Lexus LF-A could cost $200,000+

Yes they were.

I remember ZR-1's being discounted tens of thousands of $$'s and piling up on Chevy dealer lots. They just made too many of them and sold them at too high a price compared to what people were willing to pay. The same with the NSX. It is and was a cool car, but the production quantity and price was above the market demand, which is why you could easily walk into an Acura showroom and get one way waaaay below sticker long before the intended end of production.

Performance wise the cars were great, especially for their time. Commercially, they were a flop, in comparison to successful sports cars like the Supra, Ferrari 355/360, Ford GT, etc, etc.

 

The orginal ZR1 was a success for sure, the prices dropped at the end of the run because the new generation Vette was coming out with not much less horsepower and alot less cost. Not to mention a new platform. How does that make it a flop? And while I was never a fan of the NSX, it had many good years and was a good car. Acura just priced it way to high as it got old and it didn't sell.

The Supra that you considered a "success" had the same story as the NSX, so how is one not a success and one is? The Supra was not a good seller and priced itself out of the market....

 

Hmmmm... what about "$200k for a Fiat 360 Modena? LMAO"

Seems like a bunch of brand-whores in here. Who cares what logo is on the front, all cars are made of similar basic materials and if one manufacturer can assemble those components in a manner superior to another, why does it matter what logo is on it? If Lexus can offer performance on par or better than others in the price range, combined with a dealer experience that is top-notch and presumed reliability and reduced cost-of-ownership, then why shouldn't it be worth a look? I mean, the F430/360/Gallardo are hardly exclusive anymore and are becoming more gentrified with each generation, so the "rarity" and "rawness" arguments are increasingly difficult to use.

If you prefer Ferrari for some aesthetic, personal, or sentimental reason, that's fine. But with today's options in the market, it's very challenging to justify one vehicle over another on an objective basis.

 

There will probably be plenty of wealthy individuals that will plunk down $200k for a Lexus simply to have the new car on the block. More than likely it will sit next to a Ferrari or Lambo in their garage.

As for people that laugh about $200k for a Lexus... well if the car performs then why isnt it worth it ? Unless you are just a poser badge buyer ?

Mike...i dont know much about the ZR1 but I dont think you can call the NSX a flop...maybe not a hit..but not a flop.

 

I think watching (or rather, listening) to the videos on youtube of the LF-A running the nurburgring might persuade a couple of takers. It sounds and looks serious, so it might be unfair to underestimate its potential only because of its marque.

Some 15-20 years back, most people dismissed the japanese entry into the luxury-sedan market with much skepticism. While endless arguments might ensue over the cars being "soul-less" and "boring," I think Lexus entered that market with the idea of creating a car for that purpose. I.e. - luxurious and reliable at a reasonable cost. After all, their tagline was "the relentless pursuit of perfection." (not performance).

After making pretty big advances in that market, it wouldn't be completely out of question to target a new market and see what happens ... elevate the brand even more (as most say it lacks "excitement") with a true "halo" car, much in the sense that the Viper might have been for Chrysler/Dodge back in '94. We'll see if things are proportional, from a Viper:Caravan :: LF-A:RX400h type standpoint. Or ZR1:Malibu.

With the unexpectedly large msrp for the LF-A being set proportionally to the rest of the Lexus fleet, it will be neat to see if the performance and dynamics justify this.

 

That's not why the ZR-1 flopped. GM made around 3000 of them the first two years - they were already being heavily discounted after the first year, and after the 2nd (when there were hundreds of them sitting on lots that ended up going for way way below MSRP) they dropped production to only a few hundred a year for the next 4 years and they were still discounted the whole time just to get them off the lot. It's well known within the Vette community that the ZR-1 was cancelled because nobody wanted the car at the price they were selling for, and it's widely accepted that the ZR-1 was too expensive for what it was and looked just like a C4, and just didn't sell. There was even a lot of talk when the new ZR1 was coming that GM will not repeat the same mistakes as before (this was stuff that GM execs themselves said). The falling price and inability to sell of the ZR-1 had nothing to do with the upcoming C5. They cut ZR-1 production by about 85% after only the 2nd year, the 1991 calendar year which was more than 5 years before the C5 was coming out. The prices on ZR-1's were being cut way waaaay below MSRP even in 1992 and 1993. I remember buying my 2nd Vette and at the time the ZR-1 was in the early/middle of production (it would have been around 1992) and the dealer had 2 ZR-1's on the lot and they were asking around $20k below MSRP, which was about $20k over what you could get a regular C4 for. The car was a flop because it flopped in the marketplace, and it was nothing to do with the C5, it was because this is back in 1992 and they were selling for what is today around $100k. It was pretty much a $30k engine horsepower package and wihle it was a fantastic motor, people didn't want to pay $30k for 100hp in a heavier car. Ergo, it flopped in the marketplace.

