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is a 928 a good deal?

Discussion in 'Porsche' started by Sherm, Mar 17, 2010.

  1. Sherm

    Sherm Karting

    Jul 7, 2005
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    Tom
    I was watching some British car show (no, not top gear) the other day and they did a profile on the 928 S4 and how it is a great bargain. I was once close to buying an '88 about 10 years ago but this particular would have needed too much work, but needless to say watching the show peaked my interest again. I did a couple searches online and it seems like for around 10k you find an S4 model, but most of the ones I saw were around 100,000 miles.
    Is it even worth thinking about? The rational side of my brain tells me that it would end up being a money trap and to stay far away, but my irrational pops up and says that 10k to get behind the wheel of a car I always liked seems like a bargain.

    please set me straight and tell me to stop wasting my time and potentially my money.
     
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  3. Highlow

    Highlow F1 Veteran

    Dec 3, 2006
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    It sounds like you're not in love with the car just because you doubt yourself.

    Wait until you find something that you HAVE to have.
     
  4. Sherm

    Sherm Karting

    Jul 7, 2005
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    not saying it is my dream car (although I did have a poster of it on my wall when I was a kid), but I can't afford my dream car. I can afford a 928. So it more of a compromise of a car that would be fun to own and affordable. The thing I don't want is to buy a car that is going to become a money pit. I would hope to drive it regularly and put a bunch of miles on it, and that is not something you typically associate with the name Porsche.
    I can't help but tell myself that "there must be a reason they so cheap"
     
  5. Dino944

    Dino944 Formula 3

    Aug 11, 2007
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    There are many variation of 928s, from the early 2 valve per cylinder cars of the late 70's early 80s with 220hp 4.5 liter engines to the final 928GTS with flaired fenders and 5.4 liter V8 producing roughly 350hp engine, and everything in between. I think $10K will be a decent driver from the early to mid 80s or a higher mileage 928S4. A very nice GTS with 35,000-50,000 miles will range from about $28K to $40K. I know a guy with a slightly moded 89 928S4 and he adores his car, drives it all the time, and its the 3rd or 4th 928 he has owned. He also does a lot of the maintenance himself, which saves a lot of money. I'm also acquainted with a guy that owned an 85 928S who said he loved the looks of his car but it spent a lot of time in the shop, cost him a fortune in repairs, and that he'd never buy another. These cars do have a reputation for being costly to own but I can't say whether its deserved. My Dad had an 86 928S when it was new and that car was a great long distance high speed cruiser, but a very heavy car and not as nimble as any of the other Porsches of its time. You should check out some of the dedicated Porsche forums to get more input on 928s and to get an idea of pricing.

    Best regards,
    Dino
     
  6. Helios

    Helios Karting

    Dec 9, 2003
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  8. 4re Nut

    4re Nut F1 World Champ

    Mar 27, 2004
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    I didn't realize these things held their value; are they old enough to where the "nice ones" are appreciating? Ironically, I stumbled across this ad a few days ago: http://www.greffmotors.com/vehicles.php?carid=15
     
  9. BlueBiturbo

    BlueBiturbo F1 Rookie

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    #7 BlueBiturbo, Mar 17, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2010
    Back in the very early 90s... 6 of my college friends owned S4 (autos and manuals) and GTs, ... I regret not buying one. Back then they were only 1 or 2 year old cars so no problem whatsoever. Some of them bought used S4s. Buy the ones with good service record, that was what they said.

    Go to specific Porsche 928 forum and you will gain much knowledge.

    O yeah... They were **FUN** to drive, gobs of torque (esp the GT)... never tried the GTS though.
    I am a manual 'box person but I love the auto in the S4, made driving in LA much more tolerable. IMHO the GT clutch is a bit painful to my left leg in city driving.

    To this day I regret not buying an auto S4
     
  10. Dino944

    Dino944 Formula 3

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    #8 Dino944, Mar 17, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2010
    A 1990 GT with 132,000 miles for $37,000 thats very wishful thinking!

    A quick check on Porsche Club of America's member sales area and there is a 5spd mint condition 928GT 5spd with 39,000 miles selling for $29,900. Later cars with 5spds also fetch a premium over an auto.

    There is also a 1990 automatic 928S4 with 33K for miles selling for $27K

    There is also a 1991 5spd with 76,000 miles for $24,900.

