leland west diss'd F-cars :(

Call Hagerty. Your problem will be solved in less than 5 minutes.
Good folks.

John

 

Totally agree!
2 Ferraris, 1 Studebaker truck, 1 Audi S4, 2 Rivas.
Personal service from Beverly; questions answered the same day; no hassles on claims;....that's how to sell insurance!
And 24/7 flatbed service a phone call away.

james

 

I tried Leland at some point with my 308 and they denied it as well. They didn't like the fact, that it was my only automobile. Snobs.

 

Oh Boy. I predict a minimum of 300 posts in this thread before it dies.

This is not a defense of Leland West, I am just hoping to share some insight into why insurance companies make decisions the way that they do. One of my F-Chat clients has encountered a similar challenge with another well-known, reputable classic auto insurance company. I will PM him and see if he cares to chime in.

The following is my $0.02, totally my opinion and that is subject to change given new facts and circumstances. Nothing below should be construed as advice. Please realize that every person's situation is unique, and I am making very broad generalizations. There are many unique people in unique situations here on FerrariChat.

The low risk of insuring these special cars allows the classic auto insurance companies such as Grundy, Leland West, Hagerty, et al, to charge a fraction of the premium that a standard auto insurance company would charge. Why is this?

Because in general, exotic, classic, and collector cars (for which I will use the term special) spend most of their time in a locked garage,are typically owned by successful, mature people who take care of their belongings. They are rarely driven and therefore the risk to the insurance company is low. When they are driven, it is normally on a sunny weekend day and not in commuter traffic. Fairly minimal risk, since the cars are less likely to be stolen, vandalized, involved in an accident, etc.

(Remember that insurance is a social and financial tool which spreads the risk of catastrophic loss across the insured population. Of course, insurance companies also exist in order to make a profit. I hope we don't have to have a merits of capitalism debate in this thread. )

The insurance company does not want add people to the risk pool who will drive their collector car to work, or run errands in their special car. These things greatly increase the chances that an incident will occur which results in a claim being filed. After all, that's why we all have daily drivers. The classic car insurance companies require you to own a modern daily driver, so that it is less likely that you have a daily driver which breaks down. If your daily driver is out of commission, the insurance company feels that you'll be tempted to take the special car on a mundane errand, or drive itt to work while your car is in the shop, exposing the insurance company to risks which they did not agree to insure.

In NYCFERRARI's case, they are not covering him because they feel that the risk is too great that his 10 year old Mondial daily driver may have a mechanical breakdown which results in him taking the 308 on a routine trip, which the insurance company has not agreed to insure. The thread title is misleading. He says they are discriminating against his Mondial, the reality is that if it were a 10+ year old econobox, they wouldn't accept that risk either.

"But they say I can only drive my special car for pleasure, not for commuting or for errands such as driving to the store for a gallon of milk!

Oh Yeah? Well, I derive immense pleasure from the experience of driving my special car to the store for a gallon of milk! Whadda ya think of THAT?"​

I don't disagree with that sentiment. But dem's da rules. If you want to drive your car on mundane trips, commuting, etc, then you need to insure it as a daily driver, through a more standard insurance company. As the EC fellas love to say, You gotta pay to play.


​

*Flame suit on*

 

That's all nice and dandy and makes sense. However what the insurance companies are ignoring is the fact, that for city slickers the daily driver is public transportation. Point in case: My 308 even has a showcar status because that's where I drive it. I don't need a car in the city, heck it is even a hassle to park/drive etc. Yet an insurance company won't take me on unless I have another car. I could easily afford a "daily driver" beater car, but I can't afford parking for it. As I said, city living is very different.

The reason I applied for Leland was not the lower premiums (didn't even know they were lower), but the fact that I needed a special insurance company that would cover it as a showcar only car.

Eventually I resolved my situation with my big insurance company by them going to Hagerty as their "contractor".

 

Yes it is. As is living in the land of big skies. Life's all about tradeoffs and compromises!

 

May I ask for a bit of clarification? Did the policy go out of force for any period of time? If applicable, how long had the policy been out-of-force?

Or did they say, "NYCFERRARIS, we will not be renewing your current policy after xx/xx/2005."?

 

Because of all the good press that Hagarty gets on this site, I called them when I was buying my 328. They quoted me a price that was infinitely better than anything anyone else quoted (~$600/year as I recall). A week later when I had finalized the deal on the car I called them back about writing the policy that they quoted me and I was told that they would not write me a policy with only one collector car that was newer than 1973. If the car was a 1973 or older, only one collector car was needed to write the policy. They then indicated they would be happy to write a policy if I purchased a second collector car. While I have no problem if this is their policy, it would have been nice if they had informed me a little earlier (like when they quoted me a price to insure the car).

The whole experience turned me completely off on collector car policies as I figured if they did this when I was trying to give them money, what would they be like in the event of a claim? In the end I added the car to my regular policy. At that time it was almost 3x the amount Hagarty quoted me, but have since moved to Middlesex Mutual and the cost for the 328 is now only slightly higher than Hagarty had originally quoted with no restrictions whatsoever.

As a result, it is unlikely that I would ever consider Collector Car insurance unless the stable got pretty big, and even then they would have to be significantly cheaper than my regular policy.

Just my 2 cents, so take it with a grain of salt.

Troy

 

Hagerty rocks. all 3 of my Ferrari's have been insured with them. both of my current ones are insured with them now.

 

Ditto that. I know tons of Ferrari owners that use Hagerty and love it.

