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Maseratis in racing after 1967

Discussion in 'Maserati' started by Merak1974, Sep 11, 2010.

  1. staatsof

    staatsof Six Time F1 World Champ
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    How often and who's driving the respective cars?
    Sorry but it's not a series well known over here.

    I'm just not sure if it's a significant thing or not yet.
    It's a cliche but a "track record" has to be developed.

    God that's a huge looking car though.
     
  2. Maserati Blue

    Maserati Blue Formula Junior

    Dec 13, 2010
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    Some races are significant, this one is more interesting because it has a variety of GT brands.

    Others, like the one-brand races, are not so interesting. For example, the Maserati Trofeo thing is a nice marketing stunt, you can pay 130,000 euros or something like that and you can race. So those races are mixed up with people who aren't professionals (there was some top-model driving one, etc). Maybe if you or a friend of yours is racing then it might be interesting.
     
  3. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Nothing to do with purism!
    The Ghibli was constructed under the Orsi-aera but the result was launched when Citroen owned the company in 1968.
    Therefor the Mistral is the last "real" Maserati GT-car.

    If I would be too puristic than I would cound the Tipo Tipo 6CM from 1935/36 as the last "real" Maserati as it was made when the company was owned by the brothers before the Orsis took over in 1937.

    Based on the history of Maserati S.p.A. I personally recognize the company as "real" as long as Maserati was in private ownership. Citroen was a company that was non-privately owned. But this is my personal view.
     
  4. staatsof

    staatsof Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Depends on what one considers an interruption. I think Walter would consider DeTomaso an interruption. But it has not closed it doors.

    The Bugatti situation is absurd. They currently produce the equivalent of a very high speed Royale. It's excessive just as the Royale was and nothing like the smaller lightweight cars they used to make.
     
  5. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    Yes but unlike the MC12 the 250F was actually a Maserati.

    Come on the MC12 is just an Enzo with a bit of development and a Maserati badge stuck on it's nose. I don't consider the current Alfa Romeo 8c to be an Alfa Romeo either, it is a Maserati with an Alfa Romeo badge on its nose.

    Both these great companies no longer exist, they are just badge engineering exercises for Ferrari and FIAT.
    Pete
     
  6. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Pete,
    you are totally wrong about your view on the MC12!

    Yes, the monocoque chassis and front screen are the same as with the Enzo!

    The rest is muchdifferent:
    - the Enzo has a "simple" chain-driven cylinder head while the MC12 has a much more advanced gear-driven cylinder head which makes the engine significantly more responsive!
    - suspension of the MC12 is much better that that of the Enzo as the Maserati was made for racing (with 50 cars to homologate the type for that intention) while the Enzo was made only as a GT-car. Therefor it has a much softer suspension than the MC12.
    - electronic setup of the MC12 is much "sharper" than that of the Enzo.
    - the electrical gearbox is faster than that of the Enzo.

    I drove both cars and the Enzo is the more user friendly car while the MC12 is perfect on any race circuit, no matter if in GT- or race-version.

    The MC12 is more Maserati than the Enzo is Ferrari!
     
  7. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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    The GT Sprint series is part of the International Superstars racing franchise, as a support series to the main class (saloon car racing).

    The Vallelunga race was, I believe, the Maserati GT3 debut (http://www.omnicorse.it/magazine/22118/gt-sprint-series-a-vallelunga-debutto-vincente-della-maserati-gt3). So far the Gran Turismo has only been raced (with some success) in the GT4 class (apart from Maserati's own Trofeo series), so you are absolutely right that its track record needs to be developed.

    One interesting aspect of this venture is of course that it's Swiss Team that has developed the car, not the factory (http://www.caradisiac.com/Une-Maserati-GT3-78601.htm).
     
  8. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    Walter,
    Everything you have mentioned is just minor development of an existing car. Maserati did not design the monocoque, cast the engine and gearbox, etc. They were given an Enzo and turned it into a race car.

    Now if Maserati had actually designed the MC12 first and Ferrari stole it to make a road car then I'd agree with you, otherwise we are talking about Maserati being a race car development shop for the Enzo, nothing more nothing less. Just like the companies that make the British Touring cars for manufacturers, lots of changes to suit racing but they have not made their own car.

    I'm sure they feel very different to drive, just like a Honda Civic road car feels very different to a race prepared one, especially nowadays as the racing car will likely have a sequential gearbox.

    Respectively
    Pete
     
  9. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Pete,
    in the modern car industry its very hard to tell who came first with something and who covered from what and when? Car manufacturing today is more or less an exchange of components to keep the costs down.

    In almost every feature about the MC12 you can red "....based on the Ferrari Enzo..." but without mentioning the differencies. To make an entire new cyl.-head is not only a development. Its a new design and this was made at Maserati "Corse" and not in Maranello.

    According to Michael Bartels, the VITAPHONE-team owner and racer of their MC12 "Corsa", Ferrari was never pleased about the MC12.
    Until today they were successfull to avoid a combined track- or road test of the Enzo and the MC12. Ferrari did everything not to permit that to all the publications they had plans for such test. And Ferrari knew why...

    I have driven both cars. The Enzo is a fast cofee-racer while the MC12 is a modern race car, re-tuned for road usage!

    Its also worth to mention, that the later Ferrari FXX is based on the MC12 "Corsa"!
     
  10. Ferraripilot

    Ferraripilot F1 World Champ
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    Walter, I also heard Ferrari were set against having the Enzo and MC12 tested side by side. I did not know they went so far to really be against the car in general or frown upon it but it certainly would not surprise me. Ferrari probably don't like seeing Maserati with all those race wins. One thing is for sure though, Ferrari can not take a majority of the credit for the MC12, that honor goes to the brilliant suspension guys at Corsa.
     
  11. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    +1
     
  12. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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  13. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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  14. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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    #64 Merak1974, Dec 2, 2012
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Fabio Greco and Valter Rosette won the GT4 category with their Gran Turismo in today's Brazilian GT Championship race in Cascavel.

    They are currently 3rd in the Championship with one race weekend left.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  15. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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  16. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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    [ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0NG6_IrBEeM]Presentazione Maserati GT3 - YouTube[/ame]
     
  17. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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  18. staatsof

    staatsof Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Thanks for pointing out that thread.


    Politically astute ...

    This should be fun and nice to see after the MC12's success.
     
  19. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    ++++1 !!!
     
  20. qp400i

    qp400i Karting

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    There was a brief episode of racing a 3200GT in the Dutch Winter Endurance Championship in the mid 2000s. It did not perform very well amidst the Porsche cups and is now owned by a privateer enjoying it on track days.

    dailysportscar.com
     
  21. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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    Thanks for posting!
    This was totally unknown to me; and probably most other on this forum as well :)
    An 8th place in a large and competitive grid in a 500km race doesn't seem bad at all. Did that 3200GT enter any other races?
     
  22. qp400i

    qp400i Karting

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    The car was owned by Frits Hessing (at the time importer of Maserati in the Netherlands) and he raced it in the said winter endurance competition. That's all I know of it.

    Photo's of a recent track day appearance:
    2013 » 16-03-2013
     
  23. Merak1974

    Merak1974 Formula 3

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    Some great shots of the 3200GT in here :D
    Thanks.
    Looks quite modified...
     
  24. Maserati Blue

    Maserati Blue Formula Junior

    Dec 13, 2010
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    Interesting find! Seems like a fun car and it is obviously fast enough to keep up with a lot newer cars.

    Although I'm not so sure about the styling... erm... it has no style whatsoever, excessive side skirts, butchered rear bumper. Shame really.
     

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