Hello, I happen to know a little about this problem that most Khamsin owners are aware of, at least at their garage floor and when starting their cars. The basic problem is awful design in general, e.g. congested location of the slave cylinder just some millimetres from the exhaust tube a heat shield will help somewhat. This is what it is and we have to live with. I struggled with the problem some years ago and got some ideas about its solution. 1. To understand the problem one to has to know a little about the Citroën clutch system. In ordinary hydraulic clutch systems the entire force comes from the foot, which is transferred to an oil pressure by the master cylinder. This pressure is then transferred to the slave unit through a pipe, where the hydraulic pressure is transferred back to a force by the plunger, which in turn presses the clutch fork. The Citroën system is, however, a servo-assisted clutch system, where the power to drive the slave cylinder comes from the engine through the high-pressure oil. The function of the master cylinder is just to regulate this pressure (with the same oil, which is very elegant as usual with Citroën). A basic description of the system avoiding finer details is as follows (internal components can studied in the Spare Parts Manual, Table 11 and 24). The high-pressure oil comes in behind the plunger through the steel tube up at the red arrow 1. The pressure from the master cylinder enters at the yellow arrow 2. When the clutch pedal is pressed the pressure increases at arrow 2. This pressure moves the cylindrical combination slide valve located about at the broken line some millimetres to the right, opening the passage for high-pressure oil at arrow 1, whereupon this oil enters behind the plunger and moves it forward and presses upon the clutch fork. (This valve can be engaged mechanically by pressing e.g. a screwdriver against the plate just at the beginning of the broken line.) When the clutch pedal pressure is decreased again the pressure at arrow 2 decreases and the valve at arrow 1 closes. As a result the plunger is forced back by the clutch fork, and the liquid behind the plunger is flushed out through the banjo fitting at arrow 3 into a low-pressure region, and further through the textile-braided rubber tubing to a T-fitting where it merges with corresponding tubing from the brake master cylinder and then goes back to the reservoir. Now when the clutch plunger moves forth and back not all oil will be scraped back although it is fitted with two O-rings. This oil is collected by the rubber bellow and returned directly to the reservoir through the narrow tubing at arrow 4. This leak increases due to the inevitable wear with time of O-rings, roughness and scratches in the cylinder walls, etc. 2. There are a number of problems the design. The leak tubing is designed to carry away a very small flow and is thence very narrow, but adequate for a normal leakage flow. The first problem is that, although the tubing material is heat resistant, it cannot withstand direct contact with the exhaust tube. As a result it may melt. This may result in that it is blocked or melt off. If it is molten off but not blocked (as it appears to be in the picture) the overflow of oil will flow on the garage floor. But if it tubing is blocked oil start to accumulate inside the bellow until it is filled and the pressure there increase due to the elasticity of the bellow. What then happens depends on circumstances. If the bellow is efficiently sealed by the straps at both ends (arrows 5 & 6) it may start to inflate until it bursts, which is no catastrophe and continue to flow out that way, unfortunately on the garage floor, which is a nuisance. A more likely scenario, however, is that if the bellow is not to tightly strapped to the clutch body or the moving threaded bar it exits there or perhaps at the entrance of the overflow tubing which may be forced out. My tubing was blocked and I ordered a new from Campana. To my disappointment I got one that was too wide, the inner diameter being about the same as the outer diameter of the original tubing, and it was impossible to get in the to holes at the bellow and the rubber neck of the reservoir. Fortunately, the tubing could be pushed upon the old some centimetres and you directly got a perfect seal, so I cut of the original tubing some centimetres from both ends. I dont know if this was meant, but it worked perfectly and in addition was beneficial from a number of points of views. Firstly, but not too essential, you got a freer flowing system, but secondly, and more important, the wider tubing is not so easily molten together by the heat. Therefore, I would recommend this solution instead of replacing the old tubing with original narrow tubing. But the new tubing should be longer than the original and strapped well away from the exhaust system. It does not matter how long it is. 3. Then we come to the rest, and here the remedy depends on how much work you are willing to spend. If we begin with that you dont want to spend more time than necessary the following cure is recommended. The role of the bellow is three-fold (at least): 1) to prevent dirt coming in, 2) to avoid loss of leak oil (costly, annoyance of oil on the floor and to avoid fill up the reservoir), and 3) to return the leak oil properly to the reservoir. The two first points are obvious but the last needs further comments What happens if the oil in some way leaks out