If thats the case, would cutting the cats out and replumbing the system work, if the exising muffler is still good?
I have an ANSA sportsystem on my 308 GTB. I think it's one of the worst exhausts I've ever tried on any car. It sounds very average, rough and unrefined, epspecially at idle. Not only that, if you have ever pulled one off, you'd realise that those things are H E A V Y ! I haven't tried the TUBI or Stebro, they might be worse, I don't know. The ANSA's only redeeming feature is they rust like mad and so at least the thing is getting lighter day by day. Note, this possibly does not apply to USA spec cars as my AUS spec car has the Euro manifolds with no cat. The best sounding V-8 with a flat plane crank I have heard is a Lamborghini Uracco, I am not sure why the 308 can't sound like that. Carl.
Carl You mentioned that a Urraco had a better exhaust note than a 308, both being flat plane V8s - stock exhaust. How would you characterize the difference? Stock exhaust? Having replaced the stock Ansa muffler with a tubi, I can verify that the weight savings is remarkable. I love the tubi sound when I am in the mood, but wish it was a bit quieter when not. Am looking at perhaps one of the London Stainless or Larini systems if I could sell the tubi. best rt
What's mounted on my car now is the ca 1984 ANSA equivalent to today's ANSA Sport exhaust system. I have experienced no rusting problems either internally or externally. The chrome tips remain rust-free as well. As far as the sound, I'm pleased with what I have. It's a burble at idle after things have warmed up a bit and a pleasing exhaust sound at higher highway RPMs that's not objectionable for short periods of time, but can be a little too much on extended highway trips. I've never weighed the muffler, but when I had it off it felt like about 35-40 pounds. I'm not familiar with the current production ANSA Sport system. I hope they're still made to older standards such as mine. I think many 308 owners are seeking a Formula 1 type exhaust sound which might not really be obtainable with this V8 engine and its compression values and RPM limits. William, here's a picture of my OEM stock muffler originally installed on my 1976 GTB. For that year, it was a thermal reactor exhaust system which was a precursor to the catalytic converter. The reactor is internal and this whole thing weighs over 100 pounds. As the thermal reactor could not be removed as is possible with a catalytic converter, owners would just replace the exhaust system with the ANSA unit. Barry
i have an ansa on my 308 gtb qv euro model, it sounds just right, not to sharp or raspy. my 355 spyder has the tubi which i find a little much after an hour or so. my choice would be the ansa for best sound and something to live with on a long trip.
My '78 308 GTS has the original Ansa system with cats (US model). I plan to rid the car of the cats, and the muffler is in good shape. But, I'd love to simplify the plumbing from the headers to the tips by avoiding purchasing test pipes or resonators to fill in the void. Does Ansa make a muffler that will bolt right up to the US cars that is "catless?" I do like the sound that's a bit more mature for those 2-3am strolls back into my neighborhood and the current system is satisfying.
It would be interesting to see if cat .vs. non-cat headers are different. If they aren't, then a non-cat muffler should fit. I can't remember when cats were first used in V8 F-cars. Do all of the GTB/S series have them? If so, you might have to find an early GT4 owner to see if the headers are different.
I have an '81 GTBi. I replaced the stock exhaust with an ansa about 5 years ago. The ansa I bought deleted the cats and didn't require a test pipe or some sort of extension. It bolted up directly to the headers. In addition to the improvement in sound, it seemed to wake the car up a bit.
I have been around the block a few times on this issue--picking the right muffler to fit in my car and getting it installed--it isn't always easy (italian bugs get in the way) My car is an 80 USA --BUT the rear valence holes are spaced for a EURO muffler---go figgure--- and the hangers dont seem to be close to either so I had to fab 2 small brackets. Since I was installing a 308 4v motor I also had to cut and bend the inlet tubes to match up to the new headers--whew--not fun. And now I have a 328 motor in the car , which by the way uses the same headers ar 308v4--they still fit fine and sound awesome. ANSA ALL THE WAY! once again--here is the contact info for ANSA--a great person for info--and very enthusiastic also Paul Barry ANSA Automotive Parts Distributors, Inc. Toll Free: 800.841.9166 Direct Line: 478.788.6653 ext.109 Email: [email protected] P.O. Box 10215 Macon GA 31297 Fax: 478.784.1694 www.ANSAautomotive.com
[Since I was installing a 308 4v motor I also had to cut and bend the inlet tubes to match up to the new headers--whew--not fun. And now I have a 328 motor in the car , which by the way uses the same headers ar 308v4--they still fit fine and sound awesome. ANSA ALL THE WAY! We need to talk - would like to put the Euro system on my 3.2 qv. Do you have any pics or details of your adaptor brackets and other mods neccesary? Am ultra-interested in your experience; will also call Mr Berry today. many thanks rt
rt you may be interested in my muffler setup, a true dual exhaust (why not, the 3x8 motor is supposed to be 2 independant 4 cylinders working in harmony). it woke my car up from the tubi i had on there. let them puppies breathe. the whole setup cost about $1100 and sounds and looks incredible. i get a lot of comments at the shows and on the track.. i also had a custom dual cat setup that i can R/R for emissions testing purposes. Image Unavailable, Please Login
C Nero A very impressive system - very interesting you said it gave subjective power improvement over the tubi. What are the details of the system? Is it louder than the tubi? I had also always thought that that to take advantage of a flat plane crank (i.e., two 4cyl engines) you should have two seperate exhaust systems. Any other photos or comments? Could your shop make another? Many thanks rt
Must agree with cavallo_nero, go completely separate exhausts. Was going to replace the custom job that came with the Euro 308GTS QV here, yet after careful inspection by my extremely talented and experienced mechanic, he felt it was a very good system. He said the flow is very good and does offer (appropriate) back pressure. The exhaust came with the car as it was sourced from Jeff Edison (fellow Fchat member). It seems to have been custom made by: Advanced Muffler & Auto Service Memphis, TN 38116 (901) 332-2602 Price: ?$216? but not i am not sure of parts source. Receipt says "Custom Muffler -- Muffler Assembly" Enjoy the Drive, Steven R. Rochlin
Thanks much for the very interesting shots. How would you describe and compare the sound with other 308s you have heard? Wish I knew what is an appropriate amount of back pressure. At that price I could sell my tubi and buy 10. Many thanks rt obtw - I was also a huge fan of your PREVIOUS avatar beauty - what a sweetie.
