Just an idle thought: is it possible to hold the French GP at Le Mans?

I know the French GP is set to return to Paul Ricard. But I was just thinking: is it possible to hold a race on the actual circuit where the 24 hours of Le Mans happens? I know the Bugatti circuit was used for the 1967 French GP. But if it were possible to use the Circuit de la Sarthe, imagine seeing F1 cars max out on the Mulsanne straight. It would be epic!

 

Sure it's possible, but you would need 40 cars on the grid to make it interesting. Too big a track for 24 cars.

 

Nop, the track is too big, f.1 tracks normaly don´t exceed 5 km, Spa is the biggest one currently.

 

Course is too long.

 

Couldn't they just decrease the amount of laps needed? Back when F1 races were run at the Nurburgring Nordschliefe, I think they didn't have to do as many laps as they would in a "typical" circuit.

 

The Le Mans track used for the 24 hour race is a temporary circuit. Portions of the full track are made up of public roadways that are closed only three times per year that I am aware of.

Here's the track that exists there most of the time - it is 2.5 miles in length, which if used for F1 would make it the second shortest track on the calendar after Monaco.

>8^)
ER
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^ Yes, I mentioned the Bugatti circuit in my first post. I don't think it was too popular with the drivers and crowds at the 1967 French GP, though.

 

Montelhery or Clermont would be better.........

 

+1. No one wants to wait 2.40-3 minutes until the field comes past again. Track is far to big for GP3 and GP2 cars as well.

 

Actually I don't think it is a bad idea at all:

If they use the pits and s/f straight from the 24 hours race and combine it with the Bugatti track, that'd be already a good start. Of course the real 24 hours track is too long, but the infra around the Bugatti track could be beefed up with grandstands etc to F1 standard.

Also Le Mans is relatively close to Paris, so flights etc aren't such a big deal.

Le Mans is not ideal but compared to other F1 places in France (Dijon, Le Castellet, Nevers) it is just as good/bad. And while it would cost $ to beef up Le Mans, you also need $ to revive Paul Ricard as it currently is way below F1 standards.

Not a bad idea, but I think in France (even probably more so than anywhere else) the fate of racing and a track is decided by local politics.

And finally: I'm not sure the powers that be are really interested in having F1 at Le Mans: It sort of takes away from the glory of either event. Personally I don't see it that way (and loved it when F1 was in Indianapolis' holy place) but I'm sure there are enough snobs on either side who don't want to deal ever with the other group.

 

Isn't there a maximum length for staights in F1?

Does the LeMans (straight) circuit exceed that maxium?

 

Yes, and Graham Hill pointedly called it a "Mickey Mouse" circuit...

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKT3KGBW08Y[/ame]

 

In 1990 the Mulsanne straight was split into three sections by the introduction of two mirror-imaged chicanes to comply with an FIA directive on maximum length of straights set at 2kms.

Mulsanne was originally 6 km (or 3.7 mi) long before the addition of the chicanes.

>8^)
ER

 

The surface of the Mulsanne straight is too bumpy for an F1 car i think. However, 24 laps of the 24 hours configuration would be awesome.

 

Le Mans is not ideal but compared to other F1 places in France (Dijon, Le Castellet, Nevers) it is just as good/bad. And while it would cost $ to beef up Le Mans, you also need $ to revive Paul Ricard as it currently is way below F1 standards.

Not a bad idea, but I think in France (even probably more so than anywhere else) the fate of racing and a track is decided by local politics.
[/QUOTE]

Andreas,

I have already said it in the topic about the french Grand Prix, but...the question of whether the fate of racing and tracks is decided in our country by local politics is not really relevant anymore.
The sad thing is that the country is now slowly but surely going autophobic...one of the two candidates for Sunday's presidential election has said that "Formula One is useless and there is no need for a french Grand Prix".
In fact, either the deal for the french G.P will be signed in a rush this week before sunday, date of the second and last round of the presidential election by the outgoing administration, or there probably won't be any Grand Prix at all. Except for hard-core racing enthusiast, the general feeling in the country is now that motorsport is useless, and the less we have, the better.
The Le Mans 24h has been spared until now, but I wonder how long it will stay so.
So the question of racing a french Grand Prix on the Le Mans circuit is indeed an interesting thought; but the actual question is not onto which track having a french Grand Prix; rather, it is whether the french Grand Prix will indeed be back?

