Let´s talk about Boxing

Discussion in 'Sports' started by Zzono, Dec 13, 2008.

  1. Zzono

    Zzono Karting

    Apr 21, 2008
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    I saw Wladimir Klitschiko´s fight tonight.
    Boxing has been very boring for several years.
    My question:

    Is Wladimir too good for other boxers or are current boxers so bad?


    P.S. Anyway, I miss 18 years old Mike Tyson. I could imagine he could just kill Wladimir or whatever.
     
  2. dysko

    dysko Formula Junior

    Sep 20, 2005
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    If you are a boxing fan, I have an up coming boxer to watch for in about 2-5 years in the lightweight division. His name is Noah Zuhdi... still early in his career (18 months as a pro) but has won every fight he has had in a first round KO. He has insanely fast hands, even for a little guy and is a heavy hitter as well. As his career progresses, I am hoping that we will get see how good his endurance is...
     
  3. ag512bbi

    ag512bbi F1 Veteran
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    I really didn't think He was THAT good today. VERY 2 Dimentional. Rahman Lokked REAL bad. There just isn't anybody in the Heavyweight division Anymore.
     
  4. ADON

    ADON Formula 3

    Feb 8, 2007
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    I quit watching when Mike Tyson and Prince Naseem Hamed started getting their butt's kicked.
     
  5. Gilles27

    Gilles27 F1 World Champ
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    I remember watching all of Tyson's fights in college (me, not him)--there was nothing like him in his prime. And he seemed to fight every few months, too. I am by no means a boxing historian, and I never watched any early greats, but I can't imagine any of them being more savage than Tyson. Not that some of them couldn't have out-fought him. But he was unbelievable to watch those first few years.
     
  6. Zzono

    Zzono Karting

    Apr 21, 2008
    89
    Well, I was a boxing fan.
    When I was young, I compared Lennox Lewis with Mike Tyson.
    Boxing has been an unpopular sport since UFC or K-1 was founded (at least in Southkorea)
    When Lennox Lewis or Mike Tyson had to fight, I saw all of the Korean newspapers that covered their coming up fights as biggest issues and titles.
    But nowadays, nobody is informed who fought against who. Neighter newspapers nor internet websites like daum.net never publish their fights.

    I think, other countries also do not care about boxing anymore.
    I have been in Germany since 2001 and Germany is only interested in boxing when Klitischikos fight because they are half Germans.
    boxing is losing and losing its popularity. Sad.
    My father who was a boxing fan and Mike Tyson´s fan, asks me whether Fedor Emalienenko or Vanderlei Silva won or not.
     
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  8. ag512bbi

    ag512bbi F1 Veteran
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    IMO, I think Tyson (in his prime) Was the best fighter EVER. I really do. My FAVORITE was Ray Leonard. But Tyson was the best!!!!!!! Other Opinions I know, will be posted after this!!!!
     
  9. Rosserboy

    Rosserboy Karting

    Apr 30, 2007
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    Watch out for David Haye. Just moved up to the heavyweight division and being an undisputed cruiserweight champ. Apparently theres a fight between him and Vitali Klishko (not so sure on the spelling sorry) in the pipeline. Haye beat Monte Barrett well 2 weeks ago in his 1st proper heavyweight fight.
     
  10. Fastviper

    Fastviper F1 Rookie

    Nov 20, 2003
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    1. I think Don King messed up boxing.

    2. People are playing basketball, not practicing boxing.

    3. Remember there were a few years there when it seemed every fight was judged wrong.

    Bad press all together.
     
  11. Osiris_x11

    Osiris_x11 Formula Junior

    Oct 30, 2007
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    #10 Osiris_x11, Dec 16, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2008
    ... I'm sure MMA's rise & relative popularity first & foremost has affected pro boxing's notoriety from a consumer's perspective, as well as the bottom-line.

    Not to mention there isn't an enigmatic/mainstream draw in the mold of a pre-Holyfield Mike Tyson in the most marketable division: heavyweight. . .

    Pro boxing, much like vehicles produced by the domestic Big-3, if a desirable product is offered - the masses will surely follow. . .
     
  12. rdefabri

    rdefabri Two Time F1 World Champ
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    #11 rdefabri, Dec 16, 2008
    Last edited: Dec 16, 2008
    This isn't meant as an insult, but I assume you started following boxing more recently (e.g., the Tyson era). This is clearly a subjective discussion, so your opinion counts as much as anyone's, but to answer 2 questions at once - Tyson dominated against tomato cans as does Klitschko today.

