Massa intent on going one better in 2009

LMAO! The great LH was royally spanked that race and that was the drive of the year IMHO; too bad the clueless HK won it.

Massa really opened eyes after that race..

 

I agree. Champions are a breed apart. Although a seemingly nice guy, Massa isn't the right material.

 

Just what we needed another Massa bashing thread.

 

I have no idea, again, I have no access to their contracts and I don´t usually trust the media on this point because they haven´t got that access either.

But lets say for the sake of argument that Kimi makes a lot more money than Massa, than this only illustrates his position in the driversmarket (which will be far less than it was a year a go) and in no way his position within the team relative to Massa. Do you have examples where Massa was asked to race in favor of Kimi while he (Massa) had still a mathematical chance to win the title? There are examples concerning Barrichello/Schumacher, but not concerning Kimi/Massa. That is because they receive equal treatment and should be proof enough that there isn´t a fundamental driver-hierarchy at Ferrari anymore. And why should they have?

If 2008 showed us anything, it showed us that Massa can take on Kimi both in qualifyingspeed as in racingspeed and that he isn´t any more accident-prone than our Finnish drinkingbuddy.

 

Pure and utter nonsense. Champions are the ones that have gathered the most points in a single season. They usually drive for one of the top teams and get more than their fair share of victories, fastest laps, poles etc. Massa fits that bill perfectly.

 

What do you mean? It's already January 14th!

 

Maybe people still do not believe that Massa could be a WDC because of his demeanor? He is not unapproachable, aloof, arrogant, pompous etc etc which are trait's believed to be necessary by some to become a WDC! My full support lies behind Ferrari securing the WCC this season but my driver support, which has alway's the most important to me, will go to Felipe no matter the outcome. I like Kimi but I can connect more with Felipe aswell as his plight.

 

Busted lol!! What I like about you is you keep me inline aswell as on my toes!

 

TOUCHE'and AMEN

 

Real Champions earn their points during the race. They don't get them awarded at the green table after the race.

 

a good post amongst many bad ones. some people just love to stir ****. for those who support massa, and think he can win the WDC, your odds are short as there are many good opponents. for those who say he can't your odds are much better. if he does win the WDC, or finish better than kimi again, what BS excuses will come out from those who said he NEVER would?

 

Again, you show a blatant misunderstanding of the sport:

Massa wasn´t awarded with any points, but Bourdais got a penalty which happened to have of consequence that Massa moved up in the order. That wasn´t a personal gift from the FIA or anything, since Massa just happened to be in that position. Furthermore, the points which are a consequence of penalties given to other drivers, count just as much as any other point, since penalties are a part of the game.

In 1994, Hill clearly wasn´t the best driver. His title was a consequence of the penalties handed out to Schumacher in a much bigger way then Massa was ´helped´ by the penalty of Bourdais. That doesn´t take away from the fact that his title is of no less value than any title of any other driver. Stay with the facts.

 

Ahh Mr Scud ... a improvment don't you think....
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You show a blatant misunderstanding of Manipulation by the FIA.

To control something or someone to your advantage, often unfairly or dishonestly:

 

Show me any proof, anything, to show that the FIA punished Bourdais for the sole purpose of giving Massa an advantage. It is good costum to back these types of severe accusations up. If you can´t, than just stick to the facts like anyone else. Or better yet, just shut up.

 

You might want to look up who really won the title in 1994 before you start judging people on their knowledge about F1...

PS: I highly recommend Matchett's "Life in the fast lane" as an excellent review of what went down in 94 behind the scenes.

Pretty much everybody (except for the most red visioned Massadorators) saw right through the FIA's attempts to manipulate the championship and called it by that name. Including past Ferrari drivers.

But more importantly the FIA admitted mistakes in their calls in 2008 (without naming specifics) and changed its penalty system by restricting big decisions to a selected panel of few judges with greater experience than the guys had who came down with the Spa and Fuji decisions.

