Jarama Registry | Page 67 | FerrariChat

Jarama Registry

Discussion in 'LamborghiniChat.com' started by Olivier NAMECHE, Sep 5, 2007.

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  1. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

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    holding the Jarama Registry, I know 5x Jarama which sold last year for more than 200k and none were fully restored, so, yes there is a lot to say more about it...

    almost Jarama on the market today are NOT in good condition, excepted three... one in USA, one in Germany and one in Belgium... the only one among all to be fully restored !
     
  2. bb4635

    bb4635 Formula Junior

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    #1652 bb4635, Mar 5, 2016
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  3. kc023515

    kc023515 Formula Junior

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    #1653 kc023515, Mar 6, 2016
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    I wonder which one is the red ex-US Jarama GT.

    The yellow Jarama GTS is : #10512, below is the same picture from ILR / lp112. Note the different shade.
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  4. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

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    #1654 Olivier NAMECHE, Mar 25, 2016
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    Here is a very nice Jarama GTS #10.600 offered in Holland by dealer VSOC :

    Lamborghini Jarama S silvergrey 49.000 km | Lamborghini | Collection | VSOC

    I know it for years in my Jarama Registry, as it belonged to French specialist Neldo Lévy Autodrome - Paris who used it as everyday car for quiet a long time before it passed to the current owner who really took good care of it.

    It recently benefits from a stripp off and a high quality paintjob including wheels, in addition to an overall service.

    Interior is original mix leather/clothe in senape color.

    I've no link with seller.
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  5. Peter K.

    Peter K. F1 Rookie
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    Looking for some thoughts.
    I have always had a fuel smell in the trunk. Recently, I did what have not done before, fill up the tank all the way. Since doing, which was a mistake, I've had fuel seep out the cap until it got down to 3/4, stronger smell in the trunk, smells in the passenger compartment, smells in the garage. AND, the fuel seep out of the top of the tank at the gauge/sending unit.

    Mind you, the tank is new or refurbished, the fill hoses in the trunk new. I am at the point of realizing the overflow tube that connects to upper trunk for one of the holes at the cap, the other end through the wheelwell, was cut and disconnected at the wheelwell dripping fuel in trunk when I filled it, drove it, and seeped out of the cap. But that does not answer why the smell was there while never having more than a 2/3 tank?

    I will post a photo of the trunk later. Also, source for rubber gasket on the fuel cap? Was going to remove it and bring to local auto parts suppliers I deal with. Cap should have a tighter fit.
    Now that I have driven and use about a 1/2 tank, the smell is less but still there in the garage.
     
  6. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm just not familiar with the system in the Jarama but you asked us to come over and try to help. The one in my Espada had so many issues.

    But this one may be common to both cars.

    The vent hose on both sides for S1 and S2 cars was a horribly designed thing. There is a homemade piece of tube on each side of a check ball inserted into the hose. It had a slit on the side facing the tank so that air could enter the tank when the ball sat on that side. Bob H. has found some marine style check vents and installed them in a couple of Espadas. I don't know about Jaramas ...

    I made the mistake of trying to refurbish mine and gasoline ended up getting sucked out that hose which protrudes under the decorative gas filler vent flap. That damaged my paint. So get new modern check vents.

    Other than that what I did to identify all the problem stops was to pressurize the fuel system very slightly with 1-2 psi of compressed air and then go leak detecting. I had so many places where fumes were escaping inside of the car that I replaced everything involved except the tanks which got de-rusted and coated.

    Hope that helps.
     
  7. BJJ

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    #1657 BJJ, Mar 31, 2016
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    Hi Peter,

    I forgot whether you have a GT or GTS. The fuel tanks are different for both, the S tank has an additional hose connector (I do not clearly recall for what, would have to look that up), whereas the early one has just the filler tube connector and the feed connector, as I recall. I will have a look this evening.

    In my very early (Euro) Jarama the trunk shows very slight (!) fuel smell since ever (I have it since almost 25 years), but I never had problems filling up to the top.

    Cheers, Bernhard
     
  8. Peter K.

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    #1658 Peter K., Mar 31, 2016
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  9. staatsof

    staatsof Nine Time F1 World Champ
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  10. Peter K.

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    I do and that's a great thread! Nice tank.
     