 

How funny... I had a totally different view of this thread before I opened it. Lee (L.eland) West was a Ferrari dealer in Newport Beach 6-7 years ago. I thought this Thread was about him. Sorry

 

Hagerty it is!
$400 a year for my humble Fiero-based (just kidding ) 83 Mondial QV.

 

The thing that I find ironic and just plain stupid about collector policies is that they will allow you to take your vintage or classic ride out to dinner somewhere like Lower Greenville in Dallas -- every city has a similar area: gentrified old innercity, high crime and vandalism rate, congested traffic, lots of drunks behind the wheel -- and let a valet park it for you (remember Ferris Bueller), or you park it yourself in a dimly lit and poorly patrolled parking area with plenty of on-foot drunks, druggies, and street people around. Then go in a restaurant and stay for a couple of hours and come out with a fair buzz going and drive home at midnight on Saturday night. This falls under their definiton of "pleasure driving".

BUT, if you take it to the Home Depot, the grocery store, or Blockbuster, to name a few mundane possibilities, and park 100 feet away from anything else in the lot, at mid-day, and stay fifteen minutes for your movies or bag of screws or whatever, you are technically not covered! And, if you drive to your office after hours, park, and run in to grab some papers, you're really screwed, because that constitutes driving to work, the ultimate no-no. God help you if you drive it in on a regular work day.

The first Classic/Collector car insurance company that loosens up a bit and states in their standard issued policies that occasional driving beyond just "pleasure", within the yearly mileage limit, is permissible, is going to make off like a bandit with all the business.

I would gladly pay 2x the premium that I'm paying with Hagerty now for that type of coverage. And, that said, Hagerty is a fine company and I have been very happy with them, given the industry limitations that David has outlined.

 

WAR EGL.
I have had my only (running and presentable) collector car '77 model 911 insured
with hagerty for several years. I let the policy lapse for more than
30 days earlier this year when I didn't have time to drive so they
had to write another policy.
The premium was only $130 for a year
agreed value $9k. Previously I had the car insured with my Shelter
who insures my other cars and houses. They wanted about
$400/ year just for liability.
So far I am very happy with hagerty, of course I have yet to make any
claims.

 

I have been with Chubb for about 10 years, 20 cars, and many moves of houses.

The collector insurance - is for X miles a year (you pick how much you want to drive it) - you can drive to the store, home depot, etc. I put my F and L cars on a 5K miles per year policy (which is way more than I usually use per year). used to do a 2K per year on the old F-cars - since they were primarily for show and short runs.

They are a little more pricey than others - but there is no one in the insurance business who understands classic and exotics better in my opinion. The customer service and if you ever have to make a claim - they take care of it - how you want it to be taken car of (your shops, dealer, or whoever you ask for to take care of the problem).

 

I used Leland West for my 1995 Corvette convertible some time back. $430 per year for 5,000 miles. I've got a '96 Jeep so they let that count as my daily driver.

But then I had one nanny quit to go back to college, and Leland West had a fit about the new nanny. Not that I'd let her drive my Corvette. Not that she was listed as a driver. Just that she was in my house each day.

So they told me that they'd be dropping me in 30 days. When the 30 days came, they mailed me a notice that they'd honor their policy with me for the rest of the 1 year term.

That was about the time that I was buying my 348 Spider. I found a good local agent and Met Life's property division insured my 348 Spider as my daily driver with UNLIMITED mileage. They didn't care about my '96 Jeep.

The cost for full coverage, liability maxed out, unlimited use of my daily driver 348 Spider with Met Life? $801 per year.

Leland West's premium quote for my same 348 spider (but with a 5,000 mile per year limit)? $640.

$200 per quarter for no limits on driving is the way to go!

 

Same here, only I had 2 other daily drivers, but one of them was over 10 years old. So went with my regular carrier which turned out to be cheaper than LW.

 

Leland West has always been very good to me. I have 4 of my cars insured there and had no issues at all. I did have to have a daily driver that was a 2000 or newer to be insured. They had the best price when I started the policy a couple years ago and the entire policy cost less in a year for all 4 cars than I paid for 6 months with Allstate on my Lotus.
LW may not be the right choice for everyone but if you are able to live with the way the structure the policy it is a great company to deal with.

 

Its funny, it wasn't until I typed up my earlier response that I realized I just took the second phone call to Hagarty at face value and didn't call back and confirm with a another Hagarty employee. First call they said they would insure me, second one said they wouldn't. At the time I just assumed that the second person I talked to was the one that knew what they were talking about. Perhaps the first person was correct and I missed an opportunity to save a little cash. In the end I'm happy with the car insured on my regular policy with no mileage limit or other restrictions for $600/year, so I guess it worked out.

Troy

 

What company is ***CHEAPER*** than Leland West?!

 

screw leland west.... Go with Grundy insurance!!! I have been with them for years and they are simply awesome!!!!

 

It's clear isn't it?

It's not that they don't want to insure the car.

It's that you tell them you have a Moon Dog as a daily driver, they have a hard time believing that and think you are a liar.

They aren't disrespecting Ferraris, they are disrespecting YOU.

Now, get your Uzi and clean out the whole nest.

 

I had a policy for one year with LW on my 365 GTC4. When the policy came up for renewal, I had relocated from central to southern california. I called to change the address and they asked for some new information not required when the policy was written. This information was supplied, at which time they asked for MORE STUFF. I called and talked to an agent who didn't seem to know what they required, and then denied having rmade the earlier request. After 45 minutes on the phone, and talking to 3 different people whom all had different stories, I gave up.
A short conversation with Hagarty solved all problems. The annual "pleasure use only" policy was about the same money. Considering the lack of customer focus demonstrated by LW, I'd sure hate to have a claim with these guys.