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Maserati Khamsin

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by Maeter, Feb 24, 2008.

  1. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

    Nov 4, 2006
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    Marc Sonnery
    Hello AMLC, your theory is rock solid, let's see what we can find out? I will say though that the flamboyant poor taste evident here reminds me very much of ridiculous art objects commissioned by Jeffri Bolkiah in gold and rubies sapphires etc...this whole project is just as silly, same DNA...
     
  2. AMLC

    AMLC Formula Junior

    Apr 4, 2009
    290
    #7877 AMLC, Dec 23, 2019
    Last edited: Dec 23, 2019
    As this is #142 I didn't understand the part about the USA. But I see they changed the text on the website and the part about the USA is gone.
    Someone must have informed them :)

    This car can be seen in this video as we discussed earlier:

     
  3. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    Yes I noticed that:)
     
  4. AMLC

    AMLC Formula Junior

    Apr 4, 2009
    290
    The engine is a Holden V8 according to their website.

    They added some information on the website
    Year: 1975
    Colour: French Blue
    Transmission: Automatic
    Steering: RHD
    1975 Maserati Khamsin Resto Mod (RHD)
    • Customised one off styling
    • Holden V8 Engine
    • Automatic Gearbox
    • Special wide Alloys
    • Sensational Body Styling
     
  5. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    Thanks for that, they never answered my email of December 22, so I will call them this week to get the chassis number.
     
  6. Froggie

    Froggie Karting

    Sep 27, 2017
    185
    Belgium
    Pity they did not even keep the Maserati power plant...
     
  7. AMLC

    AMLC Formula Junior

    Apr 4, 2009
    290
    Somehow this photo looks like it is not real (from a computergame?), but the description is "Tokyo street view", and if you zoom in it looks very realistic: https://flic.kr/p/LQBaz8
    Not one of the guys crossing the street looks at the car.
    Are Khamsins such a common sight in Japan? :)
     
  8. MK1044

    MK1044 F1 World Champ
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    Thank God they only made one.
     
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  9. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    Well this is almost certainly a case of the original engine going kaboom and the easy solution of replacement having been chosen.
     
  10. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    #7885 Nembo1777, Jan 13, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
    Well I was fooled by the "Pablo Escobar Khamsin" photoshop here last year so I will shut up and not try to guess this time:) but in Japan the only two dark red KI have with chrome mirror are two cars, which could be the same, very old and tiny photos, unidentified chassis number.(currently bitmap files I would have to turn them into Jpegs to insert here), frustratingly I seem to recognize that number plate but can't find it in my database.

    It is not 200 owned by a Japanese lady as that has different mirrors and is plain red:

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  11. Mexico074

    Mexico074 Formula 3

    Aug 14, 2008
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    Michael Demyanovich
    So the question now is - Which is worse (or better depending upon how you look at it),
    the heavily customized Khamsin, or a Khamsin with US bumpers???? Both is not an option !!! :):D
     
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  12. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    #7887 Nembo1777, Jan 13, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
    Right I just spoke to a salesman at DD Classics: is it....AM120-333.

    This car has never been in the Uk as far as McGraths Maserati knows. I had nothing on it...a hole between my files 332 and 334. I will get the car's birth data from Fabio.

    I then spoke to the big boss at DD (did not get his name) who was very open.

    He says he has zero information as to who did this.

    It was made in Brunei then sold on to New Zealand then to DD Classics who shipped it up to the UK.

    When I asked him about my theory that Jeffri Bolkiah brother of Hassanal the Sultan of Brunei ordered it made he said it is possible because when buying cars extracted from the Brunei Palace one gets zero info...like in this case but he hastened to say that he does not in any way state it did come from the Sultan and his brother's collection.

    That idea is just conjecture on my part.

    He did confirm a ton of money seems to have been spent on the body which is what made me think from the 1st day I saw a photo of this that well it wasn't just anybody who had it done.

    FYI Jeffri Bolkiah got more or less excommunicated from the family for excessive spending and it was he more than the Sultan who pushed the growth of the multi thousands of cars collection now rotting away with hundreds of specially made ones -though that is off topic there are plenty of threads on that in Fchat- (I once saw a brochure for something he ordered made: a jewelry table music box of a couple making love with sapphires, rubies and diamonds showing him and a girl in bodies gold: obscenely expensive and ridiculous bad taste.