As for the Supra, it had some hiccups - as I recall they couldn't bring the turbos into the US in 96 because of emissions, but yes sales were declining when Toyota axed it. They did a 15th anniversary 1997, then got rid of the leftovers in 1998 and called it a day... but the big thing about the Supra is that it was still selling thousands and the biggest differentiator is the price - what can you buy a Supra turbo for now? Above MSRP! 10 to 14 years later they still go for more than they did new and the prices are going up. When the car was around it was still kicking ass and doing well in reviews and edging out the RX7, Vette, 300ZX and other competitors in performance. As for the NSX, they were selling 2000 of them a year in the beginning and they were struggling to sell 200-some the last few years and you could by them for obscene amounts of money below MSRP. Also, look at the depreciation curve - those cars drop like rocks. Sure, most of them are pretty much fully depreciated now, but just like ZR-1's the depreciation was steep and extensive.

One could make a good argument that the Supra wasn't a great success when it was still being sold, but there's no argument that could reasonably be made to say the ZR-1 was a successful car for GM. It was a cool car and set some records for reliability, but in terms of sales and feather-in-cap-ness for GM, it was a flop.

 

A friend of my dad's has one of the LS600Lh's and man that thing is SUPER SMOOTH! Super build quality too, but he paid $135k for his and I am just saying NO WAY would I spend that kind of money on a Lexus! He has also had/has M/B's AMG S's and Bentley's (YEA!)... He likes the LS...whatever. I am looking forward to driving the new Bent in the not to distant future!

James

 

the LF-A is a lot better looking than the California

 

I don't care if the damn thing is faster than a veyron and drives better than a caddillic Toyota will never see any of my hardearned 200k EVER!

 

this kind of stuff , only happens in a site called FERRARIchat .

Can't wait to see that Lexus .
which IMO is a very goos thing for all of us car enthusiasts .

 

They will sell even at $200K. Look at the new Audi R8. How many have dealers sold well above $150K....a lot! I am sure the new Lexus will offer a large performance difference. When they stuff a V10 in the R8 what will it be going for....$180K+ would be my guess. The R8 with a V10 is going to be Lexus competition.

Brian

 

I'm not exactly sure as to your reasoning for your statement, but I do think Toyota has the means and resources to not care about marketing towards a demographic that would make such an irrational (and dare I say "ignorant") statement. when did a "caddillic" [sic] become the superlative/veyron-esque benchmark for driving dynamics, anyway?

 

A super car with its first scheduled maintenance at 100,000 miles.

 

The NSX was not a flop, commercially or by any other stretch of the imagination. The high ups at Honda stated that they would have pulled the NSX from production had it not made money. Why the heck would a company keep producing a flop for, what, fifteen years? Had it not had enough demand to be profitable, it would have been dumped in the first few years, like the other similar cars of the time. They only planned on selling a small number of vehicles every year. They finally retired the car in '05.

 

I think this car has a decent shot at being successful.

If this car can create a niche market (reliable, better performance #'s than competition) it will be fine.

I believe there were a significant amount of switches from Ferrari to Lamborghini when the Audi-inspired Gallardo came around, I would not be surprised if owners of unreliable exotics gave the Lexus a shot. Granted, many have mentioned Ferrari's quality being upped.

You know the guy whose Ferrari caught fire and is burnt-to-a-crisp is at least thinking about a Lexus supercar.

 

Why are they revealing the price of a car that they haven't even shown the consumer version of yet?

I seriously doubt it will do well in the $200k segment but it is hard to say since no one knows what the money will actually be purchasing. A few will purchase it but the volumes will be so low it won't do much for Lexus except give them a nice car to feature in a Super Bowl ad.

 

Seriously, who are you sceptics fooling? This is TOYOTA! They KNOW how to win customers. This is what they're good at. They knocked down worlds biggest car makers and that's a tough game to play.

Unless you're specially skilled in marketing I don't think any of us should shout about Toyota doing anything wrong. They don't have stupid people on their team, end of discussion.


Worst scenario is that this car will work as Halo car for Lexus' in many years to come, like the Acura NSX. It might not be as revolutionary (all alumium body, titanium connecting rods etc.) but it should aspire future generations. That's worth tons of cash.


I want these things to come and if they come with a bulletproof quality they should be excellent supplements to weekend warriors such as Ferraris and Lamborghinis.

 

Nobody will argue the reliability.....but is that why you'd spend $200k on a sportscar? You want soul...passion...looks all of which Japan is lacking. This car is the typical Lexus styling.....boring! Honestly the car is not far from a 350z in styling(actually prefer the 350z myself). This car needed to be priced with the Nissan GTR (another boring looking car). That would have been its only chance to sell decent numbers.

 

Not all of us want "soul" and "passion". Some of us actually buy cars what they are and not who made them...

 

a V10 Hybrid would be Very interesting

 

+1!! Holy hell

 

Well, it appears that even if we don't know the final specifications of the LF-A, it is apparently doing very decent in racing.

And the link to the YouTube video.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nkWJs6gqYWw

Quite a screamer.

 

That'll give them envoiro"mental" fellows a reason to own a sportscar. "It's hybrid".

Biggest marketing trick ever pulled

 

Whats with all the Lexus hate?

 

It's japanese. NSX, GT-R and now this