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458 "Jerky" OFF-ON Throttle on 2012 458 Spider

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Corradosv, Sep 21, 2019.

  1. johnr265

    johnr265 Formula Junior

    Jul 1, 2010
    386
    Mid-Atlantic
    I had a 2015 and it definitely had a touchy throttle so I think you can expect it in the next one you buy as well. Those owners that don’t notice it have simply adapted. I did as well but remember not liking. It when I first got the car. This is much less of an issue on the 488.
     
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  3. Rdwaggie

    Rdwaggie Karting
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    Nov 6, 2018
    66
    My 2013 458 spider does the same but I wouldn’t call it jerky, it feels more like the car has two modes: accelerating or braking due the brake engagement when your foot comes off the gas as mentioned above. Question on acceleration though: my car from a stand still is more sluggish than I would have thought when you stomp on the gas. Once moving and the RPMs are up a little it is everything you would expect. Is this just the way the torque curve is designed on these cars or do other people get more responsiveness off the line (driving manual)? From a rolling start (even a slow one just getting RPMs above 2k-2.5k) it is very quick.


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  4. daflk

    daflk Formula Junior

    Jan 27, 2013
    257
    Hong Kong
    I’ve asked this in a separate thread but no response - is it possible to flash the TCU to improve shift speed? Even Pista uses same gearbox so hardware is capable just software programming


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  5. soulsea

    soulsea Formula Junior
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    Apr 14, 2018
    396
    Mount Pleasant SC
    Full Name:
    Serge
    #29 soulsea, Sep 22, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 22, 2019
    So everyone has a jerky off issue.

    Would explain the sticky buttons. [​IMG]



    I'll show myself out ... :)
     
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  6. chenging_r8

    chenging_r8 Rookie
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    Jul 15, 2020
    12
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    Chris
    Wonder if a tune to increase idle to above 1k would help. I find the jerkiness coming from when the rpms dip below 1k
     
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  8. oversteer

    oversteer Rookie

    Jun 28, 2007
    9
    Orlando
    Interesting timing on your post Corradosv as I was just planning to take my car into the dealer because of this issue. I'm new to my 458 since August but have been racing cars for more than 30 years (just did the 14 hour at Daytona this weekend) and something is not right with the engine management. Exactly as you described, the problem is after you trail brake the car into the corner and transition back onto the gas, that gap as you move to pick up the throttle causes a major engine cutout with loud crackle that tries to snap the car out of control. Or, light brake for a corner that doesn't require a downshift and try to ease the car down to the apex by breathing the throttle and it'll crackle and snap and fight you all the way. My thought is that maybe a previous owner flashed the ECU to get more of the exhaust crackles at the expense of drivability? Maybe I take Kabillie's suggestion and talk to Mase Engineering. Either way, I'm 100% sure it not right and there is no way the Challenge cars are racing with this issue.
     
  9. chenging_r8

    chenging_r8 Rookie
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    Jul 15, 2020
    12
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    Chris
    now that you mention that, I just installed a DME tune that added the burbles a bit. Can overruns really cause the jerkiness ?
     
  10. Corradosv

    Corradosv Karting

    Oct 17, 2016
    120
    Monaco MC
    Hi chenging_r8 and oversteer,
    jut to put all in just one post:
    On the cars I have experience on, the issue is sure there well past 1k rpm, I honestly can't say wether I feel it better/worse at low/high rpm's, but sure it is there all the way up to the full rpm.
    As for the interference between pops/burbles and twitchy throttle sure there is some connection, as pops/burbles are induced by leaving fuelling on during overrunning, as opposed to the full cutoff of the stock map (from 2011), plus maybe something else I don't know (e.g. a different advance timing in overrun); the first throttle touch comes right after overrun, so it is strongly influenced by the past combustion history, and the amount of fuel and available O2 in the intake charge. I can say that sure I have an issue with the stock map and, in general, a total cutoff during overrun makes the problem worse, as it shall be compensated by some sort of transitional enrichment in the OFF-ON, which is always difficult to control.
    I have no experience of any stock pre-2011 car, so I can't say whether they were better/worse in this respect, but following the above, as a very oversimplified rule of thumb I would expect that cars cracking in overrun are better in this respect, as they don't have a total fuel cutoff in overrun; or at least I don't think they are worse. But mind you: I have no proof of this, just I feel to exclude that adding pops/burbles was the cause of your issue.
     
  11. njcycleguy

    njcycleguy Formula Junior
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    Dec 27, 2008
    608
    Northeast
    Abrupt on/off throttle on 458's - pretty normal.

    On/off throttle with transmission "catch up" - not normal.

    The abrupt on/off throttle feeling was smoothed out when the 488 was introduced.

    Try to drive another 458 before you commit.
     
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  13. Il Co-Pilota

    Il Co-Pilota F1 Rookie

    May 29, 2019
    4,504
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    A.B
    The 458 just have really poor and sensitive throttle modulation. Probably the worst of any Ferrari. It was done to add "excitement".

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  14. Need4Spd

    Need4Spd F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Feb 24, 2007
    6,090
    Silicon Valley

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