 2007
    548
    Ahwatukee AZ
    Full Name:
    G.P.
    If your stock manifolds are good, then look into the Capristo bracket... If you do not have the bracket you will continue to replace stock exhaust manifolds.. This would be a good time to go to headers if you were looking that direction already.

    The oil/water pump can be rebuilt.. So can the F1 pump.
     
  6. ar4me

    ar4me F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 4, 2010
    3,114
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Jes
    Guys, OP said F1 actuator, not F1 pump... Guess at estimate, if you are doing everything by the book, >$10k.
     
  7. ar4me

    ar4me F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 4, 2010
    3,114
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Jes
  8. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
  9. ar4me

    ar4me F1 Rookie
    Owner

    Apr 4, 2010
    3,114
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Jes
    Don't despair, you will have a fully sorted car with "reset" service history and years of enjoyment :)
     
  10. hessank

    hessank Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 8, 2005
    1,929
    Canada, Florida
    Full Name:
    Fred
    Have kyb handy and try not to scream too loudly.
     
  11. Stentboy

    Stentboy F1 Rookie
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 8, 2008
    2,813
    Texas
    Full Name:
    Ron
    Wow this thread is super sobering as I'm presently contemplating the purchase of a 430.
     
  12. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    Just got of the phone with the shop. Spoke to the tech who worked on my car. The water pump has a moderate leak, so getting that replaced for sure at a cost of around $5500 parts/ labor.
    To those unaware like I was... the water pump in the 430 is actually an external all in one water/oil pump hence the insane parts cost!

    The F1 actuator is just a minor leak, he thinks I can hold off on it and take a closer look at it during the next service. Also they have a place that will rebuild them at about half the cost of a replacement part.

    Lastly, the exhaust brackets are only a few hundred, and they have a local welding shop modify them to prevent the cracking issues.

    Anyways, just figured I'd update for anyone curious/ following the thread. Not the greatest news but at least only about half the damage I was expecting to be in for last night!

    -Christian
     
  13. ideloera

    ideloera Formula Junior

    Jun 2, 2015
    525
    Chicago
    Full Name:
    Isi
    The water pump is about 3k. You can probably do this one your own if you have a lift or a method to lift your car enough to get this work done. AW Italia sells rebuild kits for the water pump for about $500, might be worth looking into that.

    The F1 actuator is very expensive, you can get it rebuild for about 3k-4k (by GTE Engineering), plus labor for removing and installing. Buying new it will be about 20k including labor.

    The exhaust brackets are not that expensive and you can change and install yourself, superformance has them at reasonable prices. My exhaust brackets haven't cracked, I am running aftermarket headers, but once they do I'll go with capristo brackets.
     
  14. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    Thanks... unfortunately I dont really have access to a lift nor would I trust myself turning wrenches on this car.

    I will ask to keep the old pump though and look into having it rebuilt. Perhaps then I can sell it and recoup a little $ back.
     
  15. Jgivoo

    Jgivoo Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2016
    437
    New Jersey
    Christian,
    What year 430 and how many miles are on the clock?
     
  16. blkdiablo33

    blkdiablo33 F1 Rookie

    Jul 12, 2004
    4,454
    was there coolant on the bottom cover?was it leaking or just crusty around the weep hole?my friend had a 430 scud with low miles when under warranty had the waterpump replaced and after 2 years he was told again but just dried coolant stains on it he didnt repair it and its been again another 2 years with no coolant loss
     
  17. poljav

    poljav F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Nov 2, 2014
    10,000
    SF Bay Area
    Full Name:
    Pol J.
    Christian:

    Hi. Just curious as to which shop you are using? Thanks.
     
  18. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    '07 with 17.3K

    about 1500 driven miles since last years annual
     
  19. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    I didn't personally have eyes on it... but the tech told me it was leaking out of the weep hole at a "moderate" level
     
  20. RedTaxi

    RedTaxi F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Mar 1, 2012
    3,339
    New Zealand
    Full Name:
    Glen
    Considering the water pump can be unbolted from the oil pump I would source a rebuild kit. The major part of the expense is the dry sump oil pump, which is still healthy.
     
  21. s52

    s52 Karting

    Oct 14, 2014
    168
    East Bay
    Full Name:
    Christian
    Just found the waterpump rebuild kit from AW Italian

    Ferrari 430wpkit2

    I will ask the shop if they will consider rebuilding it for me. We shall see!
     
  22. andrew911

    andrew911 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 8, 2003
    2,894
    Northern NJ
    Unfortunately, these are all old Italian sports cars that while generally better built and more reliable than Ferraris of 30-40 years ago, still have stiff running costs. The classic case of you have to pay to play. No one likes paying a fat bill, but at the end of the day your car will come back fully sorted and then you can focus on it as what it is, a joyous car to drive that you likely worked very hard to be able to earn- any owner is fortunate to have one. The problem is when people think of these things like investments (with the multitude of valuation threads I read on here and obsessive thoughts on if cars will appreciate, not depreciate, premiums for stick cars, etc etc) if one is focused on these cars as an investment it will not be an enjoyable ownership experience.

    Christian- hopefully you are working with a great independent shop...the dealers are generally a lot more expensive if you are using one of them.

    I remember people saying how much more reliable a 360 is vs 355 back in '09 when I bought my 360 (car was the same age as your 430 is now)- at the end of the day still had a five figure repair bill during my 5 year ownership...any of these cars can give you a big bill- F1 system, convertible top if spider, exhaust manifolds (430 or 360 with the pre-cats that break apart), clutch, waterpump, etc etc. If you sort your 430 with these repairs, it sounds like hopefully you'll have many more miles/years before anything big bites you (but again, it is essentially a decade old ferrari so things can happen). It will be nice to get in the car and drive when you get it back from the service- you'll feel better!
     
  23. singletrack

    singletrack F1 Veteran

    Mar 16, 2011
    5,805
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Concur. That is the way you have to look at it.

    Also OP - think of it this way - at least you didn't get stranded or have to limp to service under stress.

    Good luck; this stuff always sucks.
     
  24. yangstein

    yangstein Formula Junior

    Mar 23, 2015
    571
    Orange County, CA
    Full Name:
    Brian

    +1. I totally agree with Andrew.

    Ferrari ownership costs money just like other cars. Yes. Honda, Lexus, Nissan will have a lot less to repair. My MB SL ran out of warranty but we decided to keep the car. A specific ABC problem which you could find hundreds of complaints on the web has cost a lot more money than my Ferrari. And my Ferrari is not a garage queen. Drive the car as much as possible is another way to get to know the car and prevent from surprise things.
     
  25. JWeiss

    JWeiss F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Nov 18, 2010
    12,234
    NYC and Long Island, NY
    Full Name:
    JWeiss
    I'm surprised at the clutch reading. The car's on its second clutch?
     

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