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Italian GP Sunday Sept.4th.

Discussion in 'Chicago' started by FerrariFrank1, Sep 3, 2005.

  1. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Frank
    Would anyone want to get together to watch the Italian Grand Prix tommorow,Sunday Sept.4th.?

    My guys at 'Ciao Bella' are now open for Lunch,but as of right now,just during the week. They are still hiring over there, (If anyone knows of someone that needs a Job....) And,are not open for Lunch on Sundays yet. But,as soon as they are,we can go there to watch the F1 Races.

    The Race will be Re-Broadcast at 11:30AM on Speedchannel. And,the actual Race starts at Noon.

    So,if anyone has an Idea,through it out. Otherwise,I'll just stay home and chill in my Sponge Bob skivvies,and watch it at Here....:)

    (HeeHeeHee! Who just had a Visual of that!....:) )
     
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  3. Daytona Rick

    Daytona Rick Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2005
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    I did and it wasn't pretty!

    Wish I could but got BBQs today, maybe next time
     
  4. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Yeah,I just "Hung Out" all day in me "Sponge Bob's"....:) I did leave for about 15 minutes halfway through the race to get an Italian Beef from Carm's,driving past Al Capone's final resting place on the way,and that was about it....

    Man,Ferrari has GOT to do SOMETHING!!! Too late this Year,but,lets at least see ONE Good Win,(not counting the USGP....) I usually put out my Tifosi Flag on Race day. But,I did wake up early enough to see the Final Results from the Early Broadcast....so,I didn't even bother today...:(
     
  5. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 3, 2002
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    Andreas
    Leave the flag rolled up. Ain't gonna happen this year.

    As I said a few months back: Those who went to the USGP might have witnessed a historic Ferrari F1 event: Schumacher's last victory. At least this year.
     
  6. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Yes,agreed! But I just cannot understand what the heck is Wrong!? I mean,after being so,SO Dominant for so many Years....The Cars,the Drivers,Everything. And,I cannot see how these Rule Changes made any difference.

    I guess that after so many Wins,perhaps they got abit Jaded...?...


    ("And that aint Right!"- By the 'Temptations'-"Papa was a Rollling Stone")
     
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  8. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 3, 2002
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    You're probably right on the jaded part, albeit it was probably only a minor contributing factor. Other reasons are:

    - This year's car was designed by a different guy who did the previous cars.
    - Ferrari is the only major player left on Bridgestone tires. Hence they can't accumulate as many test miles as the competition.
    - In the past you could change worn tires, not this year and Michelin made a better lasting tire. They also made a better tire in general.
    - The competition was always close, this year they made a step forward.

    Obviously the tire situation is a self inflicted gunshot wound as Ferrari chose Bridgestone. That helped them in the past, not this year.

    Next year it might be a total new ball game altogether with new engine (V8) designs and a couple more major teams back on Bridgestone.

    However racing dominance is cyclical. At some point the Scuderia was destined to fall behind. Just as Williams and McLaren did in the eighties and nineties. It is natural and no reason to get depressed. It'll get better at some point.
     
  9. sklitz11

    sklitz11 Formula Junior

    Sep 4, 2004
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    Vince C.
    Someone was going to benefit from all the rule changes. You knew it was not going to be Ferrari. They were the reason for those changes. Anyone that tells you otherwise is just kidding themselves. I 'm glad to see other teams winning but I would still like for Ferrari to at least be in the hunt at the end.
    I think the tire & engine rule are a joke for many reasons.

    If you are a race fan you still need to watch the rest of the races to see if Kimi is going to make a run at this thing. It's going to be fun to see how it shakes out.


    Thanks!
    Vince
     
  10. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Agreed. Those Tire and Engine rules really are B.S. I mean,look at NASCAR. They can change engines every week. Change tires as they like. CART,everyone. Why not F1?
     
  11. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Not to defend the rules (I don't like them either), but there is huge price difference between a NASCAR/CART/IRL engine and a F1 engine. The overhaul price of the F1 engine costs more than manufacturing a NASCAR engine.
     
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  13. sklitz11

    sklitz11 Formula Junior

    Sep 4, 2004
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    Vince C.
    I agree that there is a huge price difference between Nascar/Cart and F-1.
    Maybe keeping costs down is not a bad idea but F-1 is it's own worst enemy in some cases. Yes the price to have a team is crazy but there will always be those owners that will lay out the cash and take the risk because being a constructors champ is a big deal..$$$$$$


    Thanks!
    Vince
     
  14. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    All true. The costs btw did go down: The teams spend a lot less $$$ on engine overhaul and manufacturing because they need a lot less engines this season. However that money went into R&D for the existing engines. Basically from the machine shop to the CAD engineer.

    Although F1 is supposed to be the pinnacle and car manufacturers will stop at nothing, I don't want to a F1 field with even less teams. We're already 2 full teams short (24 is supposed to be the standard, some even say 26) and I don't want see further bloodshed because the Minardis of this world file for bankruptcy.

    Even though the FIA tried everything to break Ferrari's dominance, they also do have cost cutting in mind. Whether that is being achieved with the current rules is another question.
     
