Did you watch the 2012 season? Was Hamilton part of the "total package" for his team when he threw a tantrum and leaked data after Spa qualifying 2012 then quit and ran off to Merc? Prost was fired by Ferrari for saying their car drove like a truck. Senna? Loyalty? That dude would run over his own mother to get in a faster race car, he couldn't build anything. Strange examples.
He never has any proof, just spouts off his intuitions as facts. Been down this road with william many times on this very topic (behind closed doors at McLaren). It's just a waste of time.
In these days of excess of information and internet experts, I think that you can know when someone is at the top of his game when someone asks if he´s overrated. In the case of Alonso, both his detractors and his supporters mostly agree in that the problem is in his attitude, so I wouldn´t say that he´s overrated: everybody agrees in that, despite his many debateable flaws, he´s good at driving.
Where have you been in the last 4 years to ask for facts and links, The Alonso-Honda saga has been reported in every motoring mag, on racing sites, on TV, etc...almost on a weekly basis! IAlonso's outbursts went live on TV, as well as his deregatry comments about Honda. Now, if McLaren and Alonso were serious about F1, they didn't need distraction in the middle of the season, by going racing in the States. Indy wasn't on the F1 calendar, and there was nothing to learn there that would have improved the F1 car. It's obvious that Alonso was not interested in F1 already last season; his contract should have been terminated at the end of the year. McLaren has been carrying him as dead weight for another season. Right from the start, Zak Brown has been totally manipulated by Alonso, about Honda, and about Indy. He should focus on the F1 team.
OK then, it won't be hard to provide definitive links showing that Alonso convinced Brown to drop Honda. Where have I been? I've been intensely focused on the whole McLaren / Honda / Alonso story. There has been nothing remotely factual indicating what you asserted. That's your take, and that's cool. Everyone has a right to an opinion, but that's all it is. As for the "dead weight" remark, that's just completely and utterly laughable. It only serves to show that you either haven't paid even the tiniest amount of attention to McLaren or that you're so biased against Alonso as to be completely incapable of forming a rational opinion of his performance in the car. Without Alonso in the car the last two years, their point total would be absolutely horrific.
^Brown is in a corner. I’m sure he told Alonso he can forget the $40m a year salary (half of which Honda used to pay) along with the free ad space on the cars for Alono’s Fashion company and that they are not going to sponsor him at Indy next year, let alone the entire season. McLaren goes racing to be sponsored- not be the sponsor. They have to put everything into the F1 program now. Outside money is hard to find for them. Sainz ain’t gonna bring anything to their table. Brown gambled on Alonso, his team, and Renault to try to entice Alonso to stick around another year. He lost.
There is no such mountain of evidence. As I said, if that's your opinion, then great, but just admit that's what it is.
See, this is just more speculation and supposition. What free Kimoa branding? What sponsorship by McLaren? None of us knows how any of those deals were structured. Many people figured Alonso took the Kimoa branding as partial payment of his salary, which makes a helluva lot more sense, but none of us can prove any of that, either. Thus the reason you never hear anyone touting it as a fact the way you're touting your theories. Everything you just said there is theory and opinion. Brown said himself that they took a business decision to avoid hemorrhaging more and more prize money and sponsor money.
"That's your take, and that's cool. Everyone has a right to an opinion, but that's all it is." (sic) You see, I can play that game too. You only present an opinion, no links to show that nobody could have outscored Alonso.
LOL. Where did I say that? The answer is that I didn't. All I said is that he wasn't dead weight. Is it possible that someone else could have scored more in that car? Of course. Likely? No. You two are either very bad at this or you're just completely unwilling to engage in a rational and intellectually honest discussion.
We have different opinions about Alonso; that's all it is. You ask me for evidence of what is widely known in F1. The trail left behind Alonso is one of utter chaos, to quote Horner's polite remark. I don't need to repeat here all the fracas he has caused everywhere he went; it's public knowledge. The fact that he is on nobody's wish list is a good indication of his reputation in F1.
It's not just a matter of it being two different opinions of Alonso. You continue to bring forth speculation, innuendo, rumor, etc as fact. Very often what is "widely known" is nothing but horsesh*t, but people just accept it and repeat it ad nauseum without a shred of anything to back it up ... until it becomes accepted by the lazy or biased as 'fact'. When you're gonna make heinous accusations, it's best to bring some supporting evidence along. If you're not willing to do that, then get used to being called out over it. It isn't too convincing when you say "Well, everyone knows it. What's wrong with you?" when confronted over an unsupported claim. As for the wishlists, Merc & Ferrari didn't hire Ricciardo, either. He must be a bad guy, too, right?
We've yet to see Alonso vs. Stroll in equal equipment. So the jury's out on this topic until that happens.
..But the prospect of watching the stroller vs Checo or Ocon is mouthwatering......Nakagima vs Piquet or Alesi anyone?
Why does anyone have to present evidence to back up heir opinion on Alonso? in the end it does not matter. they guy has made Millions from F-1 he's going to be ok, regardless if he's one of F-1 all time greats or not. I personal qualification for commenting on Alonso is based on being an F-1 fan for over 48 years. As I've grown up F-1 has been "My" sport and I have been fortunate enough to have been in and out of the F-1 paddock over the years so have made some industry connections. from all that - my take is that Alonso has ruined his chances at a top level drive - as nobody wants his caustic aura... that is what you hear from the folks on the ground. he's just too difficult to deal with. in terms of raw speed - sure he's very good. but one of the greatest - no, because to be one of the greatest you have to show that during the down years as much as the up years and its about how you mold a team around you. all the greats did that - even Fangio and Moss... Clark, Hill, Stewart, Lauda, Andretti, Senna, Prost, Mansell, they all gave so much that the teams were functioning for them.... today only Vettel and Hamilton have that kind of loyalty... and not so much Hamilton.
Just yesterday I stood 15 feet away from FA after his driver team win in 6 hours of silverstone wec event. He was like a kid, a rookie who had just won his first race. Fantastic to see such passion, excitement and enthusiasm from someone who clearly has nothing to prove and nothing further to gain from the money ... a true display of enjoyment and elation.
One can understand why Alonso got exited with WEC success; the poor chap hasn't won anything since 2013! And even then, he wins without much opposition. It's going to be a lot more difficult in Indy, I think, where he will meet tougher competition. .
Ummmm ....... yes, correct ! However, I still believe he is the real deal as a world class driver bar none / very few. Remember watching him with Ferrari F1 at Silverstone and he was so much later on the brakes and earlier on the throttle than ALL of the other drivers .