 

Andreas,

I have already said it in the topic about the french Grand Prix, but...the question of whether the fate of racing and tracks is decided in our country by local politics is not really relevant anymore.
The sad thing is that the country is now slowly but surely going autophobic...one of the two candidates for Sunday's presidential election has said that "Formula One is useless and there is no need for a french Grand Prix".
In fact, either the deal for the french G.P will be signed in a rush this week before sunday, date of the second and last round of the presidential election by the outgoing administration, or there probably won't be any Grand Prix at all. Except for hard-core racing enthusiast, the general feeling in the country is now that motorsport is useless, and the less we have, the better.
The Le Mans 24h has been spared until now, but I wonder how long it will stay so.
So the question of racing a french Grand Prix on the Le Mans circuit is indeed an interesting thought; but the actual question is not onto which track having a french Grand Prix; rather, it is whether the french Grand Prix will indeed be back?[/QUOTE]

This is a sad but true statement... France - the home of Automobile racing... now hates cars. Last time we were in Paris - try to get a cab? takes for ever... they limit the number of cars / cabs in the city... instead they want you to use Velo city... ride a bike.... in all that traffic??


As for Racing at La Sarth... it would never happen becuase the AOC would never alow the FIA to have the circuit. However I love the idea.... I think from my last visit at Le Mans they could go from the first chicane back to the Bugatti track ... it would be a great track. lots of history.

 

Andreas,

I have already said it in the topic about the french Grand Prix, but...the question of whether the fate of racing and tracks is decided in our country by local politics is not really relevant anymore.
The sad thing is that the country is now slowly but surely going autophobic...one of the two candidates for Sunday's presidential election has said that "Formula One is useless and there is no need for a french Grand Prix".
In fact, either the deal for the french G.P will be signed in a rush this week before sunday, date of the second and last round of the presidential election by the outgoing administration, or there probably won't be any Grand Prix at all. Except for hard-core racing enthusiast, the general feeling in the country is now that motorsport is useless, and the less we have, the better.
The Le Mans 24h has been spared until now, but I wonder how long it will stay so.
So the question of racing a french Grand Prix on the Le Mans circuit is indeed an interesting thought; but the actual question is not onto which track having a french Grand Prix; rather, it is whether the french Grand Prix will indeed be back?[/QUOTE]



You can forget about holding a GP at Le Mans: the track is too umpractical for F1, beside it probably wouldn't be safe.

I think the disaffection in France about Motor racing is that, apart from Loeb in rallying, they don't have top drivers to motivate them. This year could be different, with Vergne or Grosjean (half-French) in F1. The French public used to follow Prost, Lafitte, etc...

The French GP disappeared of the calendar because Bernie Ecclestone asked too much for holding it. Unlike the Brits, the French don't think they MUST have a GP at all cost. That's sensible. I was surprised to hear it could come back. Did they have a change of heart?

France doesn't have a natural F1 track, so it will be between Magny-Cours, Dijon, or Paul Ricard.
Clermont-Ferrant, Montlhery are circuits of the past.
Bugatti circuit is OK for bikes, F3, GP2, but not for F1.

Le Mans itself, the 24h, will stay, because the ACO has a firm grip on the endurance scene, and has licenced the series in the States (ALMS), and in Japan. It also organises the European LMS, and the World Endurance Series in conjuction with the FIA.

There is a concept in France, that formula series have fallen under the influence of the "Anglo-Saxons" (F3, GP2, F2, F1, etc...) whilst sports cars endurance and GT are French domains (ACO + Ratel).

 

It's a sad era when the Nation that invented Grand Prix racing no longer believes in racing.

What's wrong with these people?

 

It's quite a lengthy track but it would all boil down to passing on the brakes into slow corners, or just before under DRS. There aren't many corners on the track for its length, even with chicanes, and I fear that any DRS, if it's still part of the formula, would be the decisive factor on every overtake.