Of course none of that will ever convince you, but that's ok. You seem to do your own history writing of F1. Tell me please: Who won the 96 title in your parallel universe? Giovanni Lavaggi?

 

Dont get me wrong I wasnt bashing him. I was one of the few supporters he had last year! Fact is, if his stupid engine didnt go in hungary he would have been WDC, or if the team didnt attach a mobile petrol station to his car in singapore. Then again he did make his own mistakes (more than hamilton) which you could say cost him the WDC.

Whatever, the new season is almost starting and here he can show the remaining doubters that he is worthy.

 

I dont know what you're on about.

spa:

hamilton gets a 30sec penalty, drops to 3rd. cost him 4 points. Massa promoted to 1st from second. In total Lewis loses 6 points alltogether.

Fuji:
both Massa AND hamilton get a penalty. Hamilton gets his because he manages to run almost half the front runners of the track, losing them all places and massa because he outbrakes himself and hits hamilton, causing Hamilton to spin. All's fair and both get their drivethrough.
nearing the end of the race massa makes an effort and is up a few places on hamilton despite running 14th and 15th respectivly after their penalty's (IIRC). after a pitstop of massa, massa makes a move on bourdais for what i believe was 7th, and massa spins. bourdais gets a penalty and massa picks up an additional point. So the total of what hamilton loses to Massa during the whole season is 7 points in controversial FIA decisions.

I'm sure you'll agree with the penalty that Hamilton got for what happend at canada wasn't controversial, nor the penalties he got at france (cutting chicane, blocking during quali).

Those are the ifs and buts we here constantly.

Here's mine. IF massa's engine didnt blow at hungary, he would have been 10 points up.

Massa did very well last year and got let down by his team/engine one time to often.

 

You wouldn't recognize PROOF if it painted itself purple and danced naked on a harpsicord singing subtle plans are here again...

If you like to fly in the face of public opinion carry on, I like a good laugh so please don't shut up.

 

+1 Bas and the NUMBERS DON'T LIE If FM wins in Singapore and Budapest - Hamilton who? Dont bother arguing with some here, they think FM was paying the Stewards anyway. He drove and wiped the floor with Kimi's reputation as the 'iceman' in the same equipment, and he faced LH on his terms and didnt blink. He is a fine F1 driver and showed what he had last year despite the naysayers. He got in the car and saved the season for FERRARI. He did what they paid him to do more so than the Vodka god Kimi

Felipe needs to keep it going this year or one can argue his great season of last was an abberation. I for one hopes he puts it together again and I do hope Kimi improves or his championship is just what it appears to be for now.....LH handed it to him by his own stupidity and frailty he had at the time. He, (LH) grew as well, and no one doubts his ability here at all!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

A Complete and utter absurd penalty, given after the flag dropped, to stop LH running away with the title.

LH gets the same penalty as Massa for touching no one!!, Massa has no chance of making the corner, drives off track and straight into Lewis in a nice T bone, it was HK who forced Kimi off track at the start anyway.

Bourdais hugging the curb coming out of the pit's no where else can he go!!!, stay's there and as they reach the apex Massa decides to CUT into him and spin's: End result Massa moves up the leader board!!! pathetic..
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And IIRC the result's of the decisions will be made public.

 

A welcome and long over due change. Lets hope its less controversial.

 

Also in F1 racing recently Massa admits his mistakes in hitting LH and owes up to it. Sometimes LH was less than forthcoming about his. Bottom line FM was driving to win and thats his job!!! He did it well.

 

the LH/KR spa debate has been done to death, and yes, the penalty was pretty absurd because in the end LH could have driven past kimi backwards.

I dont agree with the Fuji thing, hamilton triggered the whole situation in T1. Fair do's he didnt touch anyone and massa did, no denying that but LH only thought about himself going in to T1 and knew HK would rather ram RK than his teammate.

The bourdais thing, had another look today and that was a silly mistake by both the FIA and Massa. Bourdais didnt do much wrong there and didnt deserve the penalty.