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Investment opinion F40 Versus Mercedes Gullwing

Discussion in '288GTO/F40/F50/Enzo/LaFerrari' started by 410SA, Feb 28, 2004.

  1. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

    Nov 2, 2003
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    Here's a fine dilemma at the same price.
    An unmolested practically new 1990 F40 versus a best in show winner perfectly restored 1956 Gullwing. Both around $400k.

    No poll, just opinions and discussion if anyone cares to.
     
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  3. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
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    didn't they build like an order of magnitude less gullwings than F40s? a few hundred -vs- low thousand?

    doody.
     
  4. F40

    F40 F1 Rookie

    Apr 16, 2003
    3,227
    Is this the F40 at Motorsports of Scottsdale? I'd say F40... A fun investment!
     
  5. JSinNOLA

    JSinNOLA F1 World Champ
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    Mar 18, 2002
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    Gullwing without a doubt...Now maybe if this was the first f40 produced it could be a different story...
     
  6. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
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    Dec 5, 2001
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    Herr Prof.
    Is that in US dollars? Did i miss something in values recently? I don't pretend to know alot about the Gullwings; there were some alloy-bodied cars but i doubt the steel ones could be worth anything near that. And, ditto, an F-40 at those prices. Perhaps, if it has 66 miles, it might be appealing to a collector( and worth more than market but still- 400k $-the renewed interest in them peaked a couple years ago, didn't it?), but then it would not hold value if driven. For those bucks, i'd buy a mint Daytona convertible and still pocket enough change to buy the little woman something nice, like a 50 thousand dollar bottle of wine...
     
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  8. zjpj

    zjpj F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2003
    5,938
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    Other thing to consider is the kind of balance you want in your collection between modern and classic cars. Obviously, your car collection is currently very vast indeed. But it seems like you also have a lot of overlap. I don't know how I would be able to decide what to drive between the Z8, the Maser or the SL - they all seem somewhat similar modern convertibles. In addition, while you have several "modern" Ferraris, none of them is one of the supercars. That said, you also don't have the 275 you want, or this Gullwing, which I think would be amazing to own.

    So, I suppose what I am trying to say is this: you seem to have a lot of cars that are very similar. I say, branch out a bit. I don't know if this is something you would consider, but maybe sell some of the current cars and get both the F40 and the Gullwing, since they both seem to fill niches in your collection which are now empty. I think you need a modern perfomance car AND a nice classic :)
     
  9. Artherd

    Artherd F1 Veteran

    Jun 19, 2002
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    Both cars are likely to eventually appricate in value, so neither one is a lousy buy. Fewer gulwings were made, but dare I say it, due in part to automobiles becoming less raw as time goes by, more people now desire the F40. (at least, more people willing and able to excercise their means to acquire one.)

    The F40 you can enjoy in the meantime, the gulwing will loose much of it's value if actually, you know, used as a car...

    Decision made for me, though both are on my list as well.

    The best would be; take a good look at your assets, and see if you are able to consider both.

    Each one is a pinnacle of automotive achivement that is not likely to be duplicated soon, if ever.

    Each one deserves a place of honor in your stable.
     
  10. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

    Nov 2, 2003
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    Thanks for the input.

    I too am having trouble understanding the price premium on this particular F40. The Gullwing on the other hand is a true iconic vehicle. There are approximately 700 surviving Gullwings, while there are close to 1,300 F40's around.

    The Gullwing is simply one of the most beautiful cars built and the problem is finding one that is fully and completely restored. One is available and I will try to secure it. Two sold recently at Barrett-Jackson, an OK one for around $380 and a beautiful restoration for $400.

    I figure that an F40 will be relatively easy to acquire in the future.

    The idea of a 275 and a Daytona convertible are also very appealing at similar pricing, but as of today neither one is available in perfect condition, that I know of.
     
  11. TestShoot

    TestShoot F1 World Champ
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    the f40 is still around sticker, the gullwing is so inflated it is going to hold that number but the 40 will go up, not the same percentage as the gullwing did if you bought one new back then, but then again the cost of ownership on a 40 (believe me here) is going to be a pain in the long run because the gullwings you can get parts for easily and the 40 requires routine maint on the seals rubber etc. it is a race car. the gullwing is kinda middle class vintage sports car, nobod turns their head that far for a all too common 'cedes, as they do for a 40, it will always be that way.
     
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  13. mondial85

    mondial85 Karting

    Sep 9, 2003
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    Oh I'd say the Gullwing. The F40 is still depreciating is it not? I havent looked in a while, but can't you still get Gullwings for closer to 300K? 400K seems a little high.
     
  14. Ingenere

    Ingenere F1 Veteran
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    Dec 11, 2001
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    Alex, Alex, Alex:

    You have too much free time!!! Can I have some! :)

    If you are buying solely for collectability...I think the Gullwing is the car. If you are going to be driving the car....the F40 will be a more rewarding experience (I still miss mine). If so...perhaps that low mile F40 is not the car. Really well turned out F40's are around (w/10-15K miles) for $250 or so.