    I asked him what his price idea is and whether I could mention it here and he said no problem, around 100K GBP, obviously the longer it stays there the better.

    I find considering it is already done that the design is interesting at the front for a hot rod but the rear looks like an 80's Corvette:-(

    But with rear glass, all the vents made functional and a heavily tuned proper Khamsin engine and long ratio ZF 5 speed as opposed to this Holden automatic power transmission unit it could be interesting:) And yes before I get shot (sorry always dreamed of a tuned one) the right thing to do is back to factory specs 100% with replacement engine and box.
     
  13. Froggie

    Froggie Karting

    Sep 27, 2017
    185
    Belgium
    I concur.
    The very minimum is the Maserati engine and box, and yes, it would then become an interesting one off, although understandably not to the like of everybody...
    Btw, is this new custom body fully made of plastic (polyester or alike) or only parts of?
     
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  14. rga

    rga Karting

    Jul 14, 2012
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    Roger the Dodger

    Hello AMLC
    this car is for real, I enclose more photos of it, unfortunately I do not know the VIN

    I have collected pictures on a total of 42 seemingly different cars in Japan, 7 of which I know the VIN of, the rest is often older photos,
    so possibly multiples of the same car resprayed, or also US and European cars imported later to Japan.

    Best regards
    Roger


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  15. Froggie

    Froggie Karting

    Sep 27, 2017
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    Question to Khamsinistas wrt air intake in the engine bay.

    The air intake of the V8 in the Khamsin looks different from Ghibli's and Indy's insofar there are two big flexibles going forward/downward :

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    This arrangement looks different from what was used in former Maserati models such as the Indy (also Ghibli or Mexico):

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    I suspect that the late air intake with flexibles was designed to ensure cooler air admission instead of hot air coming out from the rad or captured on top of the engine bay under the hood, so it's an improvement.

    May I ask:
    - do the flexibles come down into the wheel arches?
    - are the flexibles made of plastic or of aluminum, or even double walled with insulation, such as the ones used in warm/cool air ventilation systems?
    - is the inside diameter 70 mm or different?
     
  16. rga

    rga Karting

    Jul 14, 2012
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    Roger the Dodger
    Going through old magazines I found this ad for Vauxhall

    Thought you might find the comparison with Khamsin, Miura and Dino a bit far fetched.

    But the clue are the unique features of the Astra!

    - engine with cat
    - cross spoked wheels
    - ultra low profile tyres
    - power hood
    - power steering
    - central locking
    - electric door mirrors
    and finally four speaker stereo system
    (ah yes and the price difference of course)
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  17. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    #7892 Nembo1777, Jan 13, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
    Roger thanks for that, interesting that it might be owned by a Gaijin (westerner) if that is in fact the owner stepping/crawling out of the car. 31 k's were sold in Japan two thirds being automatic all being LEFT hand drive as they wanted their cars exactly like in Italy (except a couple of mandatory details differed as per Japanese rules such as reflectors at the back). Quite a few have rusted away outdoors alas, some have been brought to Europe like 208 (now retired due to terminal rust and used for parts) and 192 (via the US).

    Many Japanese K's have been color changed to white which is the color of purity. Then several were originally white like 350 below.

    I have no knowledge of any K's from any market being privately imported to Japan but would love to hear about them if you do know of any.

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  18. MK1044

    MK1044 F1 World Champ
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    #7893 MK1044, Jan 13, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2020
    Sheesh, Marc. I hope you were being sarcastic. That thing is molto brutto.
     
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  19. 71Satisfaction

    71Satisfaction Formula Junior

    Jul 15, 2012
    704
    New York and Norway
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    Art

    Who are you, and what have you done with Marc Sonnery, aka The Keeper of All Things Factory-Correct??

    ..it's possible the time of Ragnarok is upon us, but upon further consideration, I am interpreting this as either:
    1.) Marc's FChat account got hacked by his evil twin, or..
    2.) Marc is getting in touch with his inner Gonzo American Stylist.

    To Whom it May Concern:
    ...Please return Marc to us in his original state of mind, and we will reward thee with a lifetime supply of LHM, Absinthe or other liquids of your choice only the French can conjure up.