  11. Peter K.

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    #1661 Peter K., Apr 1, 2016
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  12. Peter K.

    Peter K. F1 Rookie
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    Sorry, I rotated them but they still post upside down.

    Do we know any shop in the US who has done this?
     
  13. BJJ

    BJJ Formula 3
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    Yes, Steves new aluminium tank is indeed great! Also imagine the lower weight, I would suppose that this is at least 5 kg less heavy.

    A pitty that it is out of view after fitting ... :D

    Cheers, Bernhard
     
  14. BJJ

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    At the Techno Calssica, Essen, I had a look at a Jarama offered for 240 k€ (I did not record the vin). A quite amazing price for a car, where the seller had not felt it necessary to get obvious things right. A modern black plastic filler cap and silver "painted" door handles would suggest to me that no real efforts in getting things right were made. Any good used car dealer would attend to such obvious optical issues for (comparatively) little money in order not to distract persons interested and somewhat knowledgable.

    It seems to me that at least some dealers rather rely on "investors", who think that the car is worth buying, if it is expesive enough .... :D

    Cheers, Bernhard

    P.S.: Another Jarama and an Espada were "sold" on Friday morning already.
     
  15. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

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    no real effort... what are you speaking about BJJ, did you wear sunglasses ?

    It is a several years restoration done by marque specialist in Italy : VIN is #10.202.

    It is not so amazing price when you have to consider or to compute a full mechanical restoration "nuts & bolts" done by marque specialists.

    For instance, even your German relatives (like Instinsky) are charging almost 80.000 € for engine/gearbox/differential rebuilt... if you then add the brakes & suspension, it is 20.000 € more, you want to continue ?

    Interior, glasses seals, cooling, tires P Cinturato, Ansa exhausts, paintjob, and so many other details.

    Total invoice is not too far from 170.000 € including VAT.

    Looking at the price of any project Jarama on the market and to the drivable ones offered for 200k € without restoration, just a service, 240.000€ seems a bargain as it is immediately available...

    The Tahiti Blue #10.486 sold for 215.000 € by "Aaldering Gallery" wednesday evening.

    Again the difference in between that unrestored GTS and the almost new GT is not at all an amazing price.

    Your expertise is funny to read considering you only paid attention to 2x minor cosmetic details without looking underneath or in the engine bay, or without asking why such details were not completed while all the others were effectively...

    The Black Espada sold for 175.000 € and the green Espada sold for 185.000 €
     
  16. Olivier NAMECHE

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    #1667 Olivier NAMECHE, Apr 11, 2016
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  17. BJJ

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    #1668 BJJ, Apr 11, 2016
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    Yes, I indeed stop looking, if (so little) money was not spent on such obvious issues jumping into the eye. Because in all the most cases shortcuts were then taken in other areas as well ;). This may - as a rare exception - perhaps not be the case for this specific car, I do not know. Getting the handles rechromed and obtaining a proper chrome filler cap looking at least somewhat decent, if not original, should set you back less than 500.-- €, even in the silly price regions for parts present nowadays. Why save these 500.-- € at an asking price of 240,000.-- €???

    Who the heck had the brilliant idea to paint originally chromed door handles with matt silver exhaust paint or the like??? I would not dare myself into the public with such a "minor cosmetic issue" :D, but rather prefer to leave it as "grubby" as it might have been (if I do not have the money for rechroming). And accept the modern black plastic filler cap only as an emergency replacement after having lost the original one far away from home and on a Sunday :D.

    Brakes and suspension rebuild 20k€? You are kidding ... :D. I am afraid not :D. Please note that coating of the parts with gold dust would not be original :D. I will not comment on some engine rebuild "costs", neither here in Germany, nor in Italy. Rebuilding a Lamborghini engine is no rocket science, in particular if you refrain from redesigning all internals and just rebuild it properly ....

    Cheers, Bernhard

    P.S.: I do not have any "relatives" in the trade, as you seem to suggest. And I myself am a private person (with respect to cars) earning my money in a completely different field (legal).
     
  18. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

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    #1669 Olivier NAMECHE, Apr 11, 2016
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    Well Bernhard, I don't had the science nor the skill, nor the time like you to rebuild any of my Bulls, I did several dismantling... easy stuffs, that's it !