 

This is a sad but true statement... France - the home of Automobile racing... now hates cars. Last time we were in Paris - try to get a cab? takes for ever... they limit the number of cars / cabs in the city... instead they want you to use Velo city... ride a bike.... in all that traffic?? [/QUOTE]

Tom,

I know this is an aside and we are not talking Formula One, but nevertheless it is automobiles, so...just for your information:
The taxi situation in Paris has nothing to do with any will to limit their traffic; it has indeed been known, and aknowledged by everyone, for years that there are too few taxis in Paris, but it comes from the way their profession is organised.
Any person wanting to enter that profession in Paris and drive a taxi would have to buy a taxi license from another driver or from the city, taking into account that the number of licenses is stricly limited; the price of a taxi license is today about 300.000 euros (this is what I have in mind but I maybe wrong, but not by that much) and is considered by any taxi driver as an investment for the day they retire, as they will sell back the licence: that capital is, in a way, becomes part of their "retirement package".
The consequence is, by supply and demand rules, that should the city administration decide to increase the numbers of taxis, as it has been trying to do for years, it means more licenses so the value of existing taxi licenses will decrease. A simple example is increase the numbers of taxi licenses by two, then the value of existing licenses will be divided by two.
You can therefore understand that those already holding a licence, and having paid for it, are doing there best to keep the number of license exactly like it is, otherwise they will loose money when selling their own license in the future...
And this is why our friends from abroad found it so difficult to find a taxi in Paris.

And as for autophobia, it is indeed growing; for a long time now, the Presidents, ministers, etc visiting the "Salon de l'Auto" are doing their best to avoid being seen in front of the stands of the sports cars, or luxury cars manufacturers...

 

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nZSosr9h8j0&feature=related[/ame]

 

It was the heavy death toll on the roads that made successive French governments tackle the problem by preaching that SPEED was uncool. The only way to get the message through was to eliminate the boy racers first, then drive the sports cars owners out of the road, limit the number of racing events, and stop advertising anything to do with speed.

I remember attending the unveiling of 3 monuments at Acheres (West of Paris) in 1998, on the strech of road that has seen 100 years earlier the first car to go over 100km/h, which was a world record in those days.

Remarkably, among the various dignitaries present who made a speech (Mayor, Minister of Sports, ACF Director, local MP, etc...) during the day, at the presentation, at the unveiling and at the following reception, not one pronounced the word SPEED!

 

And believe me, William, never, ever, try to argue that Germany, with no speed limit on its highways, is safer, or has a lower ratio of accidents per inhabitants than France!
Add to this the idea that automobile is now not ecologically correct.

Well, as for the french Grand Prix, nothing has been signed yet as for today, Thursday, May 3rd, 18:00; and if nothing is signed by our departing government with Bernie before Sunday, and the presidentials close as it seems they would on Sunday, I don't believe we will have a french Grand Prix at all...

 

A travesty.

 

Tom,

I know this is an aside and we are not talking Formula One, but nevertheless it is automobiles, so...just for your information:
The taxi situation in Paris has nothing to do with any will to limit their traffic; it has indeed been known, and aknowledged by everyone, for years that there are too few taxis in Paris, but it comes from the way their profession is organised.
Any person wanting to enter that profession in Paris and drive a taxi would have to buy a taxi license from another driver or from the city, taking into account that the number of licenses is stricly limited; the price of a taxi license is today about 300.000 euros (this is what I have in mind but I maybe wrong, but not by that much) and is considered by any taxi driver as an investment for the day they retire, as they will sell back the licence: that capital is, in a way, becomes part of their "retirement package".
The consequence is, by supply and demand rules, that should the city administration decide to increase the numbers of taxis, as it has been trying to do for years, it means more licenses so the value of existing taxi licenses will decrease. A simple example is increase the numbers of taxi licenses by two, then the value of existing licenses will be divided by two.
You can therefore understand that those already holding a licence, and having paid for it, are doing there best to keep the number of license exactly like it is, otherwise they will loose money when selling their own license in the future...
And this is why our friends from abroad found it so difficult to find a taxi in Paris.

And as for autophobia, it is indeed growing; for a long time now, the Presidents, ministers, etc visiting the "Salon de l'Auto" are doing their best to avoid being seen in front of the stands of the sports cars, or luxury cars manufacturers...[/QUOTE]

we go every other year to France.... usually Paris... Until 2010 I've never had any problem getting a taxi ... we usually stay on St. Louis and cross over to either Notre Dame or cross over the river to Chatlet and get a cab... but last time it was crazy- simply no cabs. the drivers I spoke to about it stated that Paris is limiting the number of cabs by charging higher cab taxes etc... but it really makes me crazy... that a huge city like that makes it so hard to get around on short notice.... when you are all dressed up you just dont feel like taking the metro, and then walking everywhere... and forget about getting a rental car... parking is CRAZY.

adieu!