    Merci, - Art
     
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  20. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    #7895 Nembo1777, Jan 14, 2020
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
    Hahahah ok Carmine, Art and any other offended parties, rest assured I have not drank anything dubious in fact I am in the middle of a dry month after a bet with my girlfriend:)

    Perhaps I have also been influenced by spending a lot of time and research writing a new article on Tom Meade the flamboyant American designer who in the late sixties and early seventies, right there in Modena where he had settled, created his Thomassimas: wild impressions of what he felt Ferraris should look like which will be out in Octane UK late January: that is part of the explanation, but only part.

    Let me qualify what I wrote. Childish as it may be beside the more mature desire to promote and preserve the appreciation of Khamsins, I have always dreamt of a go faster Khamsin able to do 300kph (=187mph) and with less weight, but it would need to be sorted aerodynamically.
    Well FYI a famous designer, one of several who have owned Khamsins, once secretly snuck it in a windtunnel when a day's tasks on the model he was developing were concluded early. He positioned it, fastened it and launched the windtunnel to see what measurements it would produce. Well the aerodynamics were actually very poor, the main issue was the underside, far too much turbulence.

    As some may recall the first Khamsin, the white test mule destroyed in the December 73 crash test, had a much smaller radiator intake "mouth".
    This was found to create lift at high speeds: a snow sled effect. The radiator opening was then enlarged for the production model.

    High speed lift is well known for rear mid engined cars of that era with so little weight at the front but it is not their exclusive predicament. More than a few front engined cars did have high speed nose lift due to lack of downforce despite the weight of the motore on the front, don't forget a jumbo jet 300 tons, takes off at 300kph. The Ferrari 275GTB born with a large grille aperture later received its long nose specifically to cure that high speed nose wandering. I have always wondered if the top speed of the Khamsin was not artificially restricted because the factory was secretly unsure of its very high speed stability. Yes it is very stable up to the speeds it can attain, but beyond? There clearly is nothing to generate a lot of downforce.

    Therefore yes this body kit seems like the offensive disrespectful tampering of a misguided grease monkey (Bob is going to come after me now lol) taking the design completely out of its era and into the future and I don't like the back end at all, BUT nevertheless the front end looks like a fairly serious effort to generate some downforce and clearly some effort went into making it.

    Then you would have to work on the underside to smoothen airflow there which presumably was not done on this car.

    So this explains my two cent reasoning and rest assured I only think about this silly dream very rarely:). I was only thinking of one high performance Trident special to prove what might have been had the energy crisis not happened and a Khamsin SS eventually been offered....

    Voila case closed, back to preservation now:)
     
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  21. Froggie

    Froggie Karting

    Sep 27, 2017
    185
    Belgium
    Without modifying the design of the Khamsin, actually there could be aerodynamic improvements do decrease lift at high speeds only through a small (Merak-like) recessed front spoiler, a flat floor and somehow reduced height with appropriate springs/shocks or tires: that would ensure a lower aerodynamic pressure underneath, so less lift.
    Difficult to quantify, though...
    But quite discrete in terms of design and correctness!
     
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  22. italiancars

    italiancars Formula 3

    Apr 18, 2004
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    If you change the engine on a Maserati GT car be it a Khamsin, Ghibli etc, is it still a Maserati? Consider that the only part of those cars that Maserati actually manufactured was the engine, everything else were parts bin or outsourced.
     
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  23. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    Absolutely, of course my idea was with a genuine blue printed Khamsin engine, as I posted already this car probably had its original motor fail and the owner was on the other side of the planet from Modena, found it too costly and or complicated to rebuild it sourcing all the parts so resorted to that Holden engine...just like the owner of AM120-307 in Australia who put a Corvette engine in his years ago.
     
  24. Nembo1777

    Nembo1777 F1 Veteran

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    Hello all,

    Right I have heard back from Fabio on 333.

    It was actually sold new to Brunei, directly from the factory (no importer there) on 10 March 1975, in "verde Mercedes" and "Marrone Monzese" with automatic gearbox.

    I have never heard of these colors which sound like a special order. So the theory and it is only a theory that it could have been ordered by the Sultan remains a possibility.

    I will dig further (Cozza, Manicardi).
     
  25. rga

    rga Karting

    Jul 14, 2012
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    Roger the Dodger
    Hello Marc

    one US-car that seemed to be advertised in Japan is the following, with those red carpets, I cannot match it with any others we know

    http://gut-sport.jp/limitedcar.php?itemid=1377

    and 4 or 5 have clap-hands type mirrors, but that does not necessarily mean they are US-cars
     

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