Buy

Italy and Coronavirus

Discussion in 'Travel' started by Albert-LP, Feb 26, 2020.

  1. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    I'll give you the vaccination rates in a minute or so, and you'll be surprised how high these are.
    But here are the breaking news, just two hours ago:

    The incidence rate climbs above the 50 mark again in Paris.

    The capital has revised its incidence rate at “above 50” this Wednesday morning, now reaching 54 per 100,000 inhabitants, according to the Covid Tracker website on Tuesday. It is the only department to return above the alarm threshold. This incidence rate now exceeds that of the “département des Landes” [the first one with a high number of “Delta variant” cases] where the authorities had delayed the lifting of health measures, which now stands at 50. Nationally, the incidence rate is now at 24 cases per 100,000 population.

    Among 20-29 year olds, the incidence peaked from 47 to 124 in one week in Paris, “Le Parisien” reported on Wednesday. Among 10-19 year olds, it climbed from 28 to 95. “These indicators remain at relatively low levels compared to the peak of the previous wave (during which the incidence rate exceeded 500 in Paris, at the end of March). But these are a stark warning signal, as the final stage of reopening began on June 30 " the daily writes, while nightclubs are scheduled to reopen on July 9.

    More than half of positive tests in Paris now carry the L452 mutation and "a large majority" of them are of the “Delta variant”, according to Public Health France. To cope with this situation, the authorities are betting on vaccination, as pointed out by the director general of the regional health agency of Ile-de-France, Aurélien Rousseau, on his Twitter account on Tuesday: “The “Delta variant” is progressing very quickly. It represents more than half of the cases in Paris now. We are fully mobilized to break the chains of contamination, but only vaccination will allow us to escape what is now emerging. "

    Rgds
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  2. To remove this ad click here.

  3. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Vaccination: figures on Monday, July 5th, early in the morning:
    • USA: 182.412.776 persons "having got at least one dose" or 55,11% of the population and 47,4% “fully vaccined" (= two doses)
    In Europe:
    • United Kingdom: 45.274.497 persons = 67,93% and 50,3%
    • Belgium : 6.987.327 persons = 61% and 35,6%
    • Italy : 34.750.832 persons = 57,57% and 33,1%
    • Luxembourg : 465.528 = 55,99% and 35,3%
    • Germany: 46.249.449 = 55,71% and 37,9%
    • Cyprus : 465.528 = 53,15 % and 41,6%
    • Spain: 24.326.621 = 51,83% and 39,7%
    • France : 33.961.307 = 50,68% and 34,5%
    • Ireland: 2.464.080 = 50,24% and 31,1%
    • Greece: 4.970.687 = 46,35% and 36,5%
    Rgds
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  4. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    Just on the news, the Delta variant is the predominant strain for infections here, especially in the Mid-west of the US. Hospitalizations are on the rise there, alla new wave. Common thread, majority of those in hospital didn’t get vaccinated at all, those who passed no vaccine at all. This is the push to get people vaccinated. As the US is so much larger, you have a state by state discrepancy in vaccine rates, ie: New York is at 70% vaccinated with one jab.
     
  5. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Yes, I know: I've read Dr Anthony Fauci's last interview, in which he clearly states the differences between cities, states, etc...("two different Americas") and also says that from the last 10.000 covid Deaths in the U.S, 99,2% happened to non-vaccinated people.
    I just hope that the general high level of vaccination in the U.S will somehow protect the non-vaccinated people: the Delta variant is highly contagious (see how the figures have progressed in the U.K these five last weeks, it's frightening) and very dangerous...not getting vaccinated is playing russian roulette...or even belgian roulette (= five bullets in the chambers)

    Stay safe...

    Rgds
     
    Albert-LP and Dai Baracca like this.
  6. Steelton Keith

    Steelton Keith F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Aug 19, 2009
    4,817
    Raleigh NC
    Full Name:
    Keith Hall
    Thank you Gentlemen for these posts. Here in the U.S. it is not solely geographical differences (region by region, urban / rural) but there is a significant and demonstrable difference in vaccination rates based on educational level. There is ample vaccine supply everywhere in the U.S. ...how many countries wish that to be the case for their citizens....and yet future victims insist on rejecting the vaccine. This borders on insanity, if not outright fratricide.
     
    Albert-LP and Nembo1777 like this.
  7. To remove this ad click here.

  8. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2006
    7,595
    opposite lock
    Full Name:
    Marc Sonnery
    Da vaxxeen it be a konspyraci to steal ma soul!

    Better to laugh than cry at these idiots...

    Here in France it looks like medical personnel will have mandatory vaccination and I agree with that.
     