from the system at the slave unit is that the liquid out of the line from the master cylinder start to flow out and finally empties it. The flow may be small, but for cars like these that seldom are driven it may empty the master unit. The result is that we should start the car the clutch pedal bottoms, and we must pump to fill the system again. If there are no leakage in the slave cylinder region the leakage is return back to the reservoir, and with the exit at its rubber neck being well above the master cylinder and with an air break down to free surface there is no risk that the oil is siphoned out this way. The system should then stay filled for ever, without a need to pump the clutch pedal at start. When the leak return tubing has been fixed there remain two leak leaks. The easiest to fix is between the bellow and the slave cylinder house. This is easily done but proper strapping, e.g. of the electric type, and since the neck is fitted with a flange so it will not slip off. The front leak leak is more problematic. This end should also be strapped. The problem is that it has to be strapped on a threaded bar that is narrower than the whole in the bellow, and this makes it difficult to get it totally tight. And even small leaks with time . This design is probably Maseartis (i.e. Alfieris) and the cheapest imaginable just to cut off a threaded bar. Citroën did not use it. My first solution to this problem was to turn the locking nut with its cylindrical extension around and strap on the wider cylindrical part. It did not work since the bellow slipped off. To prevent this I in addition put a washer and a nut from inside the bellow a tightened well and, after adjusting, strapped. Then the bar is not locked at the fork, but this did not seem to matter since the nut are locked to the bar and the bar through the straps locked to the bellow and slave housing, and besides that cannot turn around due to the leakage oil tubing. To my surprise it still some oil leaked out on the clutch fork, and finally I realised that this leak came through the threads. Contrary to the conical self-tightening threads used in the house these are straight and not self-tightening. Therefore, I tightened them with Teflon tape (Permatex or similar should also work). Firstly then the system was leak-free. In hindsight (or if have been more clever) I would perhaps instead of turning the locking nut and using another nut and washer, bought and extra locking nut and used together with a washer from inside the bellow. But the definite solution, which I will go for next time the cylinder has to be removed, is to make a new rod (as principally shown below, no thought about proportions), threaded in one end just enough to allow for adjustment, and the increase the diameter to above that of the hole of bellow (also flanged there so that can be tightened by strapping) but not so wide that the rod cannot wobble enough inside the plunger to follow movement of the clutch arm, and which finally ends with a smooth taper. 4. However, these components unavoidably wear over the years, and finally you have to remove the whole slave unit for renovation. And this automatically brings me to (one of) my favourite Maserati devices: To be a Maserati owner you must be equipped with a good portion of humour. Due to the clever design it is namely impossible to remove it without removing the header! The exhaust tube makes it impossible to get the bolts that hold the slave unit out. Just some centimetre is missing, but this is sufficient. So dont waste time on this. (If Alfieri had accepted an assisting engineer there would perhaps have been time to think also of such aspects instead of just squeezing in components, and if they had had a serious test and quality boss instead of Bertocchi, such problems could have reported back to engineering for correction.) Actually you dont need to remove them, it is enough to just back off the nuts so much that the exhaust tube can be pushed sideway by the small distance needed, but since it is not much more work to remove them you can equally well do that. And time it will certainly take. More than an hour (at least). Due to the clever design you have to remove 16 bronze nuts from all possible directions using all available with all types of tools you have, spanners, sockets, extensions, etc., from below with your arm above the head (which is awful), from above and through the wheel arc, the front wheels thus has to be removed. Every nut is a victory. In my case it was not made easier since there was three types of nuts (11, 12 and 13 mm). And it takes the same time (at least) to get it back. But if you already at the beginning know that, it is less frustrating, but without doubt it is character-building. I have made it trice (twice for the clutch and once for the head gasket) and feels that this is enough. Now this exhaust system in the photo looks different than mine with the lambda sonds, so hopefully it is more space there, and possible to remove the unit without the need to remove the headers. When finally the slave unit has been removed the plunger should be taken out. This may be problematic since it is difficult to get a grip on it. Then force it out with pressurised air through the various entrances. You may need to open it by pressing the slide valve with e.g. a screwdriver, but be careful so that the plunger does not fly out and hurt someone or get damaged. Then change the O-ring and, if