You have to hand it to him - in the face of irrefutable evidence that is contrary to what he is written he will always have a comeback. In fact "he" might actually be a "she" - that's clearly the arguing style of a woman. [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4f_oxZqD6wQ[/ame] >8^) ER
In reference to ginge, it was once very well expressed by the great George Carlin, "Never argue with an idiot. They will only bring you down to their level and beat you with experience." Not that you're such a dipstick ginge, but it does beg the question of why you cannot see the light. As a last intent to see if you're all there in mind and body, could you please offer your wisdom as to the reason why Ferrari does not use an alloy "tub" for the exquisite LaFerrari please? Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
No dismissive tone meant, sorry if it came across that way. If I may: 1. Unbalanced? Very interesting, I've never heard a car described that way (except when Nadar killed the Corvair). In what way do you see this car unbalanced? 2. Unattractive? Yes, I agree with you. Camouflaged and disguised prototypes never tend to look attractive, I hope they make it more attractive under that horrible costume. 3. Too many themes in one design? Again, I agree with you. I doubt their style team has the competence to be original thinkers. To date none of their Mclaren designs have any originality, I think they all look like rehashes of existing competitor brands, e.g. their 12c/650 ripped off Noble, their p1 ripped off the Zonda and their 570 ripped off something else, I just can't put my finger on which car it is, but I can really sense it. 4. 14 should've been fabulous and exciting design? Agreed, I too am so disappointed. I just cannot see this car sitting on a show stand during its launch and turning any heads in admiration. Mclaren has really shot themselves in the head, and foot, with this one. I take back my earlier comment, perhaps if they would have had an outside opinion like yours while they stylised this car, they wouldn't have ended up with such a disastrous mess. Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Your feelings are hurt, as are those of a few of the regular fanboys and thus the personal insults have begun. I get it. However, it doesn't change what is common knowledge and well reported, even from the company themselves. They developed a single tub and a single engine that has been used throughout their current models. You can attempt to split hairs all you like but ultimately that is a fact that the company acknowledge themselves. Perhaps someday their model range will extend beyond that single tub and engine but it certainly hasn't yet and there are not enough petty insults in the world that you can send my way that is going to change that. Kisses.
Ginge, you really are kidding, right? NOBODY can be that consistently ludicrous and naive. My gosh, snap out of it man! Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Wow, that's saying a lot considering the cars you've driven. (Is the incredible P1 too thrilling for all around use? Better for track days?)
This issue of single engine, single tub, doesn't just apply to McLaren. Aston have been criticised for it for quite a while. Their VH platform covered the whole range of their cars from 2003 until 2016, when the new DB11 was launched with a completely new platform. Yes, of course it was modified during the period, but the basic criticism was that the platform went on too long and cars billed as new were not able to take advantage of new technology because of the limitations of the old platform, so not really 'new' at all. Not my opinion but repeated criticisms in the press and on forums. Porsche with their 911 have tended to evade these criticisms (and have often been used in forum disagreements as a justification for Aston's approach). I suppose this is because the 911 idea, with rear engine etc., is a sort of unique, and quite retro-feeling thing and the appeal of the product lends itself to a long-serving platform strategy. Since the increase of developmental pace for safety advancements and airbags etc. the replacement pace of the 911's platform has increased - 996 and 997 lasted about 10 years, 991 is about 4 years old so far (from memory), whereas the original platform was good for about 30 years. Lamborghini and Ferrari never receive this criticism. Possibly because they have a V8 and V12 (against McLarens V8 only), although Aston have a V8 and a V12. Perhaps crucially the Aston used the same platform for both engine variants, which neither Ferrari nor Lamborghini do. This may be the difference. So, to me it is irrefutable that McLaren use a version of their platform (not identical but still 'a version of') for all their cars, and only one engine block. Ferrari and Lambo use two. If you only want to buy a mid V8 car, why is that an issue? I think it makes sense and should not automatically be a reason for criticism. If they don't change their platform for a long time, that might become an issue because I suspect the appeal of McLaren will not afford them the same luxury as Porsche has in terms of being able to use careful evolution. Maybe people will expect the pace of McLaren technology development to be ahead of Porsche. We'll see.
I wouldn't use the world 'tiny'. Certainly they are not as big as Ferrari, but they are not tiny like the prestigious Pagani. If the carbon tub is close to perfect why make big changes? Just small modifications will do. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login
Come on, dude. Explain what I brought up. Tell me about the engines in LF/FF/F12/Lusso/TDF, and the engines in 488/Cali T. No comment on them using the SAME engine or would you just rather ignore it since you don't have a response?
Why would it ever be considered insulting to mention someone's obvious patterns of behavior, exhibited prominently in this thread and so many others? Anyway, I believe in calling a spade, a spade. >8^) ER Image Unavailable, Please Login
P1 is a mental car. I drive mine a lot, tracked it several times, have almost 5000 miles on it now. Its definitely the fastest, but I dont need it all the time. 675 is a good balance, more storage for road trips and is pretty darn quick as well.
Yes, the 675 did seem very well balanced even while moving a little bit sideways down the road. If I had a P1 I would reserve it for eventful driving, even though daily use has been proven not to be impossible. Meet The Hero Who Commutes to Work in His McLaren P1 >8^) ER
I was honest about what is beneath any current Mclaren, just like I was honest about your motivations for spamming car forums with pro-Mclaren posts. Remember? You accept gifts from the company and confessed to wanting employment with them. A spade indeed. And I called you on it quite some time ago.
So you were wrong about the motivations behind my posts, and therefore you are wrong about what's underneath any current McLaren. Got it! >8^) ER
Sorry to burst everyones deep think tank, but this is actually a Canadian supercar from 2010. The OP photo is one of their matte grey ones. Image Unavailable, Please Login
Sorry to blast your opinion out of the water, but that's not even close. Image Unavailable, Please Login Fun fact: The Plethore did feature a McLaren-inspired three-seat cockpit layout with the driver situated in the center. >8^) ER
Well, there have been a significant number of ignorant posts made by the typical McLaren-haters which needed to be countered by knowledgeable individuals. I could write ginge's irresistible an predicable reply... >8^) ER
AM is criticized not because the general chassis or engine is reused, it's because their performance is never even close to the competition for the price, and on top of that, they don't update the interior enough. No one cares what you use so long as it's awesome. No one will criticise Ferrari for sticking as V8 in a LF chassis, or V12 in a 488. This is not the same as McLaren because McLaren is top of the food chain in performance. Their base chassis and engine, unlike AM, is really good still and always has been. The tub, old or not, is arguably still the best in the entire industry as evident by their Spider performance. You can't compare that to Ferrari because McLaren make only one type of car. If they made a 4 seater convertible like the Cali T, theyd be the same as Ferrari -- using the same 3.8l block, but obviously a different tub/chassis because no tubs they have accommodate 4 seats in front engine form. You can't hold it against McLaren just because they don't make all these different types of cars.
What you mean is there is a significant number of posts from 3 Mac fan boys. I am not a hater. But their cars are starting to look too similar. I wish they would stretch their creativity farther. Shoot me.
Y BTW if you go to he official McLaren site they list 10 different models, ie: 570S, 570GT, 540C, 675LT Spider, 675LT, 650S, 650S Coupe, 650S Can Am Spider, P1 GTR and P1. But yeah I admit I'm not the most knowledgeable, but I'll take my facts directly from McLaren thanks ... and I do know that every few months McLaren are releasing a new model. Maybe it's just a sub model but it's still a new model and IMO it is not required. Pete
