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Discussion in 'F1' started by Robb, Nov 27, 2016.
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Then you obviously never saw Senna at Suzuka (both times indeed) or Schumacher in Adelaide (I saw that one in person) or Jerez. And I think I recall Nico having Lewis off at Spa in the not-too-distant past.
If you want to confine the poll to whiners and exclude the hitmen, Mansell retired that trophy years ago. Ask anyone who had to work with him.
Lewis is the faster driver, Nico is the smarter. Throughout the history of F1, both types have won races and titles. Both types are deserving and inspire admiration for different reasons.
And, yes, Lewis is a bit Jekyll and Hyde, a characteristic which is heightened by contrast with his cooler rival. But that's not uncommon either: think of the McEnroe v. Borg era in tennis.
A little perspective would take a lot of the heat out of this conversation...
Thank you, sums it up perfectly...
Did he actually say that? I think he said it was discussed and understood. Didn't he intentionally use ambiguous language like that? What option does he have? Why do you think they left the discussion for the morning of the race? You think it was an afterthought or was it deliberate to limit Lewis' options?
If he refuses, he might not have a chance to start at all, or they might not allow the correct pit strategy. So he didn't really have many options left...
The team absolutely does not matter to a driver in a scenario where the WDC is still alive and the WCC has already been wrapped.
Lewis really did what anyone who races would have done.
If you wouldn't have done the same thing you don't have a winning mentality. Yes there is a fine line between a winner and a good loser, but no winner wants to lose. You do what it takes to win. IE: Basketball team fouling when there doesn't seem to be a hope of winning in the last minute. You don't give up if there is even a slim possibility of winning.
I have had to congratulate people I despised after racing against and did so but it doesn't mean I liked them or had any respect for them. After shaking their hands I am not going to go have a beer with them afterwards, not going to hug them. I am competitive and that's just the way it is and I wouldn't give a hoot if they were my team mate.
This coming from a Ferrari fan that hates Hamilton.
Did you not see Lewis congratulate Nico in the parc ferme, before either had even taken their helmets off Lewis pats him on the back, hugs him and shakes his hand but don't let facts get in the way or a good muck raking lol...
When the instruction came from the Mercedes pit for Hamilton to pick up his pace, Vettel was catching both Mercedes fast, and there was a realistic risk that he may have been able to pass both of them and steal the thunder from the 2 Mercs.
Not a good scenario, on the day when a Mercedes driver was supposed to lift the crown, don't you think? Beside, with the best 2 cars in the field leading, no mechanical gremlins, there was no need to slow down to the extend Hamilton did. It wasn't even a "save" mode, it was loitering with intend, namely to ambush Rosberg had he tried to overtake him.
I feared another "Schumacher/Damon Hill" kind of assault on the German. Hamilton has shown he can be very vicious.
From a team manager's point of view, it's not good watching your drivers potentially lose the race through some mischief between themselves, when they have a win in the bag.
Even if Hamilton didn't heed after the radio message, he knew he was watched, and had received a warning from Wolff: "Don't wreck the race!"
Yes that would have been possible.
No question. But that's racing - some things should be out of the team's control in my opinion. They should be doing their best to ensure a level playing field between the two for the good of F1. Instead they are trying to choreograph the last race as if they control everything.
You don't know that he would have hit him. I do not believe he would have hit him intentionally. He would have raced him insanely hard and given no room and tried to force a mistake. The result is unknown and why we watch...
Possible, but again, you don't know.
I'm sure the whole process sucked for the team managers the past few months. Fortunately they are paid well and they can always do something less stressful if racing isn't for them.
This implies that they wanted to intervene into the WDC decision...But this is not true, they simply wanted to ensure that they win this race instead of throwing it away.
If they really wanted to intervene ("conspiracy theory") they would have found certainly other ways to get the result they wanted. Although I actually suspected that they (or better Toto) would do something to ensure Lewis to win I was obviously wrong and they did nothing at all to "fix it"...neither in one, nore in the other direction.