  9. Albert-LP

    Albert-LP F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Sep 1, 2010
    7,003
    around Modena, Italy
    Full Name:
    Alberto
    #607 Albert-LP, Jul 18, 2021
    Last edited: Jul 18, 2021
    Also here in Italy infection rate is growing up: we are now at 3000 new cases every day over a 60 M population. But death rate is slowing down a lot and hospitalized too. With the vaccine you still can be infected, but the mortality probability goes down by 95% if compared to the not vaccined ones. These are the latest official Italian data: death probability drops at very low level if you get both vaccine doses. During fall/winter we were said we all will receive the third dose to face the new variants too.

    In Italy, at present day, 45,2% of the population completed the vaccine cycle with both doses.

    New infected average age in Italy is now 28 years old: they didn't get any vaccine dose yet.

    Ciao
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  10. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    Good to know
    That seems to the case in the US as well. The infection rate is on the rise, not a missile but climbing. The numbers also show that the infection rate is being driven by those who are unvaccinated, completely. Delta variant is the culprit. So looking for that silver lining, the vaccines do work. They are meant to keep you out of hospital and out of cemetery NOT keep you from getting virus. The youth also seem to be driving the infection rate here as well. I gave my sons Italian-Father guilt and made sure they were both fully vaccinated. Do it for your Nonna!
    On a lighter note, I have finalized all plans for Italia! I'm happy to be going home. Some time will be spent in Emilia-Romagna and the rest having some much needed R&R in Sorrento.
     
  11. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    We will have an idea of how much protection a high level of vaccination, considered globally, is able to provide a country with, by following the situation in the U.K, as they are well in advance considering contamination by the "Delta variant".
    Their "freedom day" is today, Monday, July 19th, which means they will lift all mandatory protection measures today. You will, of course, still be allowed to protect yourself, should you decide to do so, but nothing will be mandatory.
    On the other hand, the U.K is now at more than 50.000 new contaminations everyday, and it is still rising.

    Therefore, either their high percentage of fully vaccinated people (= 57,5%) is, considered globally:
    - enough to contain the virus, AND they will NOT get too many new hospitalisations...and the deaths numbers will stay "acceptable" among the "Non-vaccinated"
    - Or NOT enough to provide enough protection for the 42,5% left, that is about 25 millions, AND there will be more hospitalisations, another saturation of the hospital's emergencies services, and many more deaths...
    We should start to see the true effects in about three weeks, the usual difference between contaminations and deaths.

    As for France, we are now back at more than 10.000 new contaminations everyday, and it is rising. Not looking good at all.

    Rgds
     
  12. To remove this ad click here.

  13. Steelton Keith

    Steelton Keith F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Aug 19, 2009
    4,817
    Raleigh NC
    Full Name:
    Keith Hall
    One of my best friends has been trying to vist his daughter and grand kids who live just outside London. Despite "freedom day" quarantine and testing requirements still in effect. I think two required tests are around $ 200 USD each.
     
  14. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    I paid $150 for the lab tested PCR test to have the results in 15 minutes and then the travel docs emailed to me sameday within the 72hr travel window. When in Paris, my cousin brought me to a laboratory for the PCR, results were sameday and it was FREE!
     
    Nembo1777 likes this.
  15. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Indeed the tests are free, but this is now seen by the authorities as a convenient argument for the "anti-vaccines" not to get vaccinated: "why should I get jabbed, when I can test for free when needed?"
    There seems to be some abuse of the free tests, so they probably won't be free anymore, this starting in September.

    I think I have already mentionned elsewhere that I participated, for my job at the time, to a comparison between the french and american medical protection systems, this about 15 years ago.
    These exercises are by their very nature rather difficult to conduct, but the conclusion was that, on the whole (there are differences) the extent and level of protection was "similar", the quality of health care "close" (again, there are différences from one domain to another) and the global cost "very close".
    What was different was the financing:
    in France, most of it is organised by the state and the companies for supplementary coverage, and the financing done by these (net salaries are much smaller than gross salaries, due to the cost of health care) only a small fraction is under the responsibilty of the individual (hence some excesses, as some might think that health care comes for free)
    whereas in the United States, most of the cost is under the responsibilty of the individual: salaries might seem higher, but the cost of health care must be deducted,

    Rgds
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  16. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Not a contest between countries, which would be a grim one; and we are not going to have daily updates, other specialised sites are doing this very well...
    But: more than 18.000 new cases of contaminations in 24h yesterday, Tuesday, July 20th, in France.
    Looking bad indeed.

    Rgds
     
  17. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    @nerofer is it correct that you need to be fully vaccinated in order to go to restaurants, movie etc??

    also @Albert-LP is it true that Italy is requiring only you be fully vaccinated in order to enter the country?? a PCR test 3 days prior to your departure is no longer necessary?? Grazie
     
  18. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2006
    7,595
    opposite lock
    Full Name:
    Marc Sonnery
    Today my lady and I had lunch in Valence France at the brasserie of Anne Sophie Pic, next door to her three star restaurant, one of the top tables in France.well...zero Covid checking, mandatory mask going in and out but once you are at your table off it goes. Waiters were masked but not the valet parkers. To be clear we lunched outside.