    The best heavyweight fighter I ever saw, bar none, was Muhammed Ali. Now, I only remember the tail end of his career, but I do remember the heavyweight division during that time.

    There were "second tier" guys like Earnie Shavers, who was credited as being the hardest puncher EVER by Ali, Norton, and Holmes. The names are a who's who of greats: Joe Frazier (a monster), George Forman (a monster), Ken Norton (a monster), etc....get the idea? These guys beat the crap out of each other, and given that I've watched boxing for more than 30 years, they'd likely all take out Tyson in their prime. At the top of that heap was Muhammed Ali, who despite not being the biggest, clearly was the smartest, the most skilled, best all around heavyweight at the time.

    I so thoroughly disliked Tyson primarily for his hype, and his coronation by the media that he was the best. I always felt an unitimidated fighter would destroy him, and Holyfield proved to be that person. Tyson was exposed and never the same. Muhammed Ali, even when beaten, avenged his losses and avenged them dominantly. Most rankings have him top-10 ALL TIME P4P!

    Now, any top-10 list must include Marvelous Marvin Hagler (one of my all-time faves), Sugar Ray Leonard (who, IMHO, was beaten by Hagler!), and Joe Louis. I've seen all of them fight (other than Lewis), and I am hard pressed to think of many in the modern day that match these guys.
     
  13. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Moderator
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    The Heavyweight division has been a little stale for a while now!! :(:(
     
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  15. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Spice it up! You can take that homo Klitchko! ;)
     
  16. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Moderator
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    Well, I *am* a little rusty!! :D:D

    Havent had a fight in many years actually. Getting too old for that now, but I can still throw a few. ;);)

    Klitchko would be a hard man to beat!! A big man, with a big reach, but some HARD PAP punches to his mid-section will soon chop him down to size. :p:p

    The bigger they are.......the harder they fall. ;);)
     
  17. ag512bbi

    ag512bbi F1 Veteran
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    Boy, We don't see eye to eye on this sport at all. I got into boxing around the Ali/Norton era. I'm a HUGE fan and have OVER 1000 fights on video. So, i'm definitley a historian and do train the sport for years! But again an opinion is an opinion. And I'm NOT saying you are wrong. It's just I don't see it and WE (the world) will NEVER know the truth. I feel Tyson (as much as I DID hate him too) only had difficulty with much bigger fighters. Ali (as much as I do think the WORLD of him) was at the MOST an average size HWT. Ali had a tough time with Frazier, and Tyson was (IMO) a lot better than Frazier. But that's not the only reason I feel Tyson was better than Ali. The way he won fights were SCARY. EVERYONE FEARED him. Ali wasn't as feared. But, You are right, there wasn't a better era in the HWT. division. I give Ali credit 4 that too. But Ali just wouldn't have beaten Tyson in his prime. I guess this disscusion could and WILL go on FOREVER! Now... To my Ray Leonard! He DID beat Hagler. I've watched that fight (back then) atleast 10 - 12 times with a group of fighters and we evaluated EVERY round. The fight itself WAS close. But, What Leonard did to Hagler NO MAN has done before. You have to give him credit for that! He came out of retirement and did that to the P4P best fighter in the world. He made Hagler look average in that fight. Leonard always knew he could beat Hagler. Styles make fights and I think Haglers game plan was wrong. I think he didn't expect Leonard to have that type of gameplan. Anyway, enjoyed the friendly debate. Just my Opinion...
     
  18. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Moderator
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    Tyson was the most feared boxer EVER!! :D:D

    He was ferocious in his younger days. He was young and hungry for the title!! The youngest HW Champ ever, there is no denying his strong desire to be the best and crush every opponent placed in front of him. You had to have balls to step in the ring with him in his prime. :):)

    I am a little younger than you young fellas, but I am also HUGE boxing fan!! From Ali to Tyson.........Sugar Ray to Roy Jones Jr, I have loved boxing since I can remember. Growing up as a kid reading about Tyson was very cool. We were not fortunate enough to have Pay TV in Mount Isa back then, so I the only time I could watch his fights was when he made the news for crushing another opponent. :D:D