    Anyway...if I know you you'll have both cars pretty quick! When are we doing an SL run. I did Canyon Lake last Wed and ran accross on new CS w/Montana tags and left him for dust (he probably didn't know the road). Poor bugger didn't know what happened!

    Talk to you later.....Ciao....Dino
     
  15. whart

    whart F1 Veteran
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    Dec 5, 2001
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    There are a couple of pristine Daytona convertibles; one, in Marrone, has been around the NY area for some time, i think it may now be on the AutoSportDesign website. I didn't realize Gullwings were fetching 400k; have you ever driven one? (They seem pretty claustrophobic to me). I agree that they are gorgeous, though. There have also been a few cut 275gtb/4's which, while in some respects a sacrilege, are rare because the real ones are so stratospherically priced, and the berlinetta so unlikely a candidate for cutting these days, that they might appreciate. But, I'd buy one to drive, as well as to look at.
     
  16. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

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    You can find them for $250 as well, but they are in condition appropriate for that price. The one I am looking at is flawless, with less than a 1,000 miles since restoration. It has been in the same hands for over thirty years and has had nothing overlooked in the resto. I'm comfortable with its value, especially taking a very long term view. I don't think I will lose significant value in the short term and the long term wil see appreciation better than growth in GNP.
     
  17. 410SA

    410SA F1 Veteran

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    Hey Dino

    Some misguided Pcar driver flashed his lights behind me on my way back to Phoenix today (I was in the Battlestar Galactica S55). Well he got a small taste of AMG exhaust fumes for a nanosecond before we left him a few miles back as we accelerated away in the Kaleeforneea desert.
     
  18. Victory

    Victory Formula Junior

    Jan 28, 2004
    410
    It's the Gullwing. No contest.

    A pristine delivery milage F40 can be had for AUD400,000. Market price for F40 is now around 160,000 to 190,000 pounds Sterling.
     
  19. JaguarXJ6

    JaguarXJ6 F1 Veteran

    Feb 12, 2003
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    Gullwing. There is simply more demand for them and being lower in production. Investment value its the safer of the two. But one you can enjoy, there's no question to that one. ;) For that year Gullwing those prices are too high. If it was a 1954, restored, I could believe it, but they will come down eventually and it will take too long before the F40 appreciates to a good level. Cars are great when the market is bad, however, if your going to drive it, you want a ho-hum car or do you want an adrenaline rush?

    Sunny
     
  20. Red348

    Red348 Guest

    I would go for the Gullwing without a second thought. Have you looked at:

    www.classicdriver.com

    Heritage Classics have one (described as original) at $258,500 and there is one in Costa Rica (fully restored) at $350,000.

    Good luck and please post pictures. They are always lovely cars to look at.
     
  21. Tennlee

    Tennlee Formula Junior

    Feb 10, 2002
    645
    Great Smoky Mountains
    F40... This is fchat, right? j/k
     
  22. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    AlexPapas....

    Great S55 story BTW !!

    I will speculate for a moment that the Gullwing is much more thinly traded than the F40. Probably by 5-1 in favor of the F-40.

    The demographic of a Gullwing buyer is someone "probably" 60+.........and there's nothing wrong with that, as a 10-15 year old kid in the 50's would be that age now........so, if it's a keeper then it doesn't really matter..........if a buyer will be required in 5-10 years it's going to be harder than it is today to sell it for what it's really worth.
     
  23. Boxer12

    Boxer12 Formula 3

    Jun 1, 2003
    1,672
    For an investment, you should buy a muscle car, or three.
     
  24. ze_shark

    ze_shark Formula 3

    Jul 13, 2003
    1,273
    Switzerland (NW)
    There is an article in last month's Sport Auto (France) on the 1954-57 300SL Gullwing.
    They rate a steel version at 230K€ and a an alu version at 250K€.
    The difference is narrow considering that 1370 steel versions were built, compared to 29 alu cars only. They confirm that the cars tend to appreciate currently. "Very expensive to maintain, ruinous to restore".
     
  25. nicola

    nicola Guest

    I wouldn't hesitate a second and certainly choose the F40! Excitement and emotions are guaranteed...
    Best regards
    Nicola
     
  26. David_S

    David_S F1 Veteran
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    Nov 1, 2003
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    I'd have to say both are over fair market...the F40 a bit more so than the Gullwing.
     
  27. GTB4NART

    GTB4NART Formula Junior

    Jan 17, 2004
    421
    Gullwing is always easy to sell quickly. F40 can take time - that's how I look at investments - how long they take to unload. If you look at cars as pure investments, buy 6 pristine 427/435 matching #s Corvettes. Always buyers, the guys who were 16 when these came out in 1967, they can now afford them.
     

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