necessary, hone the walls. Such small honing devices come comparably cheap (typically below 10 Euros) and the work can be made with by hand an ordinary electric drill. Move the stones in and out with about 45 degrees inclination until it feels smooth). Change the copper gaskets (or at least heat them until glow). A final warning. Do not torque the banjo fitting too much since it easily breaks. I made a new one in stainless steel from an ordinary bolt. It is easiest to drill straight in a lathe but with al little care it should also be possible in press drill or even free by hand. Assemble, and you will have a somewhat cleaner garage floor (perhaps worth all work). I have left the good news to the end: There are no problems with the purge valve 8. As can be seen the ground is namely hit by the clutch arm nut and this component seems sturdy enough to withstand horrible blows. Greetings Ulf
The Design is not well developed however it is cleaver. The clearance to get the slave/actuator out is tight and may be mine has more clearance but I can get it out and the heat shield. I just made a simple aluminium shield that acts as heat sink and is attached via the top bolt. Getting it out is a sequence and if you loosen the bolts the botton should fall out and you can push the unit up to get the top on out. A word of advice be gental with the main hydraulic return, they are only a 7 mm thread and very weak I also encased all the return new Mil spec lines in Aeroquip sleeve a sealed the end with high temp RTV as it isnt affected by oil etc. The main than that gives grief on the actuator beside the O rings is the spindle / shuttle valve the wear and the clutch creeps other than that they are very reliable. I concede I need a clamp on my boot but they are so tight they dont come off. The clear Hydraulic return capillary lines are a Citroen item and there has been some on EBay recently. Cheers Graeme Image Unavailable, Please Login
http://www.autotrader.co.uk/EDITORIAL/CARS/news/AUTOTRADER/OTHER/abandoned_car_collection_up_for_sale.html Nice link for the green Khamsin coming up for auction. There's also a pdf of the cars available within the link. Just a FYI Cheers Edit PDF link here, it's too big to load directly. http://data.bidmaster.co.uk/lsk/documents/AUTOMOBILESDOC_006.pdf
Amen! But it didn't get any better in the later years of the end of the Biturbo era. They seemed to carry on this tradition long after Alfieri and Bertocchi had left the scene. I'm currently pulling the engine from my Ghibli Open Cup and yesterday I was joyfully reminded that you cannot pull the steering rack out without first loosening and lifting the engine. Which means detaching the exhaust, tranny mounts etc. Then you can gain access to the final bolt. You have to remove the steering rack to remove the engine. It just has to be done in sequence with a hoist. If I was only swapping out the steering rack I'd be enraged. Tradition! Bob S.
Hi Bob The Khamsin rack comes out with 7 bolts two hadraulic lines and you dont even have to jack the car. Mind you you have to take the rack out as part of the engine removal. Cheers Graeme
It's also right on top! Of course with my Bora you don't have to disturb the steering rack at all! ;>)) Bob S.
Hi Bal I went to the auction on Saturday, and as expected after the press in Classic & Sportscar it turned into a bun fight! The place was packed out - it was rather funny as the place was more set up for local provincial fine art & furniture sales, so there were a lot a bemused local Lovejoy types!! Rough results (from memory) : Quattroporte - £17 k ! Khamsin - £27k Longchamp -£38/39 ?! Deauville - £17k I had a bash at the Khamsin (I know I've got one already, but I have a natural tendency to want to rescue any Italian exotic I see!), but it got too hot for me, bearing in mind you still need to add the buyers premium and any shipping costs! The Khamsin had a very good body with very little corrosion, but had been resprayed (quite poorly) for some unknown reason from I think Blue Celeste to lime green. The engine bay and interior were extremely scruffy which I hoped would put people off! The car was complete, original and a very good starting point for a restoration, however the state of the engine is unknown of course. I just hope it goes to a good home, to someone who has the vision (and the cash) to restore it properly. I just have a horrible feeling it will be back in the classifieds shortly, either with a poor respray and gently 'recommissioned' just so it runs, or with a huge mark up with nothing at all done to it. Time will tell.. There was lots of interest from Europe and the Longchamp made good money - it was definitely the best conditon of the cars, but I fear its value lies in its low mileage and original features (eg factory plastic still on the seats) so to actually use it may wipe the face off its value? I've been following these vehicles for a few months now when we heard about them via the De Tomaso club (who incidentally put a lot of hard work in behind the scenes with visits/photos/valuations/dealing with the press), and the original plan was to try and buy them en masse as a job lot so that they would go to people who would ensure they are looked after properly, however the Inland Revenue and the mad old 'benefactoress' put paid to that! Still a great adventure to be part of, albeit indirectly!!! Doug