  15. RocketBoy

    RocketBoy Formula 3

    Feb 13, 2004
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    Professor Hajji
    When I first started to watch F1 some of the battles in the back were the most fun. Especially considering the fact Ferrari was not at all good despite cool drivers and systems ( Mansell, Berger, Prost and the F1 gearbox,) teams like Stewart had a chance, and Prost and Senna kept knocking each other out. Seeing no name drivers get a surprise point is always fun. Gaston Mazzacane, Luciano Burti, Taso Marques fininishing 2-4? A Jenson Button victory after JPM runs Kimi off the road? I can only wish. What ever happened to my hope that Enrico Bernoldi and Arrows would sneak in a podium after a Williams/Ferrari tangle in Monaco? F1 needs more teams. It would impact the teams and races from the top teams to the bottom feeders from one curve to the next passing in traffic.

    RocketBoy
     
  16. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Yes,I know that. But,in ANY kind of Racing,regardless,aren't you supoosed to be allowed to come and present the BEST that You have? I mean,isn't that the whole POINT of Racing in the First Place? Coming in with a "Used" Engine kind of misses the Whole Point. No other Motorsport does that. (Other than Vintage racing,I suppose....:) ) Geez...in Drag Racing,where a Top Fuel Funny Car will have 7-8+ Times the Horsepower of an F1 Engine,they rebuild the Engines after EACH Run! So,it should be up to the Team/Manufacturer if they want to use the same engine more than once,be it for Cost reasons,or whatever.


    And,if cost IS the Reason... "Hey,if you wanna Play with the Big Dogs,you gotta BE a Big Dog....or go home."( Bumper Sticker seen on a Pick-Up Truck...True,nonetheless....:) ) I'd rather see less,but more competitive Cars on the track,personally. Every week,the same old same old cars coming in last. Getting lapped. Getting in the way.....


    Tire Rule? Safety. Plain and Simple.


    Look at Motocross for an example. You have the Manufacturers Teams/Riders. Then,you have the Independents. No doubt that the factory Teams are going to Win,week in and week out. But,there are sometimes as many as 30+ Riders per Race. If that was the same case,you'd only have 4 Riders in a Race-All Factory Riders-from Honda,Yamaha,Suzuki,and KTM.

    So,I think that you would still have some great Racing in F1 if they canned the Engine Rule. Also,every Race,you see Porsche commercials. Why doesn't Porsche Race F1? They already have WAY too many cars in GT. Lamborghini? Chevrolet? Ford?
    .
     
  17. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Sorry, quite the opposite: They introduced the "no changing tires during the race" rule to reduce the amount of tires used for each race weekend. Basically to reduce costs.

    However dangerous tire failures such as the ones seen in Indy by Toyota along with the consequences of a flat spotted tire as seen on Kimi's car at Nuerburgring have rekindled the whole safety debate. From a safety perspective it would be more prudent to change tires several times per race.
     
  18. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Good questions.

    Porsche participated in F1 in the eighties with their own engine, which was very successful, but thereafter withdrew.
    Lamborghini participated as well and got their behinds kicked big time. Then they withdrew.
    Ford is still in F1 with their engines and continues to do so. And that's a good thing.
     
  19. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    No,I didn't mean it that way. I meant that the Tire Rule SHOULD BE Removed Due To Safety reasons. Which are far more Important than Cost reasons.
     
  20. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
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    Yes,I recall you guys talking about the "Lamborghini Experiment" that was tried back in the early 1970's.(or was the 1980's..?..:) ) But,Lamborghini has come a Long Way since then. I think that they may be able to contend if they tried....( Lash me with a wet Vermicelli Noodle....:) )
     
  21. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    If you ever come across that famous video of a race at a Japanese track with a F50, a Lambo, a NSX, a Porsche and a bunch of other cars, watch it. Apart from the F50 handsomely winning, the Murcie struggles to get past the NSX. Only at the end he finally manages to get by and pass the what 15 (?) year old design.

    Don't get me wrong, I love Lambos, but whether they stand a chance in racing is a whole different story.
     
  22. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

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    Oh yeah,I agree. But,then again,a Race prepared Engine is a whole different story than a Stock one. If they had the $$,and the Technology to Build an F1 Car. I think it would add alot to the F1 Racing scene. Also,a Porsche,Chevy,Ford,Etc....:)

    I mean,isn't Ferrari the only "Actual" Factory Racing Team,as in on it's own? There is "McLaren-Mercedes","Wiliams-BMW"."Jordan-Honda",ETC.... These are all Combinations,Partnerships,No? I am asking you,because "You are the Man in the Know" as far as F1 Racing goes. "I am the Man that don't know"....:)

    But,isn't that correct? No other Team is a Sole Operating Project of the Factory alone?
     
  23. Dave330gtc

    Dave330gtc Formula Junior

    Mar 12, 2002
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  24. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 3, 2002
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    Andreas
    Correct.

    Full F1 teams:
    Ferrari, Toyota, Renault

    And starting next year: BMW

    Frank: I don't know much about racing outside of F1, but there was some sort of GT racing where Lamborghini tried to participate roughly a year ago and they got their rear ends served on a platter. And that was a racing Lambo with racing chassis, engine, everything.
     

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