    There cars from earlier year that run and are in the $10K range. Like anything prices depend on condition and mileage.
    Best regards,
    Dino
     
  11. JOEV

    JOEV F1 Rookie
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  13. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    #10 Kds, Mar 17, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2010
    Sherm.......

    Here's my two cents......everyone posting here is bang on the money as well.

    Keep $3-5K a year set aside for repairs and you'll be fine. You may not spend all of it in that specific year, but you will need the balance of it during the next year.

    Seriously........

    I sold these when they were new, have personally owned them, resold many (>50) as used cars and have seen hundreds of repair orders in the last 20 years.

    I'd stick with the 1987 + 928S4 or GT and, if you can afford one, and are lucky enough to find one for sale at a "reasonable" price, buy the GTS.

    The 928 GTS is the best car Porsche ever made IMHO........

    For an example of the current market where I live, I presently have a black on black 1989.5 928 GT with 95,000 KM (58K miles) for sale.....2 local owners, I chased it for 10 years and finally bought it from the first owner in 2008, and then resold it to the second and current owner. Like new in every respect as it was owned by an engineer and now is owned by a computer techie. New timing belt, water pump and tensioners as well as tires....all records from new. No accidents per say, although 15 years ago the rear plastic bumper cover was replaced cause it cracked due to a <5 KMH parking lot ding. $22K CAD.........beaters cost $10-15K.............

    It's a car everyone has to own at least once in their lifetime.
     
  14. Sherm

    Sherm Karting

    Jul 7, 2005
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    Tom

    Thanks for all the tips and experiences. I must say, I am not sold. The idea of $3-5k in a repair fund a year doesn't work for me. Never know what will happen down the road, but for now it sounds like the 928 is just a pipe dream.
     
  15. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    Sherm......

    As you are on F-Chat.....what F-car do you see yourself "realistically" owning say in 5 years time or less.

    Compare the costs of the two (purchase and repair).......a later 928 versus whatever F-car.......it may help you rethink your position, then again, maybe not.

    Just my advice.......and an interesting exercise.
     
  16. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #13 Bullfighter, Mar 17, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2010
    You have to accept that the prices of 928s are low to factor in the probable repair/service costs. They aren't a "bargain" in that sense. It's kind of like Testarossas and and 355s in the Ferrari world -- they seem like a deal at $40K or $50K, but that factors in possible expenses.

    As someone posted above, if you're not in love with the car I would keep looking.
     
  17. BlackBird007

    BlackBird007 F1 Rookie

    Feb 22, 2010
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  18. Sherm

    Sherm Karting

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    I can't realistically say that there is an F-car in my future. I am just am a big fan. So far the nicest car I have had is a 350z. Unfortunately when the kids came, the Z went. I would love to get back to having a fun again, but I don't have the time or money to have it be a high maintenance car. This is by no means a high priority. One day the stars will align (or I maybe I will hit the lottery) and then I will figure something out.
     
  19. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    #16 Kds, Mar 17, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2010
    Fair enough......it's an interesting and eye opening comparison exercise to take part in though, which is why I asked.
     
  20. Doug

    Doug Formula 3

    Nov 13, 2003
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    I have owned 4 928's. All but my first, which was my first sports car I ever owned, was sold for the same or more than I paid. If you do your research on Rennlist and purchase a car that the previous owner has spent the money on, you can have a good time. Also helps if you don't mind trying some work yourself. Just about anything that can or needs to be done with a 928 maintenance wise, is somewhere online with a pictured tutorial. I still get the itch occasionally to buy one again. The most expensive issues I ever had to deal with on mine were new sets of tires.
     
  21. recoil

    recoil Formula Junior
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    My bud has a 94 GTS, red on black, manual. It's a very rare car. It's been super reliable for him. It's in superb shape, as is every car in his stable.

    He's been threatening to sell it for awhile. I've been looking for a 93 and up for months to no avail (will not accept an automatic and non-red).

    I have a feeling I will be looking for a very long time.

    Steve
     
  22. Doug

    Doug Formula 3

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    Your looking for a red 5-spd GTS? Good luck. I can't recall ever seeing one. I think that by the early 90's people were so sick of the 1980's Guards Red that they built very few and in general, not many GTS's were built.
     
