Incredible deal on a Mondial T Cab!!!!!!

Phil is a great guy...did me a huge favor by checking out my 308 11 years ago when Algar took it in on trade.

 

Any pictures? Informations?

Thanks.

 

good luck. the "market" is in the toilet right now.

 

HOOAAHHHHH!!

 

Thats one way to look at it. It would maybe be a sellers point of view. On the other hand, from a buyers point of view, there are good(or some would say realistic & fair) deals on these cars right now. Nothing wrong with that. Honestly, what do sellers expect people to pay for these cars anyways? The costs of keeping them up and/or restorations are WAY over what their value would be when complete. Thats a problem. Is it reasonable to pay $30K++ for a Mondial or semi-tired up 308 and then dump $20K into it? Then, you have a car worth..... $30K which you've spent $50K++ on. I sucked at math but this seems upside down to me. Buyers are probably more aware of what these cars really cost to own and operate and are figuring that into the equation. Maybe Im wrong, I dunno?

There are probably a lot of sellers that happened to have bought during an obviously artificial price spike and are now not liking what they are seeing. I understand, Ive been there with various things in life too. Not much you can do except hold out for "your" top dollar which you may or may not ever get. I remember right after Enzo died and people were trying to get $60K or more for their run-of-the-mill 308's. It was like "yeah, OK" :0

Interestingly, some of the other car markets are actually crazy with prices right now - the musclecar/classic American iron market is just stoopid with asking prices. Every clown with a Chevelle and nice paint job want $25K for their cars. These are NON-number matching cars too that are no more than just a clapped together hot rod with pretty paint and a detailed engine compartment. If they are selling at these prices, thats great I suppose. But, non-original 60's cars are just...non-original 60's cars. I partially blame the acution shows on TV. People see them parade perfect cars out there that get sold for $100K. Then, they assume that their Camaro "must" be worth $40K at least? Ah well.

Just saying.

 

I think you are a little off on the muscle car market. The price spike on muscles cars reached it's zenith right before the "great recession" or whatever people are calling it. Since then actual sale prices have plummeted, a similar scenario that played out with Ferrari prices a couple decades ago. This is readily noticeable by watching the RECENT auction TV shows. Sure some dolts see some of the auction shows that are 2 or 3 years old and think that you can make some quick cash off their cars as you described, but the fact of the matter is that very few if any of those cars are selling in this market..... similar to the point that Car Reaper was making on the Ferrari market and IMO which is very applicable. Just like in Real Estate comparing asking prices of vehicles has absolutely nothing to do with what cars are actually selling for.

Taking things a step further, but I feel that the softest market for classic cars right now is for cars that are priced somewhat for your "first time/average joe" type buyer...say $30k to $50k or so. I don't want to sound too political here, but those hardest hit by the recent economic plight yet again is the middle class for a myriad of reasons, who are the type of buyers that are invaluable in sustaining the market for the price range of cars I just referenced. That is why I feel that the perfect 3x8s along with the muscles cars you mentioned are tough sells at the moment. Of course there are exceptions to what I am saying, and perhaps things are improving just slightly for the "average joe" out there, but I have a feeling that a good number of the few buyers of these perfect cars are experienced collectors, with a good amount of experience with Ferraris in the past who are just looking for a bargain to add to their collection, or is perhaps 'downsizing' their collection. Yes, there are some folks on here that fit that mold, but these type of buyers in terms of numbers are way too small to sustain the market by themselves.

 

Perfect post, + many.

 

I hear ya Joe. I agree on the reasons for selling prices being down too. As tommot77 pointed out - the buyers for these cars(EG: middle-class working types) are hit worse by economic melt-downs than bigger cats are. Just the way it is. I didnt mean to insinuate that these cars are essentially worthless or that maintenance is way off the charts compared with other marques, but lets be realistic - parts ARE costlier and many procedures take longer to do or are harder to do. Thats just the way mid-engine cars are. I bet wotking on an NSX is just as tough as a Mondial if not tougher!

Yeah - why are there so many on ebay? I would assume that a large majority of F-car owners are enthusiasts and wouldnt even consider e-bay for buying or selling. Yet... go take a look. There are a bunch of F-cars up there and I cant imagine that every one of them is a heaping pile of crap, are they? Maybe they are.

