looking to buy a 308

Use the search button in the upper left part of the blue banner on the screen here and you will learn a ton. If you are looking for a 308, I guess it would be a wise move to stay on FChat and read and read and read and read....

Of all the 308 cars, the two valve cars are the least desired (80-82), but who cares? A least desired Ferrari is like going to the party with the ugliest Supermodel.

Have fun in your search!

MB

 

There is nothing wrong with the two valve engines. Sure the power is not as great in stock form as the 4 valves, but how fast do you need to go on city streets. A 2 valve Ferrari looks just as nice and is cheaper to maintain. If you need a really fast car there are cheaper rice burners that will blow the doors off a 308. Faster sure, do they look as nice, have the history of a Ferrari, or get near the attention. I think not. My advice is, do plenty of research, check the history of the car & buy the best car you can afford. A fixer upper is not a cheap way to go.

 

How does a 'rookie' get to nearly a thousand posts and never have found the search button or even seen reference to it ?

 

I will do my best to answer this as non-biased as possible. There were variants of the 308 engine which made the model years feel almost completely different from one another. That being the case you have to ask yourself what type of toy you want.

The carbureted cars are undoubtedly the most raw feeling and have a very pleasant unmuffled Ferari sound. These cars are also the easiest to maintain. The '76-'77 model year cars brought to the US had considerably better camshafts and different cam timing, no catalytic converters (more power), respond better to tuning (carb jetting etc), and many believe will appreciate more than any of the other 308 series. I have personally driven my car alongside a nice '84 Euro spec 308 QV and neither was faster than the other. I can tell you with 100% certainty that a properly tuned '76-'77 is faster than a US version QV. The only issue I have found with these earliest variants is that the power is a bit more peaky than that of any of the 308 series cars, which means that in order to get the power you have to rev the engine. The '78-'79 model year cars were gimped due to emissions and were subject to catalytic converters, less lift and duration camshafts which resulted in less power. On this forum we have seen several '78-'79 cars tuned to have very respectable outputs that are on par with the earlier cars. That's is really it for carb cars.

The '80-'82 2 valve injected variants are undoubtedly the red headed child of the group. They are still great cars but the difference in power is noticable. The 308 altogether is not a blindingly fast car, but they should at least be sprightly and fun to drive. I have never driven a 2v injected car, but I did hear Gary Bobileff say this, "they are just plain slow".

The QV is the most civilized car of the bunch. The power is not as peaky as the '76-'77 cars which makes it a bit easier to lug around town but the throttle response is not quite as good and the sound is just not what it is with a carb car. If you want to tune it for more power you have to pull the injection system off and replace it with carbs or ITB injection. There really is no other way around the stock Bosch injection system as far as milking more bhp is concerned. A valve adjust on a QV is going to be a bit more due to it having twice as many valves but otherwise I do not really see how it is any less maintenance intensive than that of the other examples.

The same can obviously be said of all of them. When considering one, service records are a must etc. A PPI doesn't hurt but I believe it depends on who is selling it and just how much they have maitained the car and who was maintaining it. Do not be swayed if it was owner maintained. Many owners are far better mechanics than that of their dealer or local independant may be. Just make sure they have records.

good luck!

 

Modmaki,

I own a 2 valve 308 and I promise you that the last thing on your mind when you are crusin' on a beautiful day with the top off is the 40 less horsepower (or whatever the hell it is!) than the other 308's.

The 2v 308 should be somewhat cheaper as well, and it IS still a Ferrari 308. Put on a Tubi and you will be in heaven.

Frank

 

Bosch injection is just as tunable as any carburetor. It's just not in people's mindset (yet); they don't know what to do with it. A stock catalyst carbureted 308 is no faster than a stock catalyst 2-valve injected 308. And either can be made just as fast as the early carbed cars with a test pipe or hi-flow cat, a regrind, and different fuel metering.

 

My thoughts exactly.

 

Now owning a QV, I wouldn't go for anything but another QV or a carbed 308, euro or US.

QV is quick enough, adequate power, any less wouldn't be acceptable.

 

Buy what you like. Color & Year. Don't get what others want just to be like them. Buy what pleases you.

 

Prices are down, no reason to not get a QV in this current market.

