L Calabasas & O.C. shut down?

While I commend anyone for standing by their friends and showing their loyalty...I still do not approve of the actions that I know happened ...poor economy is no excuse...as long as they were in business, they should have been better pre-pared or started negotations with VW/Lambo early on.

I do also agree that there is value to his business and yes he should not just "give" it back, however maybe the value,
(I do not know) is equal to or a wash of the incident, espicaly after you add in all legal costs and time to just be done with the matter.

I also agree with you that it was NOT 54 cars in 8 days, but a longer period of time as you state and then a so called "fire sale" of the last bunch of cars in short period of time....either way IMO it is still not correct.

 

From another poster on another board....I do KNOW some of the used cars DID have titles and were issued out...even if they were on the VW flooring plan...and cant comment on the new cars not titled as I do not know for a fact....but this does confirm as I have said that there is a "watch list" for these cars and their vins with all Dealers...and reagrdless of the outcome..I would NOT touch one of these cars on the lsit, not for any amount of "fire sale" to good to be true sale price..

And YES I have a copy of the VIN list and check all cars offered to me against the list, as a matter of fact have turned down three of these cars so far in the last two weeks...

Buyer beware...





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"I just learned from Lamborghini Dallas that there is in fact a list issued by VW headquarters of all car VIN's issued to authorized dealers throughout the country (and world for that matter) from this "fire sale".

They have been instructed to contact VW with information that one of these cars has been brought in for service and that they (VW) would take any actions deemed necessary.

I also learned that NONE....I repeat NONE of the cars that were sold came with a title. LOC did not have the titles to issue to the new owners simply because VW does not furnish the titles until all $$ has been exchanged. Since these cars were all still on LOC's floor plan and not paid for....no title to issue.

HOW DO YOU REGISTER OR RE-SELL A CAR WITHOUT A TITLE ??? This is worse then I thought. "

 

Well you have to keep in mind MOST all these cas were "Fire sold" to licensed Dealers, with that any Dealer can drive a car off a lot right away with their dealer plates and "await" the title or MSO toget to them...I wonder how many are still "waiting"..?

 

Correct...IN most cases a Private person will NEVER get a MSO or Co from the Dealer...if so it raises red flags right away!!

 

Here is a good and helpfull info from a member here posted on another board...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SdChris
See when a dealer buys a car, the dealer has to put the title in to there name, and the floor company will either list themselves on the face of the title or do a blanket UCC filing..either way you could be given a title as a buyer, but it still does not mean that the lein has been released...

To futher add...some of the cars of not yet been registered there is no way for VW to know where the cars are...
I made a long post about titles a few months back..

With all the talk here about titles and how they work and liens on file and liens on paper, I thought I would take few mins and explain the process! In this thread I am going to talk about some terms that are not common for anyone outside the car business, and maybe some attorneys! I will cover the difference between a wholesale deal, and a retail deal, what dealer reassignment is, in-state sales and titles and out-of-state sales and titles, and some differences in each state. I will try to explain the best I can, and how to avoid issues like the ones going on here, and how to protect you from a similar situation!

I will talk first about how dealers buy car for there inventory! When a dealership, needs inventory we use a number of different sources to buy cars, like the auto auction, a broker, a wholesaler, or a couple of different dealer trading networks. Dealers in most cases use what is called a “floor plan” line of credit. A floor plan is a system of financing that permits a dealer to borrow money to buy inventory, which becomes the security for the loan that is repaid when the merchandise is sold. Thus the floor planning lender places a “lien” on all stock inventories, until the loan is repaid! Normally floor plans are short terms notes 90-120 days full curtailment! If you have go to dealership, and you purchase a new car, and trade your old one in, the dealer would pay down the note at the bank on that one car they just sold, and re-floor your trade, pay off any liens you might have, out of the funds coming from financing or cash in the deal, have a clear title to the customer, and a clear title on the trade! Over the last couple of years, there has been a lot of talk of dealers not paying off trades, and customers are left 2 cars payments and there credit shot! How this happens is when a dealer is over extended his floor plan, and can not borrow on your trade-in, so he has to sell the trade-in first…in some cases it takes longer then 120 days to sell a car, so the customer is late 4 months of payments, and the bank is looking for the car! The new owner buys the car, can not get a free and clear title, and the former owner is left with negative credit, and the dealer receive a fine, faces jail time and refunds all funds plus interest to the parties.

