Mercedes to Quit if V8's Return

But you then face the exact same problem as we have now.

You will have teams spending £30m a year 'bringing what they want' to race and manufacturers spending £200m+ to do the exact same.

The result will be the same no matter what they bring. It will go the way of Can AM.

 

IMO Turbo V6 formula is just fine All they need to do is add some noise to the engines

 

Limiting the flow rare makes more sense than limiting the fuel quantity.

 

I think you are right; if complete design freedom was given to engineers, they would end up choosingthe 4-in-line in F1.

That is because the 4-in-line turbo is probably the best solution; the cheapest to build, the lightest, the easiest to package, the most fuel efficient, etc...
You could have it lay-down, or transversal, etc...

Maybe some would stick to V8 or V10, but that would be mostly for marketing reasons.

 

Yes, but also the decisions taken by the engineers can be "influenced" by a careful writting of the rules. Maybe a 4-in-line is good for the current formula, but if they allowed for bigger displacement and higher rev limits they would be forcing the engineers to build something with more cylinders.

My point against the "let them do whatever they want" approach is that, as everybody is looking for perfection, at some moment everybody would be building similar cars, just like now but with an extremely expensive trial and error phase before that.

The Le Mans type of rule book, with different formulas and complex balance of perfomance between them would be another option. But if Formula 1 is a very political game now, just imagine what would happen with a constant back and forth between teams to alter the balance.

So, I think that the times of variety of designs in Formula 1 are gone.

 

Back in the thirties they switched formulae in an effort to derail the Mercedes juggernaut.
Didn't work.

 

That´s a different matter. Manufacturers are not asking for a change in the formula. They´re asking for a defreezing.

The one asking for a change is Bernie and some fans who don´t like the sound.

 

Both are being discussed. Neither is a good option at this point.

 

Personally I do not regard them as the bad guy: I simply see them as one of the last ones to join the F1 fray and because of that they should not start dictating what the future should or should not be.
I am happy for them if they are successful, but they should not forget other teams have been at F1 longer and have been immensely more successful than MB.
So it would be wiser for them to enjoy the success and keep a low profile, just to make sure it is not an anomaly.

 

Please explain why?

 

Were F1 a sport and not a business you might have a case.

Being able to advertise a world championship internationally outweighs any ill will among F1 fans.

 

Agree.

But the key words are "at this point". If teams don't manage to put a fight to Mercedes in 2015 with half engine frozen, they won't do it either in 2016 and 2017 with more restrictions. Also I take for granted that special dispensations will be needed for those that fell behind like Renault in the V8 era.

The biggest concern is if Mercedes just wants to rip the results for 3 or 4 years and then quit while they are at the top. In that case they won't care if they leave a desolated wasteland behind them. I hope that they will be smart enough to not milk the cow too much, but who knows: executives don't give a dang about sport and Lauda always has been a bastard.

 

Memories are short here...

The rules were changed to a V6 because of Ferrari

 

Mercedes also wanted V6.

Only Renault and VW (the eternal promise of F1) wanted 4 in line.

 

Because limiting the fuel quantity bring "economy runs", where drivers have constantly to monitor their fuel consumption to finish the race.
Every time they put their foot down, they use more fuel, and in the end, races are decided by tacticians from the pits coaching their drivers to reach the checkered flag.


By imposing a fuel flow instead, you in fact limit the power for any given engine, but not limiting its use.

A formula based on fuel flow would force engine designers to build more fuel efficient units.

One can even imagine a fuel flow formula based on calories, that would allow different fuels to be used: petrol, diesel, kerosene alcohol, etc... all based on the calorific value of the fuel.
That's very far from the specs formula that F1 is heading for now.

 

Some memories are short and some are wrong.

Ferrari were ok with the 4 pot with no additional hybrid.

Merc subsequently confirmed their position was to walk if they didn't get the donk they wanted.

Merc got exactly what they wanted, which clearly the fan doesn't like.

 

Imposing an engine configuration is anathema to me.

Let's the engineers decide what's best for them.

We had 4, 6, 8, 10, 12 and 16 cylinders at one time.

There is nothing wrong with them competing against each others.

 

Have the teams switch back to the 2005 V10s. Honda wouldn't have to redesign anything as they still have their old stuff. Same for MB, Ferrari, Renault, heck even BMW and Toyota could join the fun of an engine supplier. At least we'd have sound again and 800hp+. Then they could decide if they want to develop from there. Let's just pretend the V8s and V6s didn't happen imo.

 

So he's saying he doesn't want the engines to be any Lauda than the new ones?

Niki Quieta?

 

I realize I'm in the minority here, but why should they stay? They've made (and proven) their point. And the instability of the technical regulations will eventually kill F1. This would be a self-inflicted wound for F1.

 

The current regs are infinitely more interesting than the development frozen, rpm limited v8's they replaced from an engineering perspective. Going back to the lower tech, less powerful, fuel guzzling v8's just for some noise would be a colossal mistake.

More power=better motor. More noise is maybe a nice to have, but as a racer, if you put two race cars in front of me and one makes 5hp more than the other, I could give 2 ****s how much noise it makes.

 

... new number 1 rule in F1: what Daimler-Mercedes wants, Daimler-Mercedes gets; what Torger Wolff wants, Torger gets. And, what Torger Wolff wants most of all is, Bernie Ecclestone's perch on F1's totem pole.

Ecclestone's days are numbered...

That Daimler-Mercedes indirectly exerts control over 30% of FiA's F1 super-licenses, over 44% of Ecclestone's paddock, over 25% of FiA's F1 press credentials, and over 70% of the top 10 slots on Ecclestone's grid? Any threat leveled by Daimler-Mercedes must be perceived a credible one.

In 2015, will the aforementioned concentrations only intensify.

The English no longer control F1. From here on out, it's the Germans calling the shots. And, these are people who don't dillydally. These are people who mean business; these are people who get what they want, save who may. Pulling strings behind the scenes, it was only by a hare's breath Zetche, Wolff and Lauda all but had Ecclestone -- jailed.

Didn't they?

From here on out, you know the drill. When Daimler-Mercedes barks orders, to jump? All in F1 must now reply, "... how high?" Anybody gets in their way, at their peril. Daimler-Mercedes trampled over poor Ferrari, like a doormat - asj.

 

So you want to remove driver tactics?

If F1 is about efficiency then its probably somewhere behind stage1 of a Saturn 5.

 

Don't let the door hit you on the way out Merc