McLaren F1 LMs in the USA?

Do you know if the federalized versions are going for more money than an S&D version?

 

I highly doubt it. The EPA/DOT haven't pounced on any of the remaining Ameritech cars (a few haven't declared S&D status) so i don't see why there would be a problem. Its a good point though and i'll have a look into it.

 

Only three of the seven cars have been sold by their original US owners and I have not heard any real figures on any of the deals. The original 5 owners were:

Gerd Petrik - FL (#045 & #067), Ralph Lauren - NY (#055 & #074), Herb Chambers - MA (#044), Carl Beal - TX (#042), Larry Ellison - CA (#062)

Petrik sold both his cars in 1999 or early 2000, possibly to avoid any mess associated with the enaction of Show & Display. Armen G of Newport Autosport ended up with #045 on his showroom floor, and Elon Musk (the former PayPal CEO) ended up with #067 which he still owns. Armen kept #045 for a while and then it appeared for sale at Motorcars Intl in the midwest for a short period of time. From there it was then sold to a venture capitalist in the Bay Area named Seth Neimann. Seth kept the car for a few years and in 2004 he sold the car back through Motorcars Intl to Gary Schaevitz of New York who still has the car today.

The other owner to let go of his Ameritech F1 was Larry Ellison who mentioned in an article prior to the sale that he didn't get much use out of the car and that it just sat in his garage. All the better that someone else get a turn with it I say, and so far the rather vague report that I heard was that the car was sold to another Silicon Valley exec, but again no price was mentioned.

I would assume that an F1 with essentially no strings attached would be more valuable to someone who intends to actually use the car, but I can't say what percentage of current or perspective F1 owners really fall into that category.

>8^)
ER

 

Anyone has pictures of Stroll's McLaren F1 (in Canada) that I haven't seen? I'll give you 10 bucks.

I have this:
http://www.derpca.com/photosK.htm
http://groups.msn.com/MyPorscheClub/monttremblant.msnw?Page=4

 

I'll pitch in $10 too. I'm sure Erik will as well (Peloton25). I highly doubt we'll be letting go of our money tho

 

I'll put down $20 for more photos of that one, but they have to be hi-res and I also need a chassis number.

>8^)
ER

 

very cool and informative thread, thanks for sharing Erik

 

The only price that has surfaced on an F1 GT through a credible source was the £1M figure the factory wanted for the prototype, but that was several years ago when standard road cars weren't selling for anywhere near the prices they are commanding today. I'd expect a price on par with what has been reported for the sale of LM3 - basically more than $3M USD assuming there was one for sale. Unless the factory has found a buyer for that car I don't believe any have changed hands.

>8^)
ER

 

Since I can't edit the original post, I just wanted to clarify one point I made in error earlier before someone else catches it:

GTR #01R wasn't built in 1994, instead it was the first F1 completed in 1995. Sorry to those who were trying to take detailed notes here.


Additionally on the omitted F1 road chassis numbers from the #001 -> #075 sequence which is always confusing to some people, Driving Ambition includes this partial explaination:

That accounts for 8 of the missing numbers in the sequence and the additional three to make up the difference between 64 and 75 were the three F1 GTs - 54F1GT, 56XPGT & 58F1GT. No real explanation was giving for skipping around like that.

So, if anyone ever tries to sell any of you a standard F1 road car for a good deal and references one of those chassis numbers, run far, far away.

>8^)
ER

 

SSSH!!! I have the buyer on the ropes... i mean, ready to go... SSSH!

--Dan

 

hopefully we`ll be lucky enough to see it at an event up in tremblant this summer...but if not...the FXX hes getting will do just fine,lol

 

Peloton - Is it true that if someone were to buy a used F1 off of someone, and reported it to Mclaren, Mclaren would take it, and add things, or subtract things, like radio, and phone and stuff according to the new owner's desires? I saw a show on the History Channel that said something like that about the F1.

Also, which car is the orange one that has a matching coilor tow vehicle that has appeared at SEMA in recent years? This car has numerous rock chips on the front fascia, which leaves me to believe it sees fairly heavy use.

 

Peleton, Did you notice that on the passenger side (viewing the car from the rear: the right side) near the rear wheel has that duct you said was specific of the GTR converted for road use. Is it like this on all LM's that only this one side has the duct and not the other?

 

Only the duct on the left side is specific to the GTR models, and yes, all the LMs have a duct on the right side.

 

Repeated efforts to get any info on that F1 out of associates/friends of his, or through Ferrari of Quebec which I believe he still owns, have proved almost worthless so far. I think someone just needs to point blank ask him about it (assuming he is an approachable guy) and maybe we will get the real story. I volunteer you.

Yes, McLaren Cars still operates the McLaren Customer Care program with multiple authorized service centers around the world and the original factory in Woking, England is still used for heavier work like complete refits, custom jobs and accident repairs. They won't do these things you are asking about automatically - the new owner has to pay to have them done - but there are several unique upgrades that have been done for different clients over the years in regards to electronics and such. The price of their work is not cheap, but if you have an F1 and want to personalize it a bit, or just keep it in top shape, it's great to know that the service like that direct from McLaren Cars is still available.