When a dealer sells a car to retail buyer, the contract is between the dealer and the customer, the title is being delivered to the customer free of any liens, minus any financing the customer received to buy the car in the first place. Laws are different in each state, some being what called “title in hand” states which means the customer will receive a title from the dealership, with no liens listed; it will be a title in the dealerships name signed over to the owner. For in-state sales the tile will have also have a application for title with it, and any reassignment of title to the lien holder, and where the title needs to be sent once in issued to the new owner, either to the customer with lien noted or to the lender with lien noted. In some cases, when the dealer or lender sends the title to the customer because the state requires it for the owner to register the new car, the new owner might neglect to inform the state there is lien on the car. So the state issues a title free and clear. Shortly there after the finance company will notify the state the customer xyz, bought vin# abc, the state then notes the title and send the owner a letter to inform them they now have a lien on the car.

Let’s say in between this process a customer decides “hey I can make some fast money here lol!” And they then go sell the car, they have a free and clear title, so they go there local broker, sells them the car, the broker has the seller sign the title over to the broker, and seller collect his payday! He disappears and takes the money. The broker who bought his car has no idea that the title has issues; he decides just wholesale the car to a different broker or wholesaler. When the broker sells the car, he is not required to place the title in to his name, so he reassigns the title to the new broker, who in turns markets the car to a wholesaler where the title just keeps getting reassignment form broker to broker. In this case there would be a free in clear title in the hands of each broker and everything would appear to be fine! But remember the state sent the original owner a copy of the lien that was reported to them by the finance company, and he felt like getting rich and sold the car!

So now a retail customer who wants to put the car in his garage finds the car, so he buys the car. This retail buyer does not live in the dealer’s home state, in some states the dealer doesn’t have to register the car to there dealership, keeping the circle going, of dealer reassignment to the retail buyer. The new buyer drives his car the first 30-120 days thinking “WOW, I feel so cool in my new car, but now I have to go get plates and pay tax” So he takes his dealer reassigned paper and goes to his court house, to a titling company and pays his tax and lic. Drives home! Remember that the first owner received from the state that there was lien on the car, but he choose to sell the car first???

Well here’s ware it gets fun! Since none of the other broker registered there car into a dealership name, the car stayed under the radar…So because of the lien the original owners state sent the letter about, now shows up, with this being the first time a new title gets issued, Boom his car is gone! So the buyer would go back to the dealership he bought the car from based on the lien now found, the dealer would be obligated to return the buyers money, and follow the paper trail all the way back to the original owner

This could happen, weather the sale is a in-state or out-of-state. In some sates the dealer is not required to flip the title into the dealerships name until the car has been resold to a retail end user. Since the new owner has temp tags, the selling dealer would move to place the title into the dealerships name at the time of sale…So for at least 20 days, the dealer and the buyer thinks everything fine! At some point during the temp tag period, the dealer would receive a letter from there sate DMV letting them know that a title can not be issued because there is lien listed in another state…At this point the dealer, would start back-tracking all the way to lien holder, and get the facts…The dealer then would call the customer and explain what has happened, and them return the car, or the dealer could work to clear up the situation on there end! So you can see how tricky this really could get!

This is how VW is going after the cars or so i have been told...VW still has open liens making a new issue not possiable. That leaves in some cases the new owners without anyway to register the car. VW would still own. That is the point of the UCC and or the lien in the first place.

 

Some very good points Chris has here...and helpful info..

I am a state that DOES not require Title to be transfered into Dealer name and can re-assign and re-asign and re-asign..Chris State DOES require Title in Dealership, which after this Deal I think is a way better idea and have been lobbying my State to change too such. Currently it is only a cost of approx $38.00 to do it in my state for a dealer...big deal, BUT most Dealers are against it as it is costly and time consuming AND they do not want to wait for a title from my state, which for a dealer takes 2-4 weeks.

Since this, and since I like to always learn...I started that we ONLY take in cars that I DO re-assign the TITLE into our dealership name...it protects me and THE BUYER in the long run for a clear and good car. Yes it costs me a bit more in having to not offer the car for sale for 2-4 weeks till I ge the title..and yes it costs intrest fees and possible lost salel keeping the car under wraps till then...BUT I KNOW I am getting a clean car and do NOT have to worry and have something come bite me back in the ass...

For trade ins, I ALSO do this, to make sure the end user DOES not have an issue...I also do not use flooring plans and run my biz totaly on my own cash..this way I can show a possible buyer a TRUE AND CLEAN title, fully released car Period.

As a matter of fact, any car I take in I provide PROFF OF PAY-OFF to the seller PRIOR to them releasing the car to my truck and taking it away from their home...again to make sure they KNOW they are getting the right thing done here..

WITH my own cash I KNOW my cars AND our consigment cars are free and clear and CLEAN as a new born babys butt!!

I think this should be the law all over the land!! IMO