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Looking to purchase 599. Need advice...

Discussion in '612/599' started by mnogj, Feb 1, 2012.

  1. carcommander

    carcommander Formula 3

    Sep 28, 2006
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    Jim
    You are worried about tires on a 350K car?
     
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  3. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Terry H Phillips
    Automatic mode will not increase clutch wear if you drive it like the system drives it and downshift to 1st every time you come to a stop. If you put it in neutral coming to a stop while in 3rd or 4th, clutch/T/O bearing life improves.

    The 599's dual plate clutch is way tougher than the single plate clutches on the early 65 deg V12s (456s/Maranellos/early 612s) and V8s, so clutch wear is not as big a deal on 599s and OTO 612s. It should last for quite a while. On the single plate clutches, wear numbers of 70% or higher indicate it is time to start thinking about a new clutch. Not sure how that works on the dual plate clutches because I am not sure anyone has worn out one so far.
     
  4. Mattyrae

    Mattyrae Formula 3
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    Why not? Do you do burn outs on every take off in yours?
     
  5. carcommander

    carcommander Formula 3

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    #29 carcommander, Feb 15, 2012
    Last edited: Feb 15, 2012
    No but I don't worry about the cost of tires. It's the cheapest thing you will ever buy for a Ferrari. I bet your paint correction is more expensive than tires.
     
  6. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim- Some of us are rich and some of us are not. $2000 for tires is definitely something I think about, especially since it looks like they stopped making the 355/25 19s currently on my rear wheels.
     
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  8. maranello71

    maranello71 Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2004
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    Andre
    Yeah, but what about if it doesn't break down? How expensive is ordinary maintenance on a 599? I am thinking of going for a 599 myself, which I would use for about 6-8K miles per year, only in the warm season.

    Since everyone seems to agree that the 599 is a very, very reliable car, should I worry about "unexpected" maintenance costs or is it just a remote chance that something expensive will go wrong? I mean, can I plan maintenance costs on a 599 like I do on a BMW 5-series, or are there any hidden weak spots that "normal" guys like myself need to know about, before ending up in the poor house?
     
  9. carcommander

    carcommander Formula 3

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    My point is if you are so worried about the tires that you can't enjoy the car why have it. Tires for mine are 1600. About the same as any other HP car. I get tired or reading posts about maintianance costs. A Ferrari can be expensive to maintain. If you don't have a fair amount of discretionary income you probably shouldn't own one. You don't have to be rich. But not everyone can afford to own a Ferrari. Sucks but thats how it is.
     
  10. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jim- I could never afford any of the Ferraris I had, but managed.

    Andre- Maintenance on a 599 should run about $1000-1500 a year if you overmaintain it like you should (change fluids and filters annually). No cambelts to change, a bigger expense on the 612 and earlier cars. No car has a guarantee that something big will not break, but the 612 and its shorter wheelbase cousin, the 599, have been very reliable. Rear tires seem to wear out faster than fronts for some reason, so you should budget for new tires about every 12-18 months at 8K miles per year. The new Michelin Super Sports may last a little longer since they have a 300 wear rating. Good compared to the 160/220 on my Pirellis.
     
  11. maranello71

    maranello71 Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2004
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    Andre
    Reading all the threads on 599 GTB ownership, I am getting the impression that the biggest hurdle is the buying price, after which you have a reliable and hugely fun car with affordable running costs compared to previous generations of "hypercars" (just try to compare it to the insane running costs of an F40, F50 or Mc Laren F.1...).

    As the prices of this fantastic machine continue to fall, it is getting affordable to people like me - someone who can once in a while splash 150K on a car, but could not endure the pain of 20K per year in extraordinary maintenance costs... on the other hand, 1-2K of fixed costs plus tires and fuel (by the way, how bad is mileage on a highway cruise?) is a perfectly manageable amount to pay for the privilege of driving this beauty around.
     
