Is a 328 with over 50,000 miles sale proof?

As I suspect that I am the one maintaining these "low mileage" cars that Dino refers to...I would agree 100% that these owners maintain their cars to a very high standard...and litterly have vehicles that are in "as new" condition.

Best,
David

 

Maybe myself and a few of the other low mileage 3X8s in my region are the exception.

I suppose buying a nice high mileage car (if you can find one) would save someone a bundle of $$$, if they just want a basic driver. The car may or may not drive similarly, but as I stated previously I have not seen any high mileage 3X8s that are in really nice condition...most are very shabby. So I suppose one could save, in the initial outlay. But then spend money as you suggest on the suspension, interior, paint, service, etc and by the time I'm done with parts and labor I'd probably put myself within a stones throw of what it costs to buy a really great lower mileage example, have lots of down time when the car is not driveable (while its being redone), and still not have a car the looks or drives like new. For me thats not really a savings.

Luckily, there are cars available in various states of condition and mileage to please all types of owners/buyers.

Best regards,
Dino

 

Hi David,

Yes, you do maintain some of the very low mileage cars that I know of which are in "as new" condition that I referred to. At least 2 of them are 328GTBs residing in NH, one is an 89 and other may be an early 88 (w/concave wheels). I've met the owner of the 89 on a few occasions (usually the Tutto show) and he has very high standards for his car.

Best regards,
Dino

 

"Is a 328 with over 50,000 miles sale proof?"

It would be to me. I don't mind driving the heck out of my 328 and put 4000 miles on the car in an actual driving time (I don't live where the car is garaged) of less than 3 months but I want the mileage to be ME driving/maintaining it. I wouldn't want a extremely low mileage car but something in the 25-30k range is what I was looking for and found. I understand all the lying and fakery that can be done so I realize that the determination of the mileage could be fraudulent but if the mileage, maint records, etc are in general agreement and make sense, I would be comfortable with mileage figures. However, if all you have is the odometer and nothing else, it becomes a bit problematic.

 

I have to agree with you on everything you said.


Furthermore, IMHO, unlike other luxury cars, the pool of buyers for Ferraris is extremely small to begin with. Also, unlike Mercedes, etc, there is a perception, whether true or not, that Ferraris are prohibitively expensive to maintain. The perception is particularly true as it pertains to higher mileage and "inexpensive" Ferraris, and especially in the current market. Hence, there are some Ferraris that cannot be sold at any price...except for parts, because buyers are more afraid of what bills will be awaiting down the road. The irony, of course, is that an older Mercedes or BMW aren't cheap to maintain either...but there is a perception that they are.

 

I think there may be a "natural" polarization between "drive" and "preserve", on something like a 328.

If you jump out of a minivan into a 328, are you getting the "full good" out of your drive?

Because I use summer tires on my 328, I park it for mid-winter. I find, in spring, that I tend to be somewhat tentative when driving it after a long lay-off.

But the more I drive it, the more comfortable I get driving it, the smoother the heel/toe shifts become, and the more enjoyable driving it becomes.

Those who aren't using the car as a "daily driver" might find themselves putting off a drive, because "it's a lot of work" to drive con gusto. So not driving may lead to less driving. While those who drive frequently may be more inclined to go out and thrash it a bit, leading to more driving.
(And the more you drive a Ferrari, the less you want to drive a minivan. )

Just a theory.

 

I drive my 328 once a week, my 911 twice a week, my M3 twice a week, my Ducati 998 once a week ( or 2) and depreciation be damned. Smiles per miles, priceless.

 

I had a 911 for 7 years and never once smiled...I kept saying, "Why did I buy this car?" I just never warmed up to it but it was a good daily driver and now at least I can say, yes, I had a Porsche 911! Re the Duck - great bike, I had a 996 and tracked it at Lime Rock quite frequently but I have to admit I have more "fun" on my Norton Commando.

 

Driver here. No longer care about 'miles'. There have been weeks where my 328
becomes my DD and I don't care. Almost 70k on the clock, so will be worth less than
a 1000 mile Yugo when (IF) I sell... I have anything that breaks fixed when it breaks,
keep up on all service, and just drive and frankly don't care. The 'investment' in the
car is a very small part of my overall situation, so I couldn't care less about 'resale'
value.

