Merged: 0117 S - This Week's Barn Find

Wonderful find! I think it may take a few miles to work out those flatspots though!

Thanks for sharing the details with us. (and hey, I like it as the coupe, too).

 

Mr. Massini - I too am curious as to how these cars end up in a barn/garage/etc. for 30/50 years, seemingly untouched/unloved for the whole time. When you find such an example, and help to move it on to another caretaker, do you usually/ever learn the story that explains the long sleep? To know that would be as interesting (more) as the photos.....
Can you enlighten us?

TIA,
James

 

Ferrari did in fact body several cars themselves in 1947 through to 1953. Most were pretty ugly. I do not at the moment recall which ones, but have records on at least five different cars that had in-house coachwork. Marcel probably knows them from memory.

As for 0117, the car has been with us for quite awhile and will be sold exactly as found untouched straight out of storage.

One comment after going over the car in detail repeatedly is that the body was likely fitted initially to either a 750 Monza or 500 Mondial and was later re-cycled for this car rather than built from scratch.

There are far too many previous clues to a later style chassis having once worn this car and what ever it was most certainly had both a trans-axle and a dry sump engine. Leaving only Scagietti Bodied Mondials, 250 and 750 Monzas as well as 118 and 121LM as possible donors.

The body fits a long chassis so the possibility of a 118 / 121LM seems quite plausible...

It will take some more digging but I was always curious what happened to two very famous 750 Monzas and the test only / never raced 118LM that were scrapped by Ferrari in period with the various parts showing up on other cars...

Anyone care to dig a little deeper ?

Could solve one or more existing mysteries....

Anyone who wishes to drop by before we ship it to Monterey is welcome to take a peak and explore for themselves.

Cheers,

Bill Noon

 

Great story!!! This section of F-chat is becoming my favorite with every day that goes by. Keep us posted!

 

Bill,

I believe 0264M & 0272M were 2 -

Argento

 

Here's the scoop for those who, like me, didn't catch this story:


MASERATIS MELTED DOWN: A SHATTERING EXAMPLE OF ITALIAN JUSTICE

By order of an Italian Court, two reconstructed Maserati sports-racing cars from the 1950s - an A6GCS and a 350S – have been delivered by the Police to a local scrapyard to be crushed into cubes for recycling.

No, this is not a joke.

It happened on March 22nd 2006 in obedience to a Court order made in Ferrara, Italy. Furthermore, in full execution of that order, the two cubes were then melted in a foundry furnace; just to be on the safe side and because, as we all know, fire is the safest way to deal with sin.

This story began six years ago with a police operation which was carried out simultaneously in 17 different locations, including restorers, body shops, and private garages and houses. The whole operation was launched after months of intelligence investigation, ’phone tapping, etc. (more or less the sort of effort which might have been better justified if cracking down on the Medellin Cartel).

Let me just add that – at least in this case – there was no fraud or malicious representation involved and that this Operation was not provoked by any automobile manufacturer.

In fact, it seems that Maserati – one of the 17 locations raided that morning – was particularly excited by the Police’s unexpected visit to inspect the activities of the Registro Maserati, located in Via Ciro Menotti 322, Modena.

It would be interesting to discuss this judicial initiative of six years ago and its possible consequences, but right now we can only add that no significant penal consequence has been produced (or probably will ever result) from these investigations. On the other hand, nobody will even know what the final cost will be for the Italian taxpayer, or whether any other criminal-policy priorities might have been better tackled with that kind of effort.

What is abundantly relevant is that the Italian Judges tend now to interpret the existing legal provisions for Brand Protection in the sense that a copy of a classic automobile could potentially be an infringement of that Code.

Therefore, while the replica business is booming world-wide, this activity – and I mean bona fide activity – can be persecuted in Italy even to the extent of confiscation – and destruction! - of the reproduced car.

This kind of reasoning leads to regarding such replicas in exactly the same manner as the law regards the thousand of Louis Vuitton fake purses sold daily by hordes of immigrants on all the squares and the beaches of the western world.

Returning to the events of March 22nd, I must add that a lack of formal communication of the order of the Court left it impossible for the cars’ owner to present any legal defence which might have prevent their destruction.

This is an unfortunate circumstance (leaving the door open for further litigation for damages against the Judicial Administration), but here I will concentrate upon the general issue.

Personally, I know no detail concerning the A6GCS involved in this case, but I do know of the 350S which had been reconstructed by Maurizio Grazzi of Ferrara.

I have no evidence to support his claim of originality for his chassis – apparently found in Modena – but I know that the aluminium body of that car had been correctly made by a well-known body specialist, Elis Garuti, of Rubiera. Of greater concern, Mr. Grazzi had patiently collected ORIGINAL major and minor components for this car with fastidious perseverance.

The ORIGINAL engine came from the Orsi firm (former owners of the Maserati company), the transaxle from the Parravano/Sorrell parts collection via David Cottingham in the UK. Suspensions, brakes, wheels, tanks, steering and several other components employed in the car’s re-assembly were all original.

We may still accept that an ensemble of original factory-made, in-period components does not create an original car.

Of course this I accept, but in any case the seizure would have been probably sufficient to enact the law.

While awaiting further investigation and verification, confiscation of the car would have been more than sufficient, perhaps making an order to entrust the car to a Museum, a University or to any other Public Institution as a “didactic copy”.

In fact, only three original Maserati 350S dry-sump sports-racing car engines were made by the Factory in period.

If I recall correctly, one was broken on the test bench while being run by Ermanno Cozza – now in charge of the Maserati archives (and he still shows the pain of this memory whenever he recalls that episode).