    I grew up during the Tyson 'era'. He was a monster one of the BEST fighters of all time. :):)

    Boxing has had many legends and you probably cant name just one fighter as the best ever because there are certainly many guys that fall into that catergory. :):)
     
  19. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Moderator
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    #17 PAP 348, Dec 19, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  20. Osiris_x11

    Osiris_x11 Formula Junior

    Oct 30, 2007
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    "One morning I woke up and found my favorite pigeon, Julius, had died I was devastated and was gonna use his crate as my stickball bat to honor him. I left the crate on my stoop and went in to get something and I returned to see the sanitation man put the crate into the crusher. I rushed him and caught him flush on the temple with a titanic right hand he was out cold, convulsing on the floor like an infantile retard."

    -Mike Tyson talking about his childhood.
     
  21. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Does this mean the conversation is fixed? ;)
     
  22. wax

    wax Three Time F1 World Champ
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    First, Don King and Bob Arum both sucked the life out of boxing, along with other things. For instance, Bob Arum/Top Rank pocketed Evel Knievel's take from Snake River broadcast.
    Hiya, Armen! I really, really enjoy replays of "old" fights.

    What's your Top Ten list of best bouts, ever?
     
  23. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
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    Leonard / Hagler was epic.
     
  24. butcher

    butcher Formula 3

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    Manny Pacquiao is the best P4P fighter (boxing) in the world today. Bring on Mayweather out of retirement, Hatton, Juan Diaz, Julio Caesar Chavez Jr. Pacquiao is one of the rare talents that has unbelievable punching power for his size. His last fights (David Diaz and De La Hoya) were against welterweights and Pacquiao is a natural fly to light weight and he still knocked them both out. If anyone saw Paquiao's fights against smaller but great Mexican Champions (Morales, Marquez, and Barrera) you saw the unbelievable power that Pacquiao had to knock them out. What we saw against Diaz and De La Hoya was a much faster fighter against competition, but retaining welter to middle weight super punching power in a flyweight package. That is why Pacquiao fights are the only great draw in Boxing today. He knocks the living- **** out of people. That is why people loved watching Mike Tyson and George Foreman. The knockout is like the Homerun in Baseball (that is what draws crowds). Heck that's why MMA is so popular today, because there are often knock outs or tapouts and judges do not decide outcomes. Other than Manny Pacquiao boxing is essentially dead today, MMA is now king.
     
  25. Ferrarinw2

    Ferrarinw2 Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Frazer/ Ali fight one.
    Louis/Farr.
    Louis/Marciano
     
  26. Ferrarinw2

    Ferrarinw2 Five Time F1 World Champ

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    Ali/frazer 3
    Hagler/Hearns
     
  27. rdefabri

    rdefabri Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Wow - we definitely don't agree on many things, but you make good points. Although Holyfield was smaller than Tyson, both times he dominated him. This isn't to take away from Holyfield, because as a Cruiserweight, he was the man, but his main weapon IMHO was not being intimidated. So I'll agree that while Tyson was fearsome, he was effectively neutralized by those that weren't afraid. Of course, you needed a good game plan (Holyfield with clinches and push backs, and Douglas with the jab) to beat him physically. I thought that Holyfield's ability to not be intimidated by Tyson (in fact, he ended up being the intimidator) would have worked well for other Tyson opponents. That's why I believe Ali, Frazier, Norton, Foreman - in their prime - would have given Tyson a difficult fight. Of those 4, you could say Ali was the weakest physically, but his courage and in-ring skills gave him the edge...and I believe it would be more than enough to counter Tyson's strength / speed. We'll never know, but we can dream, right?

    The Leonard / Hagler debate will never end, which definitely testifies to how good a fight it was. And although I love Hagler, I often say that if it's that close then you can't complain. Certainly, neither guy dominated, but I thought it was obvious that Leonard turned it on during the last 10 seconds of every round...making him look more "busy". And I do agree that Hagler's plan was wrong. Man, those were some good times with Hagler, Leonard, Hearns, Duran, Mugabi - then followed by some good welter / middles like Frank Tate, Michael Nunn, Donald Curry, Marlon Starling (one of my faves), Nigel Benn, Gerald McLellan...the list goes on. I miss those days. The most exciting fighter to me in recent times is Kelly Pavlik. I want to see him and Abraham go at it - that could be a barnstormer...
     

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