    So like 85% of Bulls owners, I must give my cars to skilled hands, and it costs more than you seems to know apparently.

    Like many of my friends, I financed several Lamborghini restorations while you had the chance to save your money doing it yourself, what I do applaud.

    But will you be able to restore to the highest quality without making mistakes like a marque specialist ?

    Getting to the point, I'm able to compare the current prices all over Europe, I know what I paid for and I compared with my friends' invoices, the average is matching what I wrote above. And, it is an average for front V12, knowing that a Miura restoration cost 250.000 € excl VAT, don't you mind !

    If you have an original spare tank cap, yes I will be delighted to give it to the owner. Do you know this part is not available at the factory. So what do you do then ? do you have another source or another better solution than a plastic cap ?

    Even the Jarama GTS at factory museo has the same plastic cap... the part is no longer available for everyone...

    Regarding the door handles, the explanation is they had a kind of corrosion with hundreds small holes, none chrome refit was possible and they were awfull, so looking for another spare sets, they were put back to the car.

    So, the exhibition was not a "Concours of Elegance" with a jury...

    May be if these 2x details were fine & original, the price would be listed higher by 20.000 € like another Jarama GTS from one German relatives (it was at Stuggart Retro Classic, 2 weeks ago) advertising it for 260.000 € just with a new respray & interior, and a fresh service => Lamborghini Jarama S als Sportwagen/Coupé in Rupboden

    So, when you inquire for & inspect a car correctly (any Bull models), then you can write a report to Public Forum, but throwing words like you did is "free critic"... I disagree as it is a clear lack of discernment.
     
  19. Peter K.

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    Reminds me, where can I get a gas cap from or at least the rubber gasket? Is the cap from another car that will work for now? Need to fit some quickly (fuel spills out because of not a tight seal)
     
  20. BJJ

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    #1671 BJJ, Apr 11, 2016
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    Google, vented universal chrome filler cap less than 7.-- https://www.tecparts.com/haus-hof-stall-und-forst/haus-und-garten/garten/kleinmotorenteile/kraftstoffteile/kraftstoffteile-nach-fabrikat/universal/tankdeckel-universal-chrom-be-und-ent-p468582/tankdeckel-universal-chrom-be-und-ent-386207?gclid=CIO6keiCh8wCFUWNGwod3BcJHw Would need to look whether the diameter is correct, 5 seconds search, longer efforts would presumably yield even nicer results. 1000-fold better than a black plastic cap. I might offer my services to the factory, but then only at 1000.-- minimum, because I obviously have more searching expertise then they have. Ah OK, it is presumably intention to let the black plastic stand out, so that no one will be fooled by a nice looking, but non original chromed cap ... :D. Some kind of museal approach .. ;).

    If no one manages to properly rechrome the door handles (what I seriously doubt, there are techniques to handle these pitted zinc alloys for rechroming) there still is the possibility of recasting them e.g. in brass (easily chromed) using an original one as a template. This is a few hundred Euros only, so no rocket science either.

    I sometimes wonder where the "lack of discernment" is nowadays, but you are right, this is indeed problem of mine (just got an invitation to a science dinner talk ("What is "normal" today" ....) :D ;).

    Cheers, Bernhard
     
  21. BJJ

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    #1672 BJJ, Apr 11, 2016
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    Any NOS universal cap (preferably chromed and lockable) should fit, if your tank is the usual bayonette one and not some unusual variant, like in my Espada (screw caps, originally, the tanks carry the body number marked on them).

    A new gasket can be cut from a rubber plate of proper thickness and material (resistant against petrol, e.g. Viton). That is what I regularily (every 5 years or so) do with the cooler caps in order to keep then tight and functional, these are otherwise a nice source for trouble. I like to keep the original cooler caps, because the release pressure differs from the usual caps traded.

    Cheers, Bernhard
     
  22. Olivier NAMECHE

    Olivier NAMECHE F1 Veteran

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    yes the cap link in 7 sec, but yours have no key to lock...
     
  23. Mr Mezzanotte

    Mr Mezzanotte Formula Junior

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    See here for some better shots outside..

    Lamborghini Tanks | Axminster Specialist Panels
     
  24. Olivier NAMECHE

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    #1675 Olivier NAMECHE, Apr 15, 2016
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