lamborghini is better than ferrari

ok, i will expand.

the glorious feel you get from a, for example, 1990 Testarossa, is not the same glorious feel you get from a 550 or 575..... The glorious feel you get from even more recent 355, is not the same feel you get from a 360 or 430.
Here is another, the glorious feel you get from an F40.....you will not get from an Enzo... And you see where it is going.

The glamour has always been there, in the old cars, and is definatly still there in the new ones. But the feeling from the old Ferrari has disappeared.
Lamborghini still manage to keep their glorious feel of flamboyence, without losing the modern glamourous appearance. Ferrari have JUST taken the GLAMOUR and nothing else from the old cars.

I hope it is understandable.

 

Hmmm. Interesting.

Is it that the sensation that it is an EVENT every time you use the car, or see the car, or hear the car, is no longer felt with the newer models of Ferrari?

But surely you feel the 'event' of an Enzo every time you drive it. Or is it the more extensive use of electronics and computers in the newer cars that dilutes the "glorious" sensation?

I have yet to drive any Ferrari, but from what I've read from owners suggests that the glory is still there.

Do you think the Gallardo still possesses the Lamborghini "glory"?


Your thoughts,


Cavallini

 

I see where you are going.

The Gallardo is a new franchise so to speak. It was made for marketting and the image of the marque. But it still shares the flamboyence of the "modern" Lambo.

It is in the event of seeing the car and driving the car, just general things.
I have driven a 355 spider as well as a 360 spider, and the feeling for me was different. Ofcourse the 360 will give you the "ferrari" feeling, because of its italian engine, but it did not show any heritage. The new ferrari greets you with more of a hugo boss appearance, while the 355 gave somewhat of a classic ferragamo feel. The new ones are very chubby and just not as beautiful as they used to be. Of course they will give you the "glorious" feel because they're still Ferraris, but that feel will not be better than any of Enzo's cars. Thats my main point...not to say that the new ones have no character, which they do - but before people always accepted any Ferrari car for what it was, now today I see people going for other marques because perhaps they realize Ferrari aren't what they used to be. But, the thing with Lamborghini, is that they only got better. The Murcielago is easily the best supercar of current day. It can be driven everyday, it has the intimidating look of a lambo yet modernized, has the signiture V12 pitch of a lambo - only its better built than a diablo would ever be... Gallardo shares the same pros as the murcielago in which, it is a good quality exotic, will also being the 'affordable' lambo, it still have the presence of something crazy, and looks more serious than the rival 430. You could say, Lambo are currently better in everyway, the murcielago being better than the 575, no question - and the Gallardo being arguably more interesting and one of a kind, yet the same price as the 430. But the feel of a Lambo and the feel of a Ferrari are both desireable feelings... so it comes down to what you want/preference.


- Surely you feel the 'event' while driving an enzo, but you just feel as if you're in another exotic V12, with paddle shifts.... Very fast car, yes, but do not tell me it will give a better, more satisfying feeling than an F40, or even F50.... that is not possible... ofcourse it gives you the excitment of a modern Ferrari, but no modern one will ever outdo the classics...

 

I agree with you pal.

 

Wolfgang

You are my hero.

 

Good try Tom.


You have it backwards.

 

I see. So perhaps the unique spirit of Ferrari has been diluted in the pursuit of faster lap times or something else. Do you think this is the difference between an Enzo and a F50, or a 355 and a 430?

I haven't seen a Gallardo or a 430, but from the pics I must admit the Gallardo's line is cleaner, more self-assured in some way, and slightly more aggressive than the 430's. In the flesh I might have a different view, however.

Forza,


Cavallini

 

It could be the problem. The Enzo and 430 are very good performing cars, against thier rivals... But I think this is the case for alot of the newer cars- just look at Porsche... The 993 is most probably the best looking 911, but it wasn't much of a performer. Yet the 996 turbo can keep up with a murcielago on the track. But the 911 has grown to be bulky and chubby, just as the new ferraris... The classy simple look has gone, and therefore its just not the same. Sure the F50 is a monsterous car, but compared to the Enzo it actually looks more refined. You notice how, if you go back yrs and yrs, the Ferrari get more and more flamboyent, but more explicit through the designers. Even the Gallardo, has that bubble shape, that most all the new sports cars have. (i.e 360, 430)
If they are at that point of design now, who knows where they'll be in 10 yrs.
But back in '95, for example.. it wasn't about laptimes or really much of any performance...it was about how a car made you feel. Before the F1 paddles and navigations, etc, sports cars had a different meaning. All of that affects the design as well.
You'll notice cars not only looked better, but gave a better feel, back in the early 90s to '98.