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  13. arizonaitalian

    arizonaitalian F1 World Champ
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    That's a pretty good way of thinking about it. If you think of "normal" maint being the by-the-book replacement of consumables like fluids and filters and tires and brake pads, I would imagine all recent ferrari's (let's say post 355 for V8 and post 575 for v12) average somewhere in the $2000 +/- per year range for those consumables (as little as $1000 some years, as much as $3000-4000 in other years with tires).

    I would add that Ferrari's have expensive parts (it was, after all, a $300k car originally). My point being that if something does break, a $20k repair bill can happen. None of us on here have a database that would allow any stat-based discussion/analysis of "how often" a big break like that occurrs...the thing I worry about is the F1 gearbox/actuator and (if your car has them) the CCM brakes needing replacment at "some point". Those are circa $20k and circa $36k, respectively (yes, I know CCM's are "supposed" to last a lot of miles/stops, but we shall see if "time" wears them in unexpected ways). Engine repairs, electrical system repairs, heck nearly anything, can be stupidly expensive. Ferrari parts are hysterically pricey...little rubber/plastic bits that I've had to replace on my car and/or read about other replacing are hundreds and sometimes thousands of dollars. If a headlamp housing is broken...huge $. And on and on. And yes other brands can be expensive too, but I've never seen any parts as pricey as Ferraris. So...odds are you won't have a major breakage...but it could happen and leave you facing big $$.

    One way to mitigate that potential is to buy the Ferrari factory extended warranties. I think of those as "insurance". Its a waste of money if you don't make a "claim". But, if you do have something break, you will be glad you had it. There are three levels of coverage if you are interested. You have to have the car inspected by a Ferrari dealer and then you can buy the warranty. You might want to look into it if you are concerned about the prospect of potentially facing a large repair bill and want to "arbitrage" that potential by making $5-6k per year warranty purchases. There are all sorts of opinions out there as to whether or not to buy these warranties. I would suggest you educate yourself on them and then make a personal decision on whether you will be happier paying the $5-6k per year for that "insurance" or leave open the risk (at whatever level that may be) of incurring a larger bill down the road.

    Good luck with your purchase!
     
  14. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Andre- Mileage is horrible. Remember the car has a mildly detuned Enzo engine (Enzo Type F140A, 599 Type F140C). In the States the late models are rated by the EPA at 9-13 mpg, 11 mpg average. Ferrrari claims 19.15 mpg on the highway. That gives highs and lows of 12.28 l/100 km to 26.14. Somewhere in there is the truth.

    Gas consumption on my 575M scares me, so I never calculate it. Better not to know.
     
  15. maranello71

    maranello71 Formula 3

    Jan 23, 2004
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    Andre
    Thanks for the excellent advice - a Ferrari extended warranty is exactly what I will get. Better to have a known cost that can be planned for, rather than face the unknown...

    Regarding mileage, years ago in Switzerland I used to drive a F355 - 20mpg highway cruise, down to 10mpg driving hard. Then I moved to a Maranello, and the best I ever got out of it was again, 20mpg on a very steady cruise from Geneva to Zurich in very cold and icy conditions - I did most of it in 6th gear. But when I drove it hard in the mountain, 7-8mpg was not unusual!! Since I have had children and I moved to Chicago I got myself a Maserati Gransport (4 seats...) which I have driven everywhere including to 7 National Parks in the West. Awesome car, despite being very highly tuned (470 horsepower) it will get 21-22 mpg on the highway. However, at the track I only get 8mpg and in town about 11.

    So, if the 599 ranges between 20 mpg on a steady cruise and single figures at the track, it is not different from all my previous exotics. And considering it has an additional 150 extra horses and 1.8 liters extra displacement compared to the Gransport, it doesn't sound too bad! Too bad it doesn't have 4 seats... I guess I will drive my kids around one at a time ;-)
     
  16. Masher44

    Masher44 F1 World Champ

    Jan 15, 2008
    12,625
    my buddy has a yellow 360 with tan interior and yellow piping and stitching. stunnng. will try to get pics soon.
     

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