    A lot of restaurant owner s are rebelling, don't want to play cop.
     

    Attached Files:

    VAF84, Dai Baracca and absostone like this.
  19. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    wonderful wine IIRC a blend of Viognier, Marsanne and some other Northern Rhone varietals.....
    under appreciated outside of Rhone
     
    Nembo1777 and greg328 like this.
  20. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Correct, but with different dates of application, step by step: I understand it has already started for some gatherings outside, museums, etc...it will start in August for restaurants and long-distance trains (Although how he restaurants will be checking is not yet completly clear).
    Consequences: a rush towards vaccination...seems that the reasoning is more or less: "if you want to have lunch or dinner outside, you need to be vaccinated, so let's get vaccinated"

    Rgds
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  21. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    In NY we restaurants had to be the "policing agency". by that I mean, once the restrictions were lifted for fully vaccinated people, they were allowed to enter restaurants and walk about without masks. It was on the "honor-system" OR as the owner I could request to see their vaccine card, much like if I was carding someone to verify drinking age.
     
  22. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 4, 2006
    7,595
    opposite lock
    Full Name:
    Marc Sonnery
    I really liked it and will hunt it down!:)
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  23. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    Yeah, but you Americans are more responsible and more disciplined than the French. What we will have here is that first, the restaurants owners will say (as said by Marc - Nembo 1777 - above) that they are not the police and that it is not their job to check people, so they will check only at random; and second, the French being individualist and irresponsible, people will cheat...
    I read three days ago that only 8,4% of all Parisians are fully vaccinated - the lowest percentage of the whole country - but nevertheless many restaurants are already chocked to capacity everyday: I find this frightening...

    Rgds
     
    Nembo1777 and Dai Baracca like this.
  24. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    I really had to chuckle...we Americans are more responsible...LMAO:p It is a regional thing here as well! When we were in the middle of this, the infection rates in the Finger Lakes region of NY was always higher than the majority of the State!! included NYC....you would be surprised at what you see.
    Now I also read that Macron said (I am paraphrasing) that basically it is up to those who have NOT been vaccinated to do so, the rest of society that has, should not bear the brunt of the restrictions and France needs to open. Basically he is calling those out to be vaccinated so that we can move forward.
    is that accurate??
    When I was in Paris earlier in the month, I found people to be respectful of the mask rule, especially when in stores whether a local restaurant or Boulangerie or in a big supermarket like Carrefour
     
  25. nerofer

    nerofer F1 World Champ

    Mar 26, 2011
    10,922
    FRANCE
    It's a bit more complicated, just like everytime the question of "public freedom" is raised, which, I'm sure you know, is a very sensitive topic here. But yes, this is the idea these last days.

    Basically, and trying to stay brief: the "unvaccinated" are saying that they do not deserve to be discriminated, that not getting the vaccine is their own right and freedom, etc...and that they should not be prohibited from accessing restaurants, etc...and not discriminated in any way.

    On the other hand, the rise in daily cases (20.000 the very last days, and the authorities anticipate "around 50.000 each day" for mid-August) is frightening the government, in so far as it can only be limited by vaccination; their worst fear is not really the number of deaths, but saturation of the hospitals and I.C.Us.
    And the government do NOT want to have to use curfews or lock-downs, or whatever again...
    So yes, the government is moving from what was, in the spring, basically a totally neutral position, kind of "you need to be vaccinated, but we will not force you to do so" towards a more pushing one: "you are still free to stay un-vaccinated, but then you will not be able to enjoy a normal life, and please do notice that you are endangering the others".

    Rgds
     
    Dai Baracca likes this.
  26. Natkingcolebasket69

    Natkingcolebasket69 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    Would seem that vaccinated people are less likely to get complications


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  27. Natkingcolebasket69

    Natkingcolebasket69 F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed

    They can still do what they want but they have to have a negative test. That’s the cost of their so called freedom!
    Those wannabe braves and revolutionaries irritate me !! And to see them wear yellow stars like the Jews?!
    Where are we going!!!
    Social networks have given a voice to utter idiots thinking their researches online make them doctors and the ones getting the vaccines are idiots manipulated…
    They all aggravate me!
    I’m French , I did my vaccine, but my wife here (and I love her) refuse to and she goes online and see all that non sense and is petrified… jeez this is annoying


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
     
  28. Dai Baracca

    Dai Baracca Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2007
    352
    NY
    Full Name:
    SB
    Grazie for the clarification @nerofer
    it seems to me that gvt could be doing a better job of explanation. the recent spike in numbers in the US is being tracked with Hospitalizations.
    The hard data shows that better than 95% of the people admitted to Hospital with COVID are all unvaccinated. No one in their right mind says the vaccine protects you from contracting the virus, but is certainly keeps you OUT of Hospital.
    We all should be concerned about blowing out the capacity in Hospital
     
    Nembo1777 likes this.

Share This Page