snj5, (WARNING: i am a music lover/audiophile and review equipment professionally) The sound is VERY aggressive. More upper harmonics than lower at speed. At idle she is relatively quiet and has some low end, but not DEEP low end (i'd say not much below 50Hz). At 2k-3k rpm she is nice and full, if a bit "muted", if you can call a cat-less Euro Ferrari "muted" . At 4k rpm upwards it is about 100dB of mainly mid and upper sound/harmonic screaming. It naturally loses some of the previously dominating lower frequencies at higher rpm due to stronger upper harmonics taking the forefront. Even the mechanic says it is one of the most aggressive sounding exhausts he has heard for a street car. FYI: have quite a following at a few local shops. When they hear me near, they all run outside to hear the car drive by so i give them an audible show and go through a gear or three. Hope to get a prosumer digital camcorder soon and will make some recordings of a few drives. Will use my (TRUE laboratory grade) Earthworks M30BX microphones, though might also rent/buy a proper binaural setup. This way if i record in HDTV quality and use binaural, can deliver the HUGE file over the internet. With headphones and large HDTV screen the experience might be as close to real as it gets given today's (limited) technology. Might have to make longer sequences only available on DVD As for appropriate amount of back pressure, the guys at KTR www.ktrmotorsports.com took a close look at it, fixed a few weak welds on the exhaust, and the hanger part needed to be improved and did that for me. May revisit them for more Dyno tuning in the spring once the 60k major they did settles down. Well, not like anything is wrong with the 60k (they did great), just want to put a few thousand miles on her and do a revisit/check. >>>obtw - I was also a huge fan of your PREVIOUS avatar beauty - what a sweetie.<<< Thank you. Will be changing my avatar from time to time as new ones, eh hem, come my way Of course in the end what what REALLY matters is that we all... Enjoy the Drive, Steven R. Rochlin
my shop can make more, but each one should be tailored to the cars configuration, as mine is a euro setup. any competant muffler guy should be able to set this up pretty easily. magnaflow mufflers are readily available, and are the best for this application imho due to the research i have done. anyway, i had to increase my jetting by a full '10', from 130 to 140 mains (even at 6800 feet), and i can still richen it up - this is true scavenging of the exhaust gasses as each cylinder bank is allowed to pulse exhaust gasses with minimal interference, while keeping a steady flow, rather than dumping both banks into a big can like the tubi or stebro. it sounds great, not as loud as the tubi, a bit more throaty like a dual exhaust on a gm v8. and it looks great back there. for me, $1100 included custom installation and the mufflers, and for an extra $400, i got the dual cat bolt on setup for emissions. i bet other shops can do it cheaper, but my muffler dude is an artist, and knows i can 'afford' it since i own such a fine italian beast.... john 78 308 GTS euro with all the goodies.
cavallo_nero, Agreed that Magnaflow mufflers are the way to go if/when i replace what is in the Euro 308GTS QV that is here now. Like you, did much research. Nothing beats TRULY SEPARATE exhaust systems versus the other ones on the market. Your exhaust looks wonderful! And besides, the price is right too Enjoy the Drive, Steven R. Rochlin
cavallo_nero, Yes, it is a Euro (originally delivered to Austria) and was made in June of 1985. In other words, one of the VERY last (under 10) made and is quite possibly the last Euro to roll off the assembly line from Maranello. Trying to verify this and only know of ONE USA MODEL newer than this one that is still traceable as being "alive". In fact there are SOME 328-type parts on it and may upgrade to the better 328 cam belt protection cover pieces over the 308 protection parts as my mechanic says the mounting holes are there for it on the engine block Naturally if he had told me this during the 60k (not afterwards during the discussion of what had been done) i'd have had him just do it while she was there. Have been busy slowly but surely restoring/improving her. No worries, just more toys to get from Ferrari UK during my next order Enjoy the Drive (and music, Roger Waters "Amused To Death" right now), Steven R. Rochlin "...We did as we were told We bought and sold It was the greatest show on earth But then it was over We ohhed and aahed We drove our racing cars We ate our last few jars of caviar And somewhere out there in the stars A keen-eyed look-out Spied a flickering light..."
point of fact is that most of the 308 mufflers are truly (2) seperate systems--there are a few that are not, like 3084v USA and 328 that have a merging common pipe at the end of the headers that splits off again at muffler. but all 308v2 cars and euros have completely seperate pipes and chaimbers