One of the other two original 350S engines is in the USA, installed in chassis number 3502 … and the third was in Grazzi’s now destroyed car.

Nice shot! One of the only two surviving genuine Maserati-made engines of this historic type has been obliterated by the machinations of the Italian legal system - the only one which had survived at all this side of the Ocean.

Using laws more apt to deal with tons of fake Chinese watches, the Judges have ensured there might be no further possibility of seeing a rare set of mechanical parts of high technical and historical significance.

Well done!

Let me add that the man in charge of the crushing machine not only refused to operate it but in fact left his workplace, leaving one of his young assistants to do the job. I guess he might be still asking if some common sense is left anywhere in ‘modern Italy’.

While this happens in Italy, at International level a car with supposed identity 3503 is offered for sale as the real thing, having presumably a Maserati 3500GT shortened chassis, in left-hand-drive form, and only vaguely resembling the original car.

I do not intend to add any further comment.

I can only be troubled by the opinion of Italian justice that enthusiasts, historians and car collectors world-wide might now form. I am afraid not a good one. And let me add that it is with a strong sense of bitterness that I am broadcasting this sad and foolish story.

Franco Lombardi

 

The above story is appalling. I thought we only did stupid court ordered stuff in the US. What a travesty.

My regrets to the owner of what were probably outstanding automobiles.

Now, back to the story. Hey Marcel or Bill, any shots of the engine compartment?

cheers

Ken

 

I agree, it's my first stop here now...beats the hell out of P & R, which I no longer visit.

Thanks to Marcel for getting this going.

 

I believe the owner is in the process of suing various people over the destruction of the cars and the

 

hi i have voiced my opinion on the subject of certificates of authenticity or origin and this seems to be a case where, if a cirtificate was held by maseratti or the official maseratti owners club or whome ever, clearly detailing what these cars were from their origines to today, ownership and value could be established and these cars collected for what the are. i keep comparing this to the world of fine arts[ painting sculpture etc] where objects are judged by recognised experts and records are held largely my museums[ instead of factories which would be the case with cars. if the factory still existed[ferrari now has a devision devoted to is historic cars] jaguar bentley/rolls aston etc could do the same.
. . here is an idea. where no real factory exists[ bugatti, packard etc] the car museums could get into the act. there is a lot of money is restorations today and a major museum certificate would certainly count for something. with the money being what it is now the colleator car industry is going thru some real growing pains. what do you think. see my certificate of authenticity post and lets hear your ideas. maybe we can help give this some direction which it badly needs. tongascrew george

 

marcel, i know you are an authority here. i made this post to offer a plan ,which you would certainly be a part of, which could be used to help establish the pecking order of where 117 stands in the history of ferrar cars. there is so much petty bickering going on when an issue of authenticity like this comes up. here is another idea. you and the other pundits get together and come up with a plan for judging and establishing authenticity and submit it to P.F. there will always be controvercy[it is part of life] but it would help bring some sanity to the proceeding. more of the P3,4,5 opinions and the memory chip is going tu cry uncle. just one man's opinion. tongascrew george

 

Here are some more photos after going over the car in detail.

Pretty sure the body is off of one of the 118/121LMs do to the clear indication of a trans-axle, dry-sump engine and long wheel-base.

Cheers,

Bill Noon
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love stuff like this, thanks for taking the time to share this with the rest of us !

 

Current engine was sourced from s/n 4063 with numero interno 680/62E. This was a 250 GT 2+2.
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4063 in LA with Cadillac powertrain. For sale in Ca, (Jan 93 FML).
In LA April 91 silver with tobacco int. Ref L.A. Times ad: "250GTE v-8 conversion needs restoration."
Ex Peter Helldin, Marina del Ray.
Ex Eric Vutborg, Huntington Beach, Ca.
May 90 Body interior, drivetrain for sale $55,000. Ref June 90 Hemmings ad says "Southern Ca. car."
Aug 89 Reported to be in LA shop and for sale for $3000. According to Peter Helldin "Car is complete (?!), has GTO front clip, Cadillac engine and a hood scoop. Hood scoop seems orginal. Car was left at shop and shop owner willing to sell for unpaid work."

4063 Engine In Ca. 1989, reported in a Monza replica and for sale in 1991. Ref Jan93 FML.

Yale

 

Is the chassis the only part of 0117/S left with the car? (Great find)

 

Whoever mounted the electric fuel pump sideways doesn't have a clue about how they work. There is a reason the cap says "Alto" on it.

Brian

 

Bill / Marcel,

Is the steering column and wheel from the GTE as well? Thus far, in my eyes, 117S is as original as Tom S.'s 202A. Mind you, the body may actually be more interesting and historically significant than the chassis.


Regards,

Art S.

 

What I can tell from looking at the car is the entire frame, front and rear suspension as well as axle, brakes, hubs, splines etc... are 2nd generation Ferrari components. Basically the frame is pure GILCO and the rest all early Ferrari bits and pieces, Engine, gearbox from the GTE.

The body however was at least built and I believe probably first fitted to a long-wheel base, dry sump, transaxle, de-Dion sports racer. This is based on dry-sump tank body mounts as well as external oil fill that is now covered over as well as rear transaxle/de-Dion attachment points on the current body.

I have traded two of the original 121LMs and the same features are found on those cars that appear on the body of this car.

Mind you, that the body of this car has plenty of scars and lots of rework after the fact but the heart of it as well as all original aluminum panels that are there date from 1954-55 time frame.

Cheers,

Bill Noon

 

Interesting! Are all 118/121 LMs accounted for and do they have their original bodies? Any decision yet on how to restore 0117 S? Back to Moto body?

Best, Peter