Anyone have inside information on the rumored M5 rival, which would be below the Quattroporte?...
Anyone have inside information on the rumored M5 rival, which would be below the Quattroporte? http://www.autoblog.com/2010/04/21/maserati-reportedly-to-build-sub-quattroporte-m5-rival/
I saw that report earlier today... I have always loved the look of Masers - they simply blow away almost any other car out there in that department... However, I would say that if Maserati is going to try and compete with an M5, they are going to really need to step up the performance of their engines in a big way... The current M5 has 500 HP and there is a rumored 2011 555 HP model coming soon... I for one would really love it if Maserati would step it up a bit. But, I sometimes wonder if it is because they must maintain an inferior performance image when compared to Ferrari... Matt
IMO it would make more sense to develop an entry Maserati to face the Porsche Boxter, BMW M3 etc. below the GranTurismo-price range! LIghter, 2+2 seater, a strong V6- or small V8-engine and in coupe- & spyder configuration. Ciao! Walter
It goes both ways, Ford's new 5.0 Mustang GT has a very similar spec to the current M3. Same power to weight ratio etc. There were a few magazine tests done when the Quattroporte and current M5 were newer that showed the Quattroporte could post faster lap times than the M5. Mainly due to better weight distribution. Anyway, it isn't all about the highest hp numbers. Walter, I think Alfa Romeo may be tasked with Boxster and M3 type competitors. Not sure how well they can do it unless they have a new platform.
I like Walter's idea but I agree with your comment. Of course they could have Alfa build a Maserati badged car like that. Hopefully not in the 8C price range. The current line-up is yacht sized. They could do an AMG type version but it's still going to be heavy and big. The most probably and least risky path ... Bob S.
John, Alfa is not on the same league then BMW, Porsche etc.! The Italians are masters in ruin their companies (FIAT, Alfa and -THE desaster- Lancia!) and their heritage. Alfa`s actual 8C is more or less a Maserati and is build on the Maserati production line! After the launch of such goodcars like Quattroporte V, GranCabrio and GranTurismo the future looks bright for the Trident marque! They have to use that! Ciao! Walter
I completely agree. Alfa is more like VW these days, but it seems from the recent Fiat plans that came out, Alfa will pursue the middle sporty car market. At least Maserati is building great cars.
i've always thot the Quattroporte had a lot of potential. Given the weight, i think it is underpowered and that auto tranny is avg at best. The interior no doubt trumps the m5. The m5's v10 is sublime. The upcoming m5 is rumored to have something like 570hp. Insane.
Its really simple the QP is beautiful and even the "underpowered" 4.7 sounds better than the M5 in my opinion. The SMG gearbox in the M5 is a disaster at best in comparison the auto in the QP is seemless. At the end of the day one is a bespoke, stunning, Italian piece of art and the other is based on a Munich Taxi. I know what one I would rather have....just imagine a 500 bhp QP, would be sublime, those looks with higher power and that very unique feel the Maserati has.
...well, better based on a Munich Taxi than on this simple US-V8-Taxis in NYC with rotten and bumping rear-axle! OK, I like the QP more but the V10 of the current M5 is magic! Ciao! Walter
The BMW V-10 is indeed magic, but the SMG box is misery. Between that, the cheap plastic bodywork and minimal interior room, my M6 was gone in a year with no regrets. Although I like the looks, the 612 is neither fish nor fowl. Trunk space is totally insufficient for a 4-seat vehicle and the electronics are a generation behind. Same could be said for the QP, but with a V12 I'd be sorely tempted. In the meantime my money goes to MB - superb build quality, unbelievable torque.