  23. bounty

    bounty F1 Veteran

    Feb 18, 2006
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    I agree 100% - save up for a Pantera!
     
  24. zygomatic

    zygomatic F1 Rookie
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    While I don't have KDS' wealth of experience, I can second what he says. Like F-cars, 'cheap' 928s simply aren't. And $3-5K per year in repair funds is spot-on, provided you get a car that is in decent (or better) condition initially. 928s tend to be deferred-maintenance queens. Buy one of these and you can easily double or triple the annual cost.

    But when they're right, they're great cars.




     
  25. shmark

    shmark F1 Rookie

    Oct 31, 2003
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    I own and drive a 928 regularly and they are great cars. Phenomenal high-speed GT machines that will cruise all day at autobahn speeds without breaking a sweat, then hit the track and keep up with all but the most hyperactive sports cars. The $3-5k per year is a bit harsh although I have to admit to spending about $10k on my car in three years of ownership. In my defense, a significant chunk of that goes to the Fikse wheels, aluminum radiator and associated cooling updates, and a 3" SS/Borla exhaust setup, items I don't consider maintenance. But $5k in maintenance over three years? Yep. The problem with a 928 is so many of the parts are unique to the car, never shared with other Porsche models, and they made about 65k of them over 17 years - who knows how many are actually left. That means the aftermarket for them is relatively small. That said, there are at least three excellent aftermarket suppliers specializing in them and all three are top-shelf businesses. Hey this is a Ferrari site and if you can feed and maintain a Ferrari then you're ready for a 928. ;)
     
  26. forgeahead

    forgeahead F1 Rookie
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    Sep 16, 2008
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    I agree, they are truly beautiful machines. I had an '86. It's not so much the repair costs, but the damn electronic gremlins which cannot be diagnosed or repaired; and just become a constant nuisance (eg. a/c malfunction + window switches not working in 110 degree San Bernardino desert, etc., etc.). I would love to have another, but I do not like nuisances!
     
  27. Pcar928fan

    Pcar928fan Formula 3

    Jan 21, 2008
    1,685
    Austin, TX
    Dino,

    Right on with your insights. 928's are cheap, anyone trying to sell one for big bucks is dreaming or has a SUPER CAR!

    KDS, unless you buy a crappy car $3k-$5k/year is WAY to much! Maybe in the FIRST year, but again if you buy a good one...no problem...

    Go to Rennlist and sign on to the 928 forum...everyone over there is SUPER helpful.

    I have had 10 928's, two of them were/are parts cars that are gone, and the other 8 BEAUTIES park in my garage! I have TWO GTS's (one of them is the ONLY '92 GTS in the USA the other a '94), I can't recommend them highly enough! GTS's are EXPENSIVE though and S4's will get you about 95% of the GTS performance and looks for well under HALF the price.

    I have a full on 928 race car built on an '80 Euro S chassis, an '81, '82 (with 3660 miles on it...REALLY!), '84 S, '85 Euro S, '88 S4 and the two GTS's!

    If you like 928's there is no better time to buy and own one than now! There are WAY more aftermarket parts and upgrades for the car than there EVER were when the car was new. Also if you can do just a modicum of maintenance you will/can save A LOT of money. Almost everything that is possible to do on your own is FULLY documented on Rennlist too! Pictures and excellent write ups!

    You can PM or email me if you have other questions or ask them here...
     
  28. Kds

    Kds F1 World Champ

    #25 Kds, Mar 19, 2010
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2010
    Well, it's all in the perception I guess, and I am not disagreeing that if you that if get a good one you will be lucky, I am speaking generally here from my experience as stated above in my other post..........

    I am not knocking the car.......I love them, just saying that they can be (and most are) financial time bombs as they are so cheap nowadays, and have been for so long, that the average buyer profile for the last 10 years has been someone who has to sell their motor bike to get the down payment for the bank loan to buy one for $15K, but cannot choke down the cost of a timing belt/tensioner/water pump change....or head gasket x 2 replacement...or ZF transmission.......or clutch........or injection computer x 2.....or the various switches that all go........etc.......etc.........

    If you can afford two parts cars, and have 8 on the ground, your perception "will" be different than the average buyer.

    What did those two parts cars cost you anyways ?

    $5K +/- each ? There is a potential 2-4 years of maintenance expense right there.
     

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