The car is chassis #038 which when displayed at SEMA belonged to Dan Kennedy of Scottsdale, AZ. He did get a lot more use out of the car than your typical F1 owner and in displaying the car at that show and others, as well as taking it to the track when he was racing his 360 Challenge car, he really gave a lot of enthusiasts a chance to get an up close look at an F1 they probably wouldn't have otherwise had. He's a guy who grew up dreaming about supercars and through the success of his e-commerce companies has been able to live out his dreams.

The info I have says he sold the car sometime early this year to a gentlemen in Houston, TX who kept it for several months, but now has sold it to Bruce Weiner in Atlanta, GA. Its one of the most unique F1s there is with lots of additional features added by McLaren at the request of Dan when he purchased it sometime around the end of 2001 I believe.

>8^)
ER

 

As Malka stated - that vent I originally pointed out on the left side of the car is a feature on all 18 of the short tail F1 GTRs - whether converted for road use or not - but won't be found on any of the 6 LMs. I believe it offers additional cooling for the gearbox but have never seen a clear shot of what's behind that panel on the left side of a GTR in order to be certain. It is my understanding that the on-board jack hydraulic system is stashed behind that left panel on the GTRs so the vent could be related to that as well.

On the left side of the LMs there is a luggage compartment behind that panel similar to the one on a standard road car, though it is not carpeted like the standard F1's are. The LMs have no on-board jacking system btw.

All 18 of those GTRs as well as the 6 LMs do have that larger vent on the right side that you noted. This feeds air to the engine oil cooler which was added to the GTRs and included on the LMs as well. I'm sure these shots are probably included in one of those two galleries, but here are two pictures showing what that larger vent feeds. This would be exactly the same on the short tail GTRs.

I hope that helps to make it more clear.

>8^)
ER
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That's awesome, thank you very much.

 

So how many of the gtr's were converted to street use?

 

i think that question has already been answered...go look at the other posts.

 

I had mentioned there are 5 which have been painted Papaya Orange, but don't believe his particular question was previously addressed here.

When one of the road legal GTRs (#16R) was first listed for sale by it's owner in mid '03, the ad for it clearly stated that 4 GTRs (including that one) had been converted. It wore UK plate "N276 JBK" at the time and then was later seen wearing "N1 GPR" when Duncan Hamilton had it for sale. It's now in Australia, and apparently road registered there, but I don't know if it has a new plate as of yet.

The other GTR we know was converted by the factory with certainty would be Nick Mason's red #10R. It wears UK plate "K40 MCL", and based on statements he has made about the purchase of the car, his would definitely be one of the four.

David Clark, the former Sales Director at McLaren Cars currently owns GTR #06R which wears a UK Reg plate "P440 CPJ". I think it is safe to assume that would be one as well given his close ties to the factory.

Then there is a car we have narrowed down to either being GTR #14R or #15R which wears UK plate "M66 MCL" and has been spotted outside the Monte Carlo Grand Hotel on a race weekend with another F1 road car. I suspect that this GTR could belong to Mansour Ojjeh, the President of the Tag/McLaren Group, and if I am correct it is probably the fourth car.

Beyond those four though, there are three other short tail GTRs that have been spotted wearing license plates too. Maybe these other cars were not converted by the factory so don't qualify as one of the four, or maybe they were converted later and the person listing that ad for #16R didn't know about them. Stories hardly ever add up so you have to look at the evidence and form your own conclusions sometimes - that's what keeps this fun because eventually the right answer will surface. Not to brag really, but so far my percentage on correct assumptions has been fairly good. Anyway, these three have still managed to wear a plate at some point so I will mention them here.

The first was GTR #12R which has been seen wearing UK plate "N753 HRV" at Goodwood and in some very old photos taken near LeMans when it also still had all of its sponsor decals.

Another is GTR #11R which was in Sweden for a long time after being auctioned by Sothebys in Monaco in 2000. The plate it has been seen wearing was "UAX 806" from Sweden. Strangely the two outings this car had at tracks in Europe didn't show it wearing any plate at all.

The final car of the trio is GTR #07R, owned for many years by Larry Kinch of Scotland. It wore plate "16 LK" when he owned it. At one point it was for sale and had a "4 EB" plate affixed which is something I would more likely expect to find on a Bugatti, and in fact I have some photos of an EB110 GT wearing that very same plate.

Another tangent to this whole story is that supposedly one of the 10 longtail GTRs has now recently been converted for road use. I haven't seen proof of that, but the source of the info is good. If it does prove to be true I suspect others may follow to make them more usable cars as well.

Here are images showing the plated GTRs we've identified in the order I listed above. Just to recap - #16R, #10R, #06R, and either #14R or #15R. Then #12R, #11R, and finally #07R. As you can see, three out of these seven are Papaya Orange, and GTR #16R has since been resprayed making for the 4th. The 5th orange GTR is suspected by me to be GTR #04R and was recently spotted in Bahrain at their new F1 circuit.

>8^)
ER
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How many longtails are in existance? I really like the look of them.

 

Easiest question so far.

10 longtail GTRs and three F1 GT longtail road cars were built.

>8^)
ER

 

GTR-016

slimline victorian plate, looks really good

 

I trust you'll be posting pictures of these? Or at the least, the road versions?