 

I would love to know how the Bosch injetion is just as tunable as carbs. We have some brilliant minds on this forum who state the system is not tunable without compromises in some area or another. Do a search and you will find threads that yield this information as well as threads converting to carbs or ITB injection systems from the Bosch system. There have also been several threads where the question of how to yield extra bhp from an injected engine has been posed, but the general answer is of course to switch to carbs/cams/pistons etc.

 

You can tune each cylinders AFR ratio on a CIS system, you can recurve the WUR as well. Ill make plenty of power on my boxer and retain the CIS when I do my mods.

 

Hope you don't mind, I'd like to quote you on this!

Chris.

 

The Euro QV is the fastest of all 308s. It is 400 pounds lighter than the American version. The GTB is the rarest QV because there were only 748 of them made, and most of those were American versions.

Besides the opinions of others, there are books and charts with ACTUAL indisputible numbers regarding which 308 is fastest and rarest of all 12,004 308s produced.

With this in mind, I'd advise you to get whatever YOU want and enjoy your car.

 

Yes, they're all nice cars, but if it was my cash I would personally buy an '84-'85 308 GTS QV. Rustproofing started in January 1984, and the smog pump on the '83 cars was dropped for the later 308s.

Given the soft economy, if you can swing it I would even say consider a 328.

If you're looking to buy, Ferrari Market Letter is a good source. Also check your local FCA or FOC publications.

The thingie on the top left?

 

Would that be two American Stigs vs two African Stigs?

 

Bullfighter, let me make a little correction if you don't mind, My 84 308QV #49455 production date is DEC.1983 and it has rust proofing. I'm not sure if this is info is accurate but I think the 1984 model started the production in Sept. of 83, now I don't know if they started using rustproofing in Sept of 83, all I know is that mine has it.

 

* My Euro GTB QV *


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i have to ask you to clarify the " American version" part of your statement.

i have read, and been told that the GTB QV's were ALL EURO SPEC, and thats yet another reason there are so few in the USA. everyone wanted the "look at me GTS" while only the real die hard drivers bought GTB's for the better feel and lighter weight over the reinforced GTS.

i am not sure there were any USA market GTB QV's made or imported? my car is euro and has "papers", and none of the other owners of QV GTB's i have been in contact with have a USA spec car.

i could be mistaken, discuss ?

 

I will eat a tire if there is 400lbs difference. I say 100lbs-150lbs max in stock form (US muffler, bumpers etc)

 

They're all great. The difference where it really counts (on the road, and track) is negligible! Slams against some years is most likely based on brochure numbers for horsepower, but when you get on the track, they're all the same animal. You want to leave 3XX cars behind, then you need to go bigger - much bigger. The BB, TR, 288, F40 etc. will pull ahead on the front straight of Laguna as if I'm a gear too high. Ferrari to avoid - doesn't compute? Ferrari's, are very well engineered, and Ferrrai didn't win all of those races by accident. As for a 3X8, you want to get what you like. There are subtle body differences ie wings, grills, body colored bumpers etc., even having the pass mirror changes the look. Getting the nicest one is overall the most cost effective. A mishandled example of any year or model is expensive. A fixer upper can be very rewarding to see the transformation, but helps if you're so inclined. Also, the 308 GT4 and Mondial are georgeous with great performance. The 2+2 seating may come in handy.

Have fun in your search.

 

I think I remember the threads you posted when you bought (or sold?) your Boxer.....

The top of the 308/328 section has a good sticky with buyers guides. Our own Jonathan "Birdman" does a pretty good job describing the differences between the models in his summary:
http://www.birdmanferrari.com/tutorial/308_buyers_guide.htm

Oh, and in reference to the 2 valve cars, keep in mind that the 80-82 INJECTED cars have ecsentially the same HP as the later 2 valve CARB'D cars but minus the sound of the carbs (and its a wonderful sound). But, they are still at Ferrari .

Also, I'll bring up the much debated 2 valve "sodium valve" issue, there are a few threads on it, but a mechanic would be better to answer (Rifledriver? DaveHelms?).

James in Denver

 

To clarified my comment on weight...

The Euro GTB QV is the lightest of all 308s. It weighs 2,932 lb's.
The American GTsi is the heaviest of all 308s. It weighs 3,366 lb's.
That's a difference of 434 lbs.

The chart also shows a 258 lb difference in weight between the 3,190 lb American 308 GTB QV and the 2,932 lb Euro GTB QV. Here is one of the listings for an American version GTB QV ---> http://www.308qvregister.com/1983/47269.htm
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