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Discussion in 'F1' started by TheMayor, May 15, 2020.
...which you can secure for a €300,000 ($336,589) premium over the car's MSRP.
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They don’t have an identity. When paying what these cars cost new, to survive the brand needs an identity. Sterile precision is Porsche’s thing and at a much lower price point that matches the brand cachet. Ferrari and Porsche and to a lesser extent Lamborghini cultivate a lifestyle with their brand. McLaren doesn’t... in my view McL expanded too fast without taking care to nurture the super car fundamentals. I wonder if all of those cars you saw were new or purchased used after swift and massive depreciation.
That's seriously hideous
I do find it amazing that Mclaren struggles to make money. All cars have the same basic engine, same chassis...all they do is rebody basically. And boy do they make a lot of them...seems like every other wednesday they release a ''new'' car!
I think it's their marketing strategy that is a fault for their financial woes, more than anything else.
They build cars in batches, and not on demand, to keep production costs down.
But they also keep releasing "new" models when the previous series hasn't been completely sold.
So they are left with depreciating stock, they surely have to rebate, making it difficult to promote the new ones.
Not only buyers lose money, but it must be a cashflow nightmare to keep the company running..
And therein lies the problem. The McLaren of the F1 (Gordon Murray et al) is not the McLaren of today. They’re trying too hard to compete with Ferrari and gain market share instead of just being themselves. They remind me of a kid in a new school trying to fit in so they’re trying to do everything like everyone else and its just not working out for them. I think McLaren missed a golden opportunity. You’re not going to out super or out exotic Lamborghini and Ferrari. Why not be a higher end lotus and compete on lightweight and dynamics. They already use cf tubs etc. Hell, McLaren and Lotus could’ve teamed up and produced a line of dynamically superior vehicles that didn’t chase numbers. I think they would be better served being slightly downmarket playing in the 200k USD and under arena.
The senna, the speed tail, the gt, the open roadster all are a big yawn. When I was at McLaren Philly, nothing made me dream. I go to Ferrari of Washington and boy do I dream. I see all of the F1 murals, the old cars the “lifestyle”. McLaren doesn’t have “it”.
As far as local purchases go, it appears the buyers, including the ones I know, are new to the supercar world. The McLaren line gives them instant access to purchase as opposed to other makers who have less inventory, control availability to preferred buyers or have a lineup that has a higher price point. McLaren always has inventory ready to go. Instant satisfaction. This just adds to the web of mystery leading to financial ills.
Still no covid specials on the 765LT though...so, I’m not convinced McLaren is struggling too badly?
Not to mention Fat Zaks payroll.
Bahrain Bank to save the day...
Wonder if they couldn’t finish to pay him and uncle Ron is behind all this
I never undersood why the other shareholders insisted in having Ron Dennis out of the company.
He had already resigned his CEO job, and had become a minor shareholder, so he had effectively lost his power base.
Insisting on buying him out was a mistake that put the group on shaky financial ground, IMO.
virtual now a Bahrain team
Far too much McLaren hatred on this forum. I am a very long time Ferrari owner(since 1974) and feel that Ferrari also now has too many cars and models. Many of the newer offerings are uninspiring to me and some are downright ugly. McLaren manufacturing quality and support network is poor but the cars are a blast to drive.
But Ferrari at least has variety in their models.
MR V8 sports car
FR V12 Sports car
FR V12 4 seater
MR V8 Hybrid hypercar (? At least I think it is, the SF90. Comparable to a 918 really and for good value).
FR V8 convertible
FR V8 coupe (the only unnecessary car in the line up).
Whereas mclaren has:
MR V8 in 5 slightly different bodies. Same chassis, same engine in different tunes.
MR V8 Hyper car thing that looks...just hideous. Same engine as the others
MR V8 hybrids x2 Same engine as the others, both hideous.
Not counting spider variants or ''track'' variants for either manufacturer.
I don't hate Mclaren, far from it actually. I just find their current line up of cars...uninspiring. 675LT, P1 and their 600 LT are brilliant cars.
I love the Mclaren team as well. I used to hate them when I was younger as they where the team beating Ferrari, but when I saw the respect between Schumacher and Mika my hate started to go...and then they hired Kimi and later button!
I think their automotive side is rightly criticized
I think the cars are great, and McLaren has created its own style
Apart that I don't like the doors, I would prefer a McLaren 720S over a Ferrari 488.
You could say the same about Porsche and its never-ending declinations over the 911 theme, but people like that after almost 50 years!
A bit different in my eyes. Porsche still calls them 911, not a different model name. They're much like trim levels.
Why do you say it's "McLaren hatred"? Even taking into account that this is a Ferrari forum I think McLaren is recognized among us as a historic and formerly highly successful company. It's just too bad about the "formerly" part, that's all.
Well, in their catalogue, Porsche has the Carrera, the Carrera 4, the Carrera S, the Carrera 4S, the Turbo S, the GT3 RS and the GT2.
Then you have the Carrera cabriolet, the Carrera 4 cabriolet, the Carrera S Cabriolet and the Carrera 4S cabriolet.
The Targa is declined as Targa, Targa 4, Targa 4S and Targa 4s Heritage.
There is also the Speedster, etc ....
Trim levels? Some are 2-wheel drive, some 4-wheel drive, some have turbo, some have not, etc ...
Well, objectively speaking, Ferrari is in the “formerly” category too, 12 years of losing is no small lapse of time...
I don't think they are finished yet, and I presume they could attract investors to rescue the company if they were going under.
It's just that their present marketing format is wrong: you don't over-produce luxury cars to store them.
That devalues your product, and I think they are suffering from that.
You forget that it has ''911'' in front of all those designations. So yes, they are trim levels.
I prefer what Mclaren does that remaking the 911 of the 60s over and over again. Even their other cars look like a 911, I have real trouble to differentiate them seen from the front or the back. Porsche has not their own style anymore: the 911 has.
I think that McLaren is getting into the groove despite some faux passes (Senna, ahem, but that BC03 looks cool in my book). And yes, they're in trouble now, but who isn't?