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430 Lowest mileage for f430 variator failure

Discussion in '360/430' started by carguy007, Feb 11, 2020.

  1. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    Curious does the variator only plague higher mile f430's? Apparently there is an audible symptom on start up which is usually accompanied by some kind of cam code, but not always. Was curious of others personal experiences.
     
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  3. sakodik

    sakodik Karting
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    Jun 2, 2016
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    Dan
    Its been so long since I had to replace one. About 2 years ago with 25k miles. I noticed an overall better driving experience after having it replaced.
     
  4. Way2fast

    Way2fast Formula 3

    May 24, 2006
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    Sam
    I have 44k miles since new but no problem

    Sent from my SM-G975U using Tapatalk
     
  5. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    Sakodik - Did you have noticeable symptoms?

    I wonder what leads to the failure or if it is a luck of the draw kind of thing. Maybe if a car sits and is not driven, as with all problems this plays into it.
     
  6. voicey

    voicey Formula 3

    Jul 29, 2009
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    I had a 430 in last year with 52k km - engine light was on for RHS exhaust variator not reaching position. Another workshop had previously replaced the solenoid and phase sensor, to no avail. With the hatch behind the seats open, a rattle could be heard from the variator on a cold start. Very much like the infamous Maserati variators that use a dry sump engine from the same family. What was interesting was that when we stripped it down, the sleeve that the variator rotated in was very badly scored. I suspect that oil was being allowed to flow past the seals and the pressure wasn't sufficient to get the variator moved enough. Replacing the variator, sleeve and a few other bits completely cured the problem. The car came back to the workshop for a routine service yesterday and has been running perfectly for the last 5k km.

    As it happens, I have another 430 in right now with engine codes for variators not reaching the desired position on 3 of the 4 cams (car has 18k miles). Other specialists have tried and failed to cure this over the last couple of years, including replacing all the solenoids. This car does not have the cold start rattle but is very noisy when driven with the throttle feathered. And at full throttle, above 4,000 rpm, the rattling noise is insane. I'll have the front chest off for a look later this week.
     
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  8. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    Voicey - You are the "Gandaf" of Ferraris and appreciate the insight. With P0010 - "A"Camshaft Position Actuator Circuit Bank 1. P0011 - "A" Camshaft Position - Timing Over - Advanced or System Performance Bank 1, is this the same as the RHS variator issue you referenced above? With these type of ailments is it common to be able to reset the code and go for a 50+ miles before it comes back or is it just a constant check engine light. I am trying to help a friend out. Dealer wants to just change all the variators at a cost of $5500 and I am skeptical of this course of action. It sounds like at least you can listen on cold start to have some notion if there may be an issue with one of the variators.

    What is the "phase sensor" is the this the camshaft sensor?

    Thanks for all your time and help.
     
  9. gatago

    gatago Karting

    Jun 28, 2019
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    Marco
    My 430 is ~75k and no issues so far. Nothing from previous owners either per extensive service records that came with car.
     
  10. sakodik

    sakodik Karting
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    Not sure if it is related but the shifts were horrible, slow and jerky. At the time, I thought it was normal being an old car with no CEL for quite some time. The shop that had the work done found the solenoid loose and tighten back up but the CEL came back on after a day of driving. The damaged wiring were replaced along with a new solenoid. While in the area, they also changed the gaskets and all spark plugs. So far that one replacement covered another 5k miles over a year and still going. It was day and night experience after repairing all the above. E-diff and CST came up twice between driving and resets. Sorry this does not help you much.

    I got P000C/D, 0011, 0024, 0021, P0300, P0305-8.

    Post-repair and 1 month, I got P0325 but found that to be a hiccup.
     
  11. voicey

    voicey Formula 3

    Jul 29, 2009
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    I can't recall the exact codes but my example was for the exhaust cam - camshaft "A" is the intake. However the principle is the same.

    I think we're talking about two different things here. There's no way you could get anyone to change all four variators for $5,500. Each variator is £1,500 and the labour to remove the cams, change the variators, re-install and time up is significant. The overall cost would be more than double. I suspect that you are talking about the variator solenoids.

    I'm talking about variator failure as per the topic of the thread, which thankfully is uncommon. Variator solenoid failure is very common and is to be expected as part of the F430 ownership experience.

    It's a hall effect sensor that monitors the position of the camshaft. They sit on the red valve cover at the rear of the engine.
     
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  13. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    Yes - sorry I did mean solenoid. Thanks for catching that. When a variator not a solenoid is bad would it be able to go years with just throwing a random camshaft code now and then?
     
  14. voicey

    voicey Formula 3

    Jul 29, 2009
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    When a variator is worn it will malfunction - this can manifest itself as rough running and/or a CEL. They wear through a lack of lubrication and the starting signs are a rattling on a cold start. If you want to find out more then search for Maserati variator failures - it is a very common thing and will afflict every wet sump engine in a certain VIN range at some point. It's so common that I flatly refuse to sell any wet sump Maserati under a certain engine number unless it has had a documented variator repair and modification to the cam caps.
     
  15. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    Voicey - This is helpful and much appreciated. I will do some reading n the Maserati side as suggested. I guess what surprised me is that the light has been randomly coming on for about 8k miles and he just resets it. There also does not seem to be a rattle on cold start. I would have thought the variator failure if that is the case would have progressed to a much worse state over that time and mileage. I did check the wiring and it looked fine. Are there any internal sensors that monitor timing besides the cam timing (phase) sensor? Is there anything deeper in the engine that could not be reading right and sending proper signal?
     
  16. carguy007

    carguy007 Formula Junior
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    Apr 24, 2013
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    I should have asked this first, what codes specifically indicated variator? Are these codes that relate to camshaft timing being over or under advanced such as p0010?
     

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