DRIVE THEM. HARD. OFTEN.

Resale be damned - just my 2 cents

(and back to the OP, I'd buy that 328 for $39k in a second if I didn't already have one!)

Jedi

 

I love my Mondial for weekend drives, blasts down the backroads, and evening drives with the wife. However, I would never want to use it as a Daily Driver. It would lose all of its charm. It seems out of its element in city traffic, suburban streets, and on long boring speed limited highway drives. We are fortunate enough to have other cars for that. Every time I ignite that glorious V-8, it should be an event. I try and go out at least once a week and escape with my F-car. My favorite time is just as the sun sets on a Sunday night when the backroads are empty. To be honest, this mileage discussion is more academic than anything for me, as I just find it very annoying that people who actually enjoy their cars find themselves getting a raw deal when they chose to move on. As for me, I would truly be devastated if I had to sell my Mondial. I hope to have other Ferraris in my life, but this one is very special to me. This particular car represents a life time of dreaming. I would love to pass it on to my children one day...hopefully after I have rolled the odo at least once.

 

Thanks for the support. Either way I couldnt sleep last night so I put the car back on the lift and gave it a good inspection. If there was damage, it still is invisible to me. All body panel gaps are perfect (door to fender, hood alignment, headlight alignment.). Lines are perfect and paint looks good. Undercoating looks factory with no discolorations anywhere. All the factory rivets look original holding the main body undertray on, etc. Carfax is clean, the title I have is a normal clean title (no salvage). Yea I know carfax is not perfect but what else can I go on. Car has 50k miles on it so something must be right about it. The front undertray is scraped up a bit, but that just looks like its from normal bottoming and curbs, etc.

I took it for a drive before I put it on the lift, and I started grinning again. These cars are a blast to drive and do bring out some emotions that most cars to not evoke.

 

do you know who owned it in silver spring? maybe i know him.

 

my guess is the car was still worth a pretty penny only being about a year old. If i remember, that was the height of the market. Probably got the star treatment on the rebuild. could be hard to tell if done well. either way, the cat is out of the bag and that one just went submarine.

 

I know the guy who sold it. He does not use the word severe lightly. But anything can be fixed. It is just interesting the original insurance co chose not to.

 

good point.

 

I bought an '87 328 in 1997 with 33K on it. I would think that would be the equivalent of 50K today. It was an honest used car with extensive records since new. I put 9K on it in 18 months and actually sold it for a profit since the market had improved. It broke a clutch cable but was otherwise bullet proof. I have since bought 2 '89 GTB's both with 7XXX miles on them. The first in 2001 I put 17K trouble free miles on. No sign of garage queen issues. I sold it a few months ago for 56K. I had a lot of interest in the car. Nice ones bring good money. I bought my current GTB a little over a year ago. I've only put about 1500 on it so far with zero problems. The previous owner bought it in 2005 with 5XXX miles. He is a friend of mine and had zero problems as well. I expect to keep and preserve this car and drive it regualrly but not a lot. I put about 4K/year on my 430 so the 328 does not get the miles it would if it were alone. If you buy a low mileage car, be sure the condition matches. They don't always. In fact, buy a car in nice condition regardless of miles.

As others have mentioned, the low mileage cars are often owned by perfectionists and the service shows it.

The neediest car I ever bought was an 85 308 with about 32K on it in 1999. I bought it cheap since it had deferred maintenance, but not cheap enough. It's really hard to buy this type of car cheap enough. Cosmetically it was very nice and drove beautifully once I poured in about 15K.

Dave

 

I know of another 328 that had heavy damage that did not turn up on Carfax even though the insurance company did pay a claim for repair. I don't think carfax is of much value on cars more than about 8-10 years old.

Dave

 

Another thought on the low miles cars are how often is the low milage car one that had an issue and got parked with an I will get a round to fixing it sometime when I have the money attitude? In long sitting other things seals hoses etc dry out.
That said, I have to drive my Mondial 8-- When I was looking at it on ebay with 31 000 showing on the clock, musing about it, the wife came in and asked what I was looking at, and then asked would I drive it--when I said yes of course I would drive it. She said "Go for it"
Next day was hook up trailer to truck and all day road trip for prepurchase inspection, bargaining, and return with the car.
I use it as a nice day driver and put about 5000 miles a year on it, doing all my own maintenance. Taxes and insurance savings over a new car of comparable initial cost about pays for parts. After depreciation I figure I am ahead and fun while at it.