Yes, the 430's design is not acceptable. If anything the V12 car of the period, should look obnoxious and have lines angled at random points....but the V8 car must be the simple, sexy appealing car which everyone will love. (i.e 355)

im hoping you notice the trend-

 

nönö, he is still on stage while the other player R.I.P

@ Carlo_Costache, bonjourno + welcome!
Yes, some things are missing in the 360 and 430.
The look, feel, smell, sound and behaviour of famous F cars like the 275, 308 and the 355 will never come back. It's over now.
Glamourous appearance (bling bling) and better performance is what the marketing guys were giving us instead. (or what we demand)

enjoy your classics!

cinque

 

'The bubble shape' is an interesting way to describe the trends.

Do you think the much more extensive use of aluminum almost necessitates a larger car? I also agree with you on the Hugo Boss vs. Ferragamo comparison- very apropo.

What do you think of the 612? It's certainly larger but it's mission almost necessitates its size. I find the 612, like the 360, the 430 and the Enzo, to be a more 3-dimensional design, in that you must see them in person to appreciate the integration of every line. Whereas the 355 and most others, the DB9, Gallardo, 575, are much more two dimensional designs- clean and straightforward whether in photos or in the flesh.

Your thoughts.....


Forza,


Cavallini

 

Saying Lambo is the same as in the 80 is an Insult to Lambo of the 80's ..

Lambo too has changed. Drive a Countach , then a Diablo , then a Murcie.

 

Not really .

The Maranello has much more glorious feel than a TR and reminds me of a Daytona or a 275 GTB . Its an absolut cracker. Pure class with amazing performance . Everything Ferrari has ever been .

I get the same glorious feel in an Enzo than in an F40 although i prefer the F40 because i was raised with it and it means a lot to me. You say ferrari took nothing else bar glamour from the old cars , but what did it take from the old cars with the F40 ? Not much.

 

Wolfgang,

Im still sober

I love the TR . Really do . My dad has had 3 ( 2 when i was a kid so it has a special place in my heart ) . My comment wasnt bashing the TR , just saying that it hadnt any of the glamour or the class ( the TR is a bit show off ) from the cars of the past . The Maranello is also a supercar . Its a serious machine much faster than a TR prob because its also much easier to drive fast than a TR . But thats how things go no ? They evolve and tends to get easier to live with rather than the other way around.

Same for Lambo . My Sister could drive a Murcie to school everyday . She couldnt dive our 25th anniv Countach .


Best

 

WHAT!!!!!!
Wolfgang, are you feeling OK?

 

Finally made the deal??

 

I do see your view and you are correct. I am aware of the countach , I fortunatly had the opportunerty to drive one back in the early 90s, and I was poisoned, deaf and had an irritated knee as the clutch was a problem of its own. Lambo have obviously changed, but I think they would not be around if they did not make the adjustment (i.e Audi taking over.) Lambo would have just faded like Bugatti did... So because of Audi influence, Lambo is ofcourse different, but it is still there. Unfortunatly I haven't driven a 550, but from the looks of it its no better than a DB7... I was told that the DB9 was clearly a better car than the 575, and that the Vanquish would be more desired than the 575, but the 575 would be second best. My point is that Ferrari aren't teh best in all segments as they used to be. So what if the Murcielago is easy to drive, which it is.. Its get the technology to be user friendly while giving you the performance (better than the 575) of its rivals. The Carrera gt, is actually a tough car to get used to (to drive), but isn't much quicker than the Murcie.... And if you say your sister could drive the murcie - then my wife can drive an enzo just as well....F1 paddles and all....

Perhaps it could be your opinion that says the 512TR is not as good as the 550...but I'll say, more on the forum will appreciate the 512 much more, not only for speed, but for style and presence because back then it wasn't about being safe or taking turns at 100mph....just teh sheer excitment the car gives is all that mattered- how it made you feel. The sound and feel of the flat12 really cant be felt in the 550.... But perhaps I'll have to drive one, to feel what you're feeling.

 

Standing by!

 

Ooooooh what is it???? Can't wait. As you won't be coming to Tuscanny, I can't tell you all about my Lambo shopping experience
But unfortunately I don't think I'll be joining you in camp Lambo Wolfgang

 

You are not?????