And in my opinion it is bull**** to stand there (Toto) and say that you might understand that Lewis did not respond to the order...you should have thought about that BEFORE you make the call, not afterwards. But Toto was not consequent in the past so why does anybody expect him to be now; so at the end exactly nothing will happen to Lewis. The official declaration of Toto will be that they have talked about it internally and they made clear their point and Lewis understood...as if
This is where we disagree. I think the team comes first, and the driver's' ego second.
The driver is an employee whatever is salary is; he drives for the team.
I am all in favour of putting the interest of the team above everything, and issue team orders when necessary to preserve that.
If a driver cannot make sacrifice to meet reasonable demands from his team, he shouldn't be in it.
I think that some team managers have let drivers have the upper hand, and run the show.
Williams lost one championship because it doesn't settle priority in the team one, and McLaren did the same in 2007 too.
Some drivers understand the big picture and know when they need to cooperate with their team mate in the team's interest. Others only think at their ego.
The job of a team manager is to cover all eventuality, and knowing the atmosphere between the 2 drivers, and Hamilton usual habit of knocking his partner off the track, or wrecking both cars at once, Wolff could logically expect the worst from him.
It's no point being naïve about Hamilton; he is an aggressive driver who uses dirty moves to get what he wants. How many times do you need to be told that ?
I predicted that an overtaking attempt by Rosberg would have finished in tears and the title lost for the German.
That's why, very sensibly he didn't attack, but held position. I respect that and I understand fully.
Sounds like a horrible place to work.
You and many people out there disagree on the definition of dirty as it relates to racing tactics. You aren't even a fan of defensive lines. We are just polar opposites on this topic.
I think you have been watching racing in a parallel universe to everybody else. This season, it has been Nico who has finally shown some 'fight' and who has shown an ability to punt Lewis wide past corner apex, and push him onto the grass to block an overtake ( that didn't work out well for either driver). They both can be aggressive but I've not seen 'dirty moves' from either, and the stewards who know these things don't appear to support your view.
It's Nico's extra aggression this year that has landed him the title, he's been too submissive in the past which has handed the WDC to Lewis without any real fight.
Nico didn't have to risk an overtake, he didn't need to win so why would you predict any overtake at all. Lewis controlled the race perfectly to ensure that he won as he needed to, Nico secured his second place as he needed to, Lewis did what everybody expected him to do and to try and create some chaos behind him which 'may' have landed him the WDC. Nothing dirty, just racing within the rules.
It was the right result in the end, happy days.
Kimi - Kimi Raikkonen can't understand Nico Rosberg F1 doubters - F1 - Autosport
Great over view of the title for Nico and a nice input about luck being in Hamilton's corner in the past.
Balls of steel: Nico Rosberg's championship drive
Fun fact of the day: The last driver who won the title with less race wins than than the 2nd placed driver was: Lewis Hamilton (2008). #AMuS
Very good article
Kimi nails it, points mean prizes.
I don't remember schumi, in 2006, telling everyone Alonso didnt deserve the title due to michaels engine failure...... I do remember him thanking everyone in his garage for their hard work, making a very positive statement to the press, congratulating Alonso with gusto and good graces when he won.
Schumi was all class, and Nico is a chip off that block. This is the reason I don't like Elton, he has NO class at all.
Are you sure? A commenter at Joe Saward's blog (https://joesaward.wordpress.com) today:
I met Lewis at Brands Hatch when he was there supporting his brother in the Renault Clio Cup. My son was in a wheelchair at the time (thankfully now recovered) and Lewis walked over, introduced himself, asked my son how he was, then went back to his brother. No minders, no fanfare, and faultlessly polite. The whole encounter took not much more than 30 seconds, but made my son’s day. What particularly made it special was that he did it solely because he wanted to – there were no cameras there, no sponsors to placate – he just thought he might be able to cheer up a young lad who was having a rotten time. NICK
Many people in the world, on and off Fchat, seem to need to hate someone tangible with passion. So much so that all reason and objectivity is out the window. Of course he's flawed like everyone, but many here talk about him as if he has no merits as a driver or person. I just can't understand having that kind of vitriol for anyone, let alone someone I've never met and has had no direct impact on my life.
I'm with you on this. Nothing wrong with playing that strategy and no danger to manufacturers championship. Play to win