 

Just to add my .02

As some of you have read in this very forum - I have wanted a 308 for about 30 years, after I first saw one when I was around ten years old. I finally was able to buy one as they are in my price range now. I found what I believe to be a very nice car (formerly owned by another Fchatter). It had higher mileage and I think I got a GREAT deal on it. It does not HAVE to be my DD, but I just might use it that often.

It was my dream to own it so why not live out the dream and drive it.

If all goes according to plan I pick it up on Thursday and will drive it about 400 miles on my maiden voyage with it. Wish me luck!!!


PDG

 

I don't think it's age. I don't think repairs show up on carfax. A salvage title might, if issued in a state which reports to carfax.

This thread got me thinking, so I checked: The owner I bought my 328 from had a (repairable) front-end collision, a couple of years earlier. (No salvage title.) The repairs were in the service records (from new), and I knew about them from that. But nothing showed up on the carfax I ran on it before buying it except MN emission inspections and liens against the car in MA. (I still have that carfax printout with the vehicle records.)


Since the car was local, I wrung it out pretty thoroughly to make sure the frame was straight. That, plus the miles, plus the paint condition, plus the economy at the time meant that I could buy in pretty cheap, and then put the money into an engine out service which replaced the hoses, fuel lines, timing gears, cross-over pipe, intake feeds, etc.

Cosmetically, it's a "beater" and I use it that way. Mechanically, it's a daily driver.

But that comes from knowing your intentions for the car when you buy it. I bought it to drive it.

If I'd wanted a concours car, I'd have run away from this machine. But a concours car would have cost a lot more.

Actually, there was another '88 328 for sale a few towns over at the same time. It had 300 miles on it. Yep, three hundred, total. It only got test driven after services. They were asking more than twice what I paid for mine.
(They were trying to get original sticker price for it ... but '99 was the dot-com collapse. I don't think they got it.)
(But I can guess how that came about: 1988 was the year Enzo died. Somebody put one aside thinking that Ferraris were about to become rare historics.)

(The funny part is that, in early '88, I passed on an '80 2V, because the price didn't reflect the skipped services. Six months later, I could have flipped the car, still unserviced, for about a 10K profit. You win some, you lose some.)

There are a lot of factors beside mileage that vary Ferrari prices.


But as for me, when I think of "restoring" a car, I'm thinking in mechanical terms, rather than cosmetic.

I'm not looking at the car from the driver's seat.

 

OMG! I was reading into the archives and saw these two '89 328s, both less than 300 miles!!!!

http://johnscotti.listingauto.com/en/usedcars/listing/details.spy?id=114394

http://members.cox.net/markop/1989%20328GTS/pages/cb.htm

 

Well I guess its all a perspective thing. If the car did have some repairs back in 1988, they were done in a fashion that put the car back to like new. I can't find any signs of repair, and the carfax and title are clear. The car is over 50k so its already out of that "collector" range and that is reflected in the price. It still drives perfect, and looks great. It is mechanically sound and certainly does not have any problems or issues that may typically be associated with a car that may have been repaired. It has had many miles put on it since 1988 so it would appear that the car is definitely capable of providing many more miles of both driving and viewing enjoyment. My motivations for selling are more along the lines of I need the garage space and I am 6'4" and have to take my shoes off to properly access to pedals (heel/toe, etc.) Even thin almost driving style shoes dont quite work for me. Given that, I don't get to drive it as much as I hoped and hence it sits.

 

If you really want to know what happened to the car, take the sparewheel-well out and look at the frame. If the car had a severe front smash, you will be able to see some evidence of it. Panels can hide everything, and making pop-rivets look good isn't rocket science.
That said, if the car tracks and brakes straight, tyres wear normally, etc etc, as well as taken into account that at the time of the accident the prices were absolutely sky-high, it is very possible that a repair at the time was painstakingly done, and the result a car that is as good as any other.

 

Here in MA we had a Euro 328 with 140+k miles. Multiple platinum award winner. Just shows you can drive and still have a pristine example. Just takes time and money!