I also agree that cash-strapped buyers are buying unrealistic about expectations with these cars. A $10K Mondy? Probably not a good idea. Double that amount or close to it and you CAN get a really decent car if you are patient and find the "right car".

 

Maybe I am off on the muscle market. I suppose asking prices are NOT what cars are actually going for. It just *seems* that these cars are at very high and many times unrealistic prices.

As for buyers of good used Mondys and 308's, I probably fit that mold perfectly. Luckily I still have gainful employment and am happy that we redid our mortgage about 10 years back and went to a 15 year instead of 30. Guess what? Lots of equity sitting there for me to raid(at least a little chunk anyways

So, Im one of "those" potential buyers. But I can see how the last few years have robbed several potential buyers of their ability buy one of these cars. Thats too bad. The more that dont sell or are just left to rot equates to less cars when things do come around again. If they got too rare then they'll be priced too high for said buyers.

 

True again. Transforming a 'deferred maintenance' car into a good driver is not that costly at all if you do your own work. It will take sometime as the engineering on these cars seems somewhat backwards and redundant at times. There are also a decent amount of 'work around/cross referenced' parts available, but again sometimes you can spend as much time identifying these parts as you would fixing issues related to these parts (especially if it were not for Fchat). But your time is only as valuable as you yourself deem it. Taking a cosmetically poor and turning into a councour car is what will break your wallet on these cars (aside from a catastrophic mechanical issue).

Ebay is what it is, a means to reach the mass market. Going back to my earlier post the mass market right now for these cars something below your "first time buyer/average joe" closer to "bottom feeders/bargain hunters" (hell I was one of these folks and got my 308 for chump change off of ebay last fall). There are good cars and bad cars on ebay, the one thing is going to remain the most constant on there is the market price these cars will garner. For example you would be hard pressed to get anything over the higher teens for a Mondial on ebay right now. Even if you take the "perfect" car that initiated this thread and put it on ebay it would struggle to get anything over $20k, but it sounds like it sold for close to asking price by word of mouth through the Ferrari community (the type of market outside the average joe/first time buyer/ ebay crowd). The ceiling on 308 QVs and carbed cars is in the mid $20ks, lower $20ks for the injected cars, upper $20ks and lower $30ks for 328s, and early TRs don't seem to sell for anything over the upper $30ks. Again, due to economic concerns, it is a specialized market for these specialized cars if you are trying to get anything above the prices I just mentioned.

 

Duly noted. The parts thing is important to me since I plan to try and do some of the work myself once I find the right car for me.

 

Good stuff here. So, not many of thees cars are actually hitting their reserves then, huh?

 

Unfortunately, virtually none of them are. Below is a link to the 'completed listings' page on ebay for 308s over the last several weeks (I think you need to be logged into an ebay account to view)...

http://motors.completed.shop.ebay.com/Cars-Trucks-/6001/i.html?LH_Complete=1&_nkw=ferrari+308&_catref=1&_dmpt=US_Cars_Trucks&_rdc=1

....Out of 24 cars only 3 sold (or supposedly sold, it seems a percentage of these sales don't go through as it is common to see 'sold' cars end back up on ebay shortly later by the same seller).

 

Geesh. Not a good ratio of sold to unsold! I wonder if a lot of buyers simply dont have any intention of paying or if they are assuming they'll get a loan or they'll sell their other toy in time or something? I mean, why bid and then not pay? The relist costs money too. What a mess.

 

i have an early RS / SS 4 speed camaro. 2 years ago it would have been a 45k car. i have it for sale at $15k, but i am not buried in it either. that nose bleed crap you see priced on ebay and cars.com does not mean that any of these cars are selling for that. blue chip numbers cars or COPO cars will always be worth more, but the common stuff is not selling. you have to have cash, cash , cash to buy toys now. there are no "loans" available to "most" people.

348, 355, and Testarossa prices will be affected more by the falling 360 and Gallardo prices, where as 308 and 328s will just sit around stagnant, though a few good cars will still sell.


i buy cars for FUN as much as anything else, and this market is nuts. there are just some cars i dont want, so the cheap ones dont even tempt me. (Mondial, Viper, NSX, JAP cars)

 

totally agree. i am looking for a QV, and some of the dealers and sellers are on crack if they think they will get $35-45k for a freaking QV. i can buy nice airplanes all day for that much.