Might as well start a thread 'to be fair and equal', LOL No seriously. I know some folks really don't like it, the politics, the big money, 'buying' players, but it is a different game - it's three days a week not four, and it's guaranteed money, and nobody has forced these guys to jump to the LIV, so don't blame the LIV Group. When you think about it, you golf 4 days a week, one day is for travel, the other two days you are at the range, with a coach, or shooting a practice round, and with the LIV, you at least get a chance at having one 'day off'. And there are less tournaments, so less time away from a home life. Another is if some PGA guys switch to the LIV, that opens up the PGA tournaments for new blood to come in, which is good. Let's not argue the 'humanity' and political issues: nobody seems to bat an eye when they put Saudi oil (gas) in their gas tanks, don't be a hypocrite. 2023 LIV Golf schedule Feb. 24-26: El Camaleon Golf Course, Playa Del Carmen, Mexico March 17-19: The Gallery Golf Club, Tucson, Ariz. March 31-April 2: Orange County National (Crooked Cat), Orlando, Fla. April 21-23: The Grange Golf Club, Adelaide, Australia April 28-30: Sentosa Golf Club (Serapong Course), Singapore May 12-14: Cedar Ridge Country Club, Broken Arrow, Okla. May 26-28: Trump National Golf Club, Washington D.C. June 30-July 2: Real Club Valderrama, Sotogrande, Spain July 7-9: Centurion Club, London, England Aug. 4-6: The Old White Course, White Sulphur Springs, W.Va. Aug. 11-13: Trump National Golf Club, Bedminster, N.J. Sept. 22-24: Rich Harvest Farms, Sugar Grove, Ill. Oct. 20-22: Trump National Doral, Miami, Fla. Nov. 3-5: Royal Greens Golf & Country Club, Jeddah, Saudi Arabia And I can already hear it now - three tournaments at Trump-owned places. Save it. Nobody cares. Try to keep the discussion to GOLF.
Finding single tickets for Miami is a PITA. They have all kinds of 'specials' and group prices, I have not found the normal 3-day passes, but I am betting they are not cheap, nothing in Miami is.
That's because they are doing zero promoting of it. I don't imagine it will do well in the ratings anywhere... most people don't even LOOK at The CW or even know what it is.
I still have the same opinion as last year. I hate Saudi Arabia, I hate the first players that joined (Reed, Johnson), but dammit if PGA and many of its players a bunch of twits over this and now some of my more favorite players are involved (DeChambeau, Kopeka, Poulter, Smith). I'm full on support LIV and the Majors.
ohh, my only complaint LIV is what the hell is up with the team thing. it is the stupidest thing ever, at least the way they did it. it is only a distraction and the announcers and LIV put too much worth into it within the coverage. they should have done it like major leagues and had outside owners buy actual teams and then bid on players with that money going to the players. they could then trade etc and function like real owned teams.
I don't disagree one bit, it is a really stupid distraction - just play the game, don't concentrate on the team garbage so darned much, it's not needed. My jury is still out on all the 'side stuff' they do, I'll watch a few more then form an opinion. I love Ferhety, but he acts and sounds like he's had a couple pitchers of Margaritas before the first tee shot... he's funny, but he seemed kinda disinterested?
I didn't even catch they got a deal with CW, but CW isn't paying anything for it, they are just doing revenue share. I did enjoy the broadcasts online last year, they were good. I really like Ferhety on his show, but I agree he has been off last several years on course coverage. I think he had lost his PGA broadcast job a couple years ago. If you look at their YouTube it performs pretty well against the PGA YouTube, but they aren't making a ton of money there. I wonder if Full Swing is going to bump the LIV popularity as they certainly talk about it a bunch.
I see how this is working well for the players but I don't know what the end game is for LIV. What does success look like? Is it a revenue generating TV or media arrangement? Is it related to revenue or image related on an alternate tour?
I think it will eventually develop into a nice product, but it will never be profitable. In the end it will just be a redistribution of wealth from the Saudis, which isn't a bad thing. Within 10 years these players will be back on the PGA and SPGA, just a little richer.
I guess the win in that scenario for LIV would be that it does burnish the image of the Saudi's? You and I are on different sides of liking LIV but I don't think either one of us it thinks it helps mainstream the Saudi's. It's going to have a lasting impact that is great for the the PGA. More money going to the players. Improves the PGA product with things like elevated events. I think the PGA and it's players have benefited from the competition much more than I thought they would. It's maybe the biggest single thing to advance the PGA since Tiger?
Complete hypocrisy anyone who critiques LIV based on our own government and especially how most other organizations and sports have ties to Saudi Arabia too. Woke F1 anybody? I agree this hurts more than it helps, brought undue attention to something many were already forgetting about. PGA is trying to compete now, listening to players more and raising purses. However #1 many great players have already gone to LIV. #2 LIV players will still be able to play Majors and may get world ranking points eventually. #3 PGA will NEVER be able to compete financially with LIV no matter how much they spend. #4 PGA at risk from bursting and not sustaining their increased purses.
I am on the 'other side' too, I cannot criticize them because I buy oil, and plastic products made from oil, have flown on Saudia Air, and other things. Do I LIKE how they treat women? No, but that is changing little by little, and Saudi is not the only country that does that. I don't like how some countries treat/do things either, I don't like how the USA does some things, too. Some countries in the middleeast - you get convicted of theft, they chop your hand off, convicted of murder - you get the firing squad shortly thereafter, convicted of rape???
I agree with all of the above. I also think if anything LIV makes their image worse because it brings the conversation forward. If looking good was a goal for the Saudis, I don’t think it’s worked. I still don’t understand what the Saudi’s would consider to be a success of the LIV tour. Doubtful it’s revenue, what is it?
Beats me - why do they spend billions in soccer? Why does a clown give a guy 250 million guaranteed? Why do you build a racecar when you know you will never profit from it? I think the LIV Tour is just some rich guy's toy.
I didn't watch much golf on TV until Full Swing came out. IMO, SA is trying to capture some of the polish off of the PGA which came from the traditions and excellent competition. The PGA was wildly popular even when Tiger was at his peak. LIV, with its team concept and paying players, will never have that polish since I view most of the players who went there as just cashing in which is their right. It doesn't make for very good TV though.
SA's objectives were to either burnish their image, fail, or, fracture the PGA tour. A win. I don't see a sustainable objective like building a team format that investors buy into. That is an interesting notion though. I've watched LIV twice and it just doesn't work for me. I don't like the shot gun start, the faux team drama or the heavy marketing. I do like the closer fan engagement. We'll see how it plays out. Maybe they can bankrupt the PGA?
PGA is getting even more hypocritical now. Their entire argument against LIV was that they were traditional, the essence of real golf and that LIV was doing it wrong. So why then is PGA making all these changes like no cut to be like LIV?
'no cut'? I wonder if they would do that if Tiger didn't exist? He can shoot 80-80 on Thursday-Friday and people will tune in to watch (him) on the weekend, that's a proven fact. He's maybe not as much of an impact as he once was, but when he was good, ratings would double or triple when he played, and be flat or worse if he skipped a tournament. NOBODY in the history of sports could attract viewership like he did.