There is your answer Bal. Thanks for the report Doug, that matches what someone else (thanks J.!) had told me on site but you beat me to posting it! Yes AM120419 did 27500 pounds with all premiums. Pity that the green was not original but I hope and believe and etc etc that it went to a good home: if the buyer is reading this would love to know as much or as little as you will concede about your plans for it and I wish you the best in the process, let me us know if we can help. Amazing how the internet changes things 10, 15 years ago it could have been a steal. best regards, Marc
Hi Marc and Bal The price tallies well for a car sold in Australia last year Manual RHD at $65k AUD. Very original car mechanically very sound , cosmetically tired with the classic hydraulic head light issues. Cheers Graeme
Guys, Thanks for the info. That is big bucks for a car that is largely unknown. The engine rebuild can be big numbers alone and as Graeme says the LHM system is gonna be shot. I know that it's not healthy in my car and I bought that running. Pity about the respray as I thought the colour (though not one I would think of choosing) looked rather good on the car. Then again I'm thinking of respraying mine one day. 27K, but to be done properly you could easily spend another 20K and still not have finished. I agree that the internet has put paid to bargains, and Doug, I know that twitching feeling when another Khasmin comes up for sale, it's as if you are drawn to it. On the other hand these figures can only be good for the values of our cars. Bal
I owned a Porsche 911 2.4S 23 years ago. I reasurched the cars and found through a freind a Venom Green ex English car. Excellent condition log books the lot. Fabulious thing amazing quick and still even by todays standards. I paid the then equivelient of $8K UKP $16,000.AU. I knew the car was special but the market didnt care. i still sold it (regretably) for $36,000. AUD a few years latter. The market now recognises how good these cars are and 150 plus to find one and then they dont come up for sale. Sound familiar I wounder if the Khamsin will go the same way. Cheers Graeme
Well, I really enjoyed it a couple of years. But as I like more agile cars I had to buy the little Merak -and never looked back. Lovely car! Ciao! Walter
Yes I saw at the Nurburgring in August he pretended to walk past his old Khamsin 056 without seeing it: clear proof of withdrawal symptoms Whoohhooohooh;-) best regards, Marc
Hi John! So what is the latest in your restoration project? You are so fast in your work 1032 is probably finished by now and you have test driven it to Siberia and back?;-) Ha det sa bra, Marc
("Firing Squad: 1-2-3-FIRE!") NoNoNo Marc, I still like to see my ol #056 and be very happy to talk to the owner. But I didn`t like it when he replaced the original "Celeste" to this dark-blue! Also I do not like the black-covering of the rear-fender between the lights which was a very significant design-detail of Bertone with this car. Ciao! Walter
Ok fair enough! On a sadder note in an old issue of VCM I just bought off Ebay (#58 September 15 1990) there is mention on page 54 of the Khamsin of Robert di Chiara being destroyed or at least having its roof ripped off when backed into a truck (no injuries). This is AM120US1066 and there is, to my knowledge, no more reference to this car after that.... It had previously been mentioned with a letter by him in VCM issue 50 -pages 25 and 26-the one focused on Khamsins. Hopefully it was repaired: does anybody know: Frank, Ivan? best regards, Marc
I will present some pictures rather than writ al lot - all my time is spend in the garage! Some info - the chassis will be presented at ESSEN cars show (exhibition around classics cars) don't know if any of you will go there. The company who do the chemical treatment, paint removal, zink and water paint (basin) have borrowed the as they find it interesting as they say! The car will be back with me in mid April - I will post pictures! Car is 100 % converted from US to EU spec.. and parts are assembled and ready for installation later! All the best John
New rear hatch took me 4 days to get perfect in curves with car - never again! Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
The bumpers from 385 has been straighten and moulds are in progress. When first print is done I will make them perfect and the make a new set of moulds once again! Wolla.... and we have the best moulds in Europe!
I will try once again - failed last time! All hydraulic components will go for renovation in UK - including all Bosch components! Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Beautiful!! Your work is excellent John, congratulations! It was very nice to meet you, and I can confirm that the work is just as good as the pictures shows. It was nice to read that the bumpers could be used, but I'm sorry for not giving you any leads on hydraulic repairs yet. I'm still working on it, but the one contact I had, led to four others. I will post an update when I get more information after Easter. I'll get prices for the shock absorber construction just after Easter, but need to know the inner diameter of the rear springs. If the two on each side differs, I need to know that as well. John, René and I order three complete set of shock absorbers from a UK company. The shocks firm rate will be fully adjustable by an external screw, also the rear ones, but will be identical to the originals otherwise. I think the prices will be very compatible, and will post that as well when I get them.