At the time when this was -propably- on their agenda, Ferrari clearly said "No, e basta!" about this plan. Another foolish desicion out of the automotive industry from "Bella Italia". The Italians are veeeeeery proud people - they believe that they can everything better than the rest of the world. This behavior causes one desaster after another. In 2007 to me: "Walter, what? Our Quattroporte, our sportive 4-door masterpiece, our bella motori - with automatic gearbox??? NEVER EVER" Result: the ales went down in the US because nobody clearly understand why a big sedan needs to be driven like a F1-car??? Conclusion: Maserati fitted a very good auto-gearbox on their masterpiece! The Italians - always 2 steps head and the one step backwards! I knew some people wha had their cheques written and signed for a QP with V12-power! But the Italians thought different. Once more! Perhaps with the next model! Ciao! Walter
I agree 100 percent. What Maserati particularly needs in the near future - apart, obviously, from a QP VI - are new models that build on their sports car heritage, and developing a "Merak for the 2010s" would seem a rather sensible thing to do. It would have to be an absolutely gorgeous sporty car, probably with a small V8. Amazingly, Maserati ended last year again in the black (although barely...), which it actually has done for the last three years (2007, 2008 and 2009), even though the number of cars sold went down tremendously in 2009. It seems Maserati has been able to both cost-cut effectively and find more flexiible ways to organize their production in order to minimize fixed costs/overheads. What bothers me a bit is that very little is used on research and development, which may make Maserati heavily dependent on whatever takes place elsewhere in the FIAT corporation. Gabriel
i have an 02 spyder cc. really a great car and other than normal problems (clutch) the 25000 miles has been a pleasure. the redesigned current body while very aggressive is not as easy on the eye. i could use a new spyder. i am waiting---waiting---waiting. TWO seat PLEASE. power is OK just how much more is needed! snap the neck is enough now. want more. do what i did, viper, for a real scary ride
All this discussion about the Maserati V8 being underpowered. What about the new V8 coming out in the Ferrari Italia? There is the engine needed to create a true rival to the "M" powered cars. Jeff Dallas, Texas
Am I missing something here? Why should Maserati focus on beating an M5? Aren't the clients for either worlds apart? They tried to compete with BMW before, the Bi-Turbo was in many ways much better than the top of the line 323i, and subsequent derivatives. We all know what happened. I don't see why a niche marque like Maserati would aim to compete with a manufacturer of mass-produced articles, they are bought with different emotions. One could maybe PROGRESS from an M5 to something as noble as a Maserati.
Nope, I don't think you're missing anything. I fully expect them to continue on the path aptly described by your quote. I too wish they'd do the small car thing again but I just don't know how many people would pay a ton of money for a small car with a name which exudes the very idea of luxury and beautiful design. They can't compete with a 3 series and even though I personally loved the idea of the luxurious pocket rocket Biturbo such a car would have to cost well north of $100K and I just don't think it would sell. Bob S.
Bob, ...and -of course!- a new Biturbo-Maserati has to look much better than the edgy earlier ones incl. the Testosteron-car, the Shamal! We need something in the Porsche BoxterS/ BMW M3-league. Nothing more - but nothing less! Ciao! Walter
Hi Walter, It was a nice design for those times but today, yes something different is needed now. Though Gandini's update of the Biturbos did help a lot though. It still has one of the nicest designed interiors and ergonomically everything is very comfortably within reach while operating it. I'm not a big fan of the interiors of the current Maserati's. They just seem uninspired,. Everything is there except that something. They're certainly nowhere as avant garde as the Bora was or even the Indy which is more staid but very nicely executed. But I'm certainly a fan of the enormous improvement in build quality over all the previous Maserati's. I'm currently disassembling my GOC for a paint job and the engine is out. So I have a pretty good idea of how things improved in between the original Biturbos and one of the very last ones. Yes there were improvements but mostly in the engine, drive-train and brakes. The electrics are a lot better but none of this is like the current cars. But then we are talking about 1995 versus 2010. Take a look a close at a 1995 Ferrari such as a 355. There are a lot of the same exact pieces on these cars. Not such great stuff really. But Ferrari gets a pass. I'd love a high quality version of something the size of a Biturbo and twin turbos are in vogue once again. It'll never happen. That's an Alfa project. Bob S.
Great..Another sub-par over priced low production car trying to compete with BMW/ AMG. Face it folks..it's not gonna happen. The production levels are far to low to compete. They just don't have the funds or capacity to make a better car over the production run. The QP is a sub par luxury car at best..the Hyundai Genisses is a better overall machine. If they want to come out with a "better faster car" great. But it won't be an M5 or AMG in the long run.
Bob, I am not a big fan of the Bitrbos! The question is not to compare 1955 to 2010. The answer is to compare the 1995-Biturbo with a Porsche/BMW M3 from that year! Do this and you ill clearly see the differences. Something about the Biturbo with its rather kitschy clock: it always reminds me of the look of old Italian guyzzz from the period when they had their shirts open and gold chains around their neck. It was fashion for old men and somewhat ridiculous! The GUCCI-70ies age! But GUCCI became really cool after it was modernised by Tom Ford. Same with Maserati. Ciao! Walter
Really, I AM shocked to hear this ... ;>) Hey there's no question about the build quality being much better on the BMW and certainly the Porsche. But the BMW M3 of that era just has no pizazz in the interior. I really like what Gandini did to the car but how Maserati executed these changes ain't so great. What else is new? That was Fiat by that time. The gearbox, diff and brakes are the equals of its rivals. The chassis was competitive as well. Engine electronics, ancient. Same boxes as an F40. But 330HP from a 2L motor is damn impressive. I think they'll probably do a couple hotter versions of their current models but always be a bit short of BMW performance and technology. Does being slightly short in performance matter all that much with most of their clientele? Probably not. No one NEEDS 500hp. Besides, it may soon be illegal in this country now that the Stalinists have all the power. Bob S.
I don't know about you, but 500 hp sounds good to me! The Stalinists will